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Elton John Album Discussion Thread

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Offline metaldams

      OK, so I gave TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION a listen.  First off, I can totally understand why Elton doesn’t play most of these songs live.  He has a huge catalog and has a ton of hits.  As much as I complain about Black Sabbath and PARANOID, Sabbath were not really a hits oriented band beyond that.  So because Elton has all these hits, I can imagine Elton attracting all these extremely casual fans, the type who watch American Idol to discover new artists (my Mom is in that category, I had to explain to her who Steven Tyler was when he was a judge on that show).  All those normies buying Elton tickets and Elton only has two hours with songs to pick from thirty plus albums.  Of course he plays the hits.  Yeah, you hardcore Elton fans who rightly know Elton is deeper and better than that, I can truly imagine the lack of hearing these songs live driving you mad.

      This definitely is a rootsier album in parts and at least on side one, had really big production.  With this style of music, the more low key it is, the more immediate for me.  I appreciate NASHVILLE SKYLINE from Dylan because it was recorded in two minutes.  With The Stones, STICKY FINGERS was more immediate to me than EXILE ON MAIN STREET.  I can see parallels again with that latter album and this album - roots oriented Americana with really big production.  Lots of gospel, really big and loud arrangements.  I now love EXILE ON MAIN STREET, but it took me a while.  I could picture the same thing happening with TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION if I took a year long deep dive into classic Elton - which I just might do.

      Here’s another thing I noticed.  That big production I talked about?  I noticed as we get to side two of the album, things get sparser and that grabbed me more on first listen.  Though not written by Elton, I thought “Love Song” was beautiful.  Sparse arrangements and effective and simple two part vocal harmonies.  “Where to Now St. Peter?” is indeed a strong album side opener and Burn Down the Mission” is an appropriate closer.  “Talking Old Soldiers?”  Beautiful and personable.  The flow of the album is start with a bunch of big arrangements, take it down a notch on side two and then end with the big finale where the rhythm really pucks up.  Album construction like that is a lost art form these days.

      So yeah, upon immediate listen, the second half grabbed me more, but again, I can see this album being a grower.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline metaldams

….and a question.  Will you be doing the live album?  Either way, I’ll give it a listen.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Umbrella Sam

….and a question.  Will you be doing the live album?  Either way, I’ll give it a listen.

It’s up to you guys. Originally I was planning to move on to MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER and briefly mention my favorite tracks from FRIENDS and 17-11-70, but I would be up for doing a whole post dedicated to 17-11-70, and I could even kind of work FRIENDS in there since one of the tracks played at the show was from that (FRIENDS wouldn’t get its own post since they only really wrote five songs for it and I refuse to see the supposedly awful movie it was associated with). Let me know what you guys want to do.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline metaldams

It’s up to you guys. Originally I was planning to move on to MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER and briefly mention my favorite tracks from FRIENDS and 17-11-70, but I would be up for doing a whole post dedicated to 17-11-70, and I could even kind of work FRIENDS in there since one of the tracks played at the show was from that (FRIENDS wouldn’t get its own post since they only really wrote five songs for it and I refuse to see the supposedly awful movie it was associated with). Let me know what you guys want to do.

You’re the emcee and Elton expert so you present it relative to how important you think it is to the story.

With Sabbath, their first official live album wasn’t until 1982,  so I’m just thinking of mentioning it with the studio album they toured for and how it fits into the story (and fits into the story it does).

With Zeppelin, I think I’m giving Song Remains the Same it’s own entry because it has such a huge cult following.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Umbrella Sam

You’re the emcee and Elton expert so you present it relative to how important you think it is to the story.

With Sabbath, their first official live album wasn’t until 1982,  so I’m just thinking of mentioning it with the studio album they toured for and how it fits into the story (and fits into the story it does).

With Zeppelin, I think I’m giving Song Remains the Same it’s own entry because it has such a huge cult following.

Good point. I do think 17-11-70 is an important part of the Elton John story, so it’s settled. We will cover that next.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline Umbrella Sam



It cannot be said enough how important Elton John’s first U.S. tour was. While ELTON JOHN did sell better than EMPTY SKY even before then, it still wasn’t doing great at first and it wasn’t until after coming to America that the album sales really started to pick up, and it all started with the famous Troubadour shows in August 1970. In terms of recordings, only one promo film of Sixty Years On” is known to exist from any of the Troubadour shows.

Fast forward a few months, specifically to the date of November 17, 1970. Elton was in New York and would perform at the Fillmore East a few days later, opening for Leon Russell. On this specific day, though, he was at Phil Ramone’s recording studio, A&R Studios, performing his live act for a radio broadcast. The response was…well, fantastic judging from the crowd reaction in the studio! So fantastic that bootlegs of the broadcast began circulating. It’s been said that the live album was only released to fight bootlegs, which never made a ton of sense to me. If you weren’t planning to release it regardless, why would you want to suddenly cut into a market where sales would already not be as high, especially since they only picked specific tracks and not the full show.

Regardless, 17-11-70 became Elton’s first live album, and what a great live album it was. I decided this was important enough to be given its own discussion because, really, it shows the side of Elton that wasn’t on the records, the side that truly made Elton famous in the first place.

The band consisted of Elton, Dee Murray on bass, and Nigel Olsson on drums. Yes, you read that right. Even though he used guitarists on his recordings, the Elton John Band for this first tour did not have one. I love the guitar work on many of Elton’s songs, but this shows that Elton really didn’t need one in those early days. The three of them were such a unit that they could create an exciting, full sound with just the three of them.

The original record starts with “Take Me to the Pilot”, itself already an upbeat song. But here, the groove at the end is so much cooler. Dee actually gets bass solos, which is not something that’s common in Elton recordings. Dee was a very melodic bassist. He especially had to be here because a lot of these songs were lacking the orchestral arrangements and he had to fill in that sound.

We’ve spoken so much of the Rolling Stones and Elton connections in this thread that it should come as no surprise by this point that Elton and the band performed “Honky Tonk Women” at these early live shows. This one shows off the band’s fantastic vocal harmonies throughout the choruses; again, a reminder that only three people are on stage and not only do they play great together, but they can also sing well together at the same time. They didn’t even need additional backing vocalists!

I’ve spoken about this version of “Sixty Years On” a few times in this thread. As you guys know, I can’t stand the album version and for a while I did think the song itself was the problem, but when I heard this version, I realized that it truly was a great song. Quiet and piano focused in the verses, but with instrumental sections that are much more rock focused with Elton and Dee’s chords and Nigel really pounding the drums hard, it manages to sound so much more complex and thought-provoking this way than with the rambling orchestrations of the album that make me want to press skip.

“Can I Put You On” is a song we have not talked about yet. It comes from FRIENDS:



No, not that FRIENDS. Before going to America, Elton and Bernie accepted an offer to write songs for the Lewis Gilbert movie, FRIENDS. I’ve never seen the film and don’t plan on it, as it’s apparently really bad and creepy (I’ve heard Bernie only skimmed through the script). But I have heard the soundtrack, which much like the Beatles and YELLOW SUBMARINE consisted of only a few new songs and the rest was the Paul Buckmaster film score. Of the five Elton songs, I like all of them except “Seasons”, with “Can I Put You On” and “Michelle’s Song” being the standouts. On the album, “Can I Put You On” is structured in a way that the main body of the song finishes fairly early and they jam until the fade-out. And this version pretty much follows the same principle, only minus the backing vocalists and Caleb’s guitar part. And, once again, they manage to keep it going in a way that it’s always interesting and properly balanced between the three of them. A very underrated song in the Elton catalog in both versions.

Side 2 only has 2 songs, the first being “Bad Side of the Moon”. Much like “Sixty Years On”, it’s become almost like a completely different song here, and in this case I actually like the original. This one’s still cool, too, once again with Nigel really pounding the drums hard and Elton applying a rougher vocal style that makes it sound especially cool.

And finally we have the Burn Down the Mission medley, which starts with the Tumbleweed finale and transitions multiple times to the point that they’re also performing “My Baby Left Me” and “Get Back”. This is the reason Side 2 only has two songs. This finale lasts 18 minutes, but because of the way the song is structured, it works. It’s not just Elton and the band repeating the same things over and over again; because of the structure of the song, they’re able to branch out into multiple styles from blues to jazz. It’s such an epic finale and you can tell from the crowd response that they just ate it all up. What a fantastic way to end the album.

And that’s the original 17-11-70. As I mentioned earlier, this was not the whole show fit on to the album. For the CD remaster in the 1990s, “Amoreena” was added as a bonus track. It’s a decent performance, but kind of plays similarly to the album version without Caleb or Elton’s organ playing, and of course that makes sense considering Dee and Nigel are on the original recording. The rest of the songs were included on a Record Store Day only release called 17-11-70+. “Country Comfort” is kind of an average performance, but otherwise, the rest of it is also pretty good, although I can see why they made the track selection that they did. They were trying to show the heavier rock side of Elton and most of these remaining tracks were ballads or lighter songs, including the future MADMAN track “Indian Sunset”. The only track I could see them include on the original and have the same impact is “Border Song”. Regardless, the album is truly wonderful, one of my absolute favorite Elton albums. Elton’s still a great live act, but for a different reason: he has so many hits to choose from that he can practically just fill an entire setlist full of them, and we’ll still enjoy it. But this was the side of Elton that had something to prove, someone who didn’t have hits and needed to show why he was significant. 17-11-70 is like a historical record in that regard, presenting us with a determined rock-and-roller who was indeed significant.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline metaldams

I’m hanging out with a friend tomorrow and one of the things we do is make a big playlist of music to listen to.  I am including this album and will comment on it on Sunday.  On paper, this sounds really intriguing.  Just Elton and some bass and drums playing some good songs.  More stripped down and I can’t wait to hear these guys work together.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline HomokHarcos

I'll probably also be giving my thoughts and listening to this on Sunday.


Offline HomokHarcos

I think the songs here are more enjoyable than the studio releases. The piano playing is great, with boogie woogie style in "Take Me to the Pilot." Elton's vocals were also good. Most of the time I've seen a band play live you can barely hear the vocalist and it sounds much different from what you usually hear on the album, not here. Elton John's vocals were almost like listening to the original studio release. The bass playing was probably the biggest revelation for me hearing 17-11-70. I noticed it throughout the album and really liked the style that was used.

I admit I was not too sure I'd like Burn Down the Mission when I saw how long the live performance was, it turned out to actually be really good. I liked that it transitioned into an instrumental jam session, I didn't get sick of it at all.

A good listen overall, not a single weak track on the album.


Offline metaldams

They were trying to show the heavier rock side of Elton

A six song single live LP trying to show the heavier side of the band.  Exactly like LIVE AT LEEDS from The Who.  After the big studio production of TOMMY, The ‘orrible ‘oo’s live album definitely was a much heavier effort and initially edited down from a larger concert to be as such.  It was also remixed in the 90’s with a different track listing and some added songs and then even later released with the complete show.  I read the Wikipedia page on 17-11-70 with the complicated release history then this above comment and thought I’ve heard this story before.

Much like The Who document, this is unquestionably a different side to Elton and I’m really glad this was released.  The most immediate of the albums for me I’ve heard so far.  I was able to hunt down the original mix and track listing from a vinyl rip uploaded on YouTube.

It was indeed great just being able to hear the band and focus on individual performances.  While I enjoyed the studio version of “Sixty Years On,” I can understand Sam’s preference for this live version.  Elton’s playing in and of itself is pretty orchestrated and is great to hear.  I was really impressed listening to his piano throughout but especially in this track.

With “Honky Tonk Woman,” I love the a cappella harmonies in the beginning and the laughter of the small studio audience.  It really did lend an intimate feel to the vibe of this album and is a fun moment.  The “Burn Down the Mission” epic medley was a lot of fun and it was nice hearing Elton throw in some Elvis and Beatles bits in there.  Hey, it was the 70’s, long medleys and jams were common so it’s all cool with me.

The rhythm section was of course fabulous,  Nigel was really in the pocket the whole time and Dee was a fantastic player.  He was doing some really fast runs in “Burn Down the Mission” and seemed to play tons of melodic parts using both the upper and lower register.  Very smooth feel, I thought he might be playing a fretless bass, but I could find nothing online confirming this.

A good live album shows a different side to the artist than the studio and 17-11-70 definitely fits that bill.  Every song here is a winner and it’s nice to hear Elton just rock out with the boys.  It feels very natural and I know these guys are going to be used more often in the studio recordings for the next five years or so.  I’m looking forward to seeing these guys settle into a groove.

- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Umbrella Sam

Really glad you both enjoyed this, as this is one of my favorite Elton recordings and one that I think deserves more attention than it gets (it does have a small following among Elton fans, but I never see it included in discussions of the greatest live albums). I agree HomokHarcos, I too was skeptical the first time I heard there was an 18 minute version of “Burn Down the Mission”, but it really does work. Metaldams, I have heard LIVE AT LEEDS, but never knew the history behind it. Now that I think about it, though, it is structurally quite similar, with the longer medleys taking up the second side. It’s a format I really like, keeps things moving in an epic way.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline Umbrella Sam



MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER is kind of in between the ELTON JOHN and TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION styles. Much like ELTON JOHN, Paul Buckmaster and the orchestra are a big part of most of these songs. However, in this case, they’re playing less like an actual classical orchestra and more in the progressive style of something like “The Cage”.

In some ways, MADMAN could be viewed as the end of an era for Elton John. It’s the last album to feature the wide range of session musicians that had appeared on ELTON JOHN and TUMBLEWEED. In fact, for this specific album they were even joined by some newcomers, including future Yes keyboardist Rick Wakeman and an acoustic guitarist named Davey Johnstone, who would go on to impress Elton so much during these sessions that Elton himself asked him to join him, Dee and Nigel for his next album.

The first song is “Tiny Dancer”. Now, I can understand people thinking some Elton songs are overrated; heck, many artist has hits that are played like crazy on the radio. But I will never be able to understand anyone getting sick of this wonderful song. The beautiful melody, the innocent lyric, the orchestra, the pedal steel and acoustic guitars, Elton’s vocal performance...everything about this song mixes together so well to create an undeniable classic. Interestingly, it’s actually a cult classic, because it was not a big hit back then, just barely missing the top 10 here in the U.S. These days, it’s one of his most popular songs, a status it truly deserves.

“Levon” is probably the second most known song on this album, and it’s also deserving of that status. Such a great rock song; Barry Morgan really puts his all into what ultimately was his last drumming performance for Elton. The orchestra is really effective here, especially during the choruses, and I also really like how powerful Elton’s voice sounds whenever he shouts “he shall be Levon”.

“Razor Face” is also a really cool song. I know I’ve praised Elton’s voice twice already, but I can’t help it; that voice is just so distinct and on point! I love how it sounds when he’s harmonizing with himself; every time I hear him sing “needs a man who’s young to walk him around”, I marvel at how well done it was. It’s also supported by great guitar work from Caleb Quaye, organ from Rick Wakeman, and even an accordion part, which actually does work; it helps build atmosphere and make the song even more progressive.

Then we move on to the title track. I’m going to state right here and now that “Madman Across the Water” is my favorite Elton John song. It’s kind of similar to “Burn Down the Mission” in that it’s written in a way where, while the actual singing parts are great and fleshed out, they also leave in parts where the musicians can breach out and do something exciting. It also has a really interesting lyrical theme that’s open to lots of interpretation. I love this song in just about any form: from the Royal Festival Hall version where the orchestra goes even crazier to the live version with Dee and Nigel where Elton goes full on jazz mode, it always works. And yet, my favorite version is neither of those versions and it’s actually not this version either, even though I really like it as well.

No, believe it or not, my favorite version is actually the very first one that they recorded with Mick Ronson on electric guitar for TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION. I’ve had to think about this for a while, because at first glance it is basically Ronson taking over for those middle sections, which is obviously great, but isn’t exactly a staple of Elton John recordings. I thought about this and when listening to “Babe I’m Gonna Leave You” a few weeks ago for the LED ZEPPELIN discussion, I realized what it was: much like the Zeppelin track, I love how it naturally is able to change from quiet acoustic number to harder rock number and back again. It packs everything into one single song with a limited roster. Michael Chapman is on acoustic guitar and brings such a haunting approach to it that makes it really effective for opening and closing the song. Barry Morgan’s on drums again and really going crazy in the background. And, yes, Ronson’s guitar part is awesome. It’s interesting comparing this to the album version and seeing how he’s able to naturally create the “madness” of those middle sections with just his guitar whereas the album version had to use a full scale orchestra. That’s not meant to slight the album version; I like how fast the orchestra is and how it quiets down in certain sections. But in the end, I do still lean slightly towards the first one, especially the way it delivers the chorus. Elton’s voice sounds so cool in the chorus combined with all the hard rocking that’s going on with the musicians in the background. It’s true that Elton’s piano gets buried a bit in the mix, but it’s prominent when it needs to be, such as the initial transition to the chorus and the quieter moments. Plus, Elton felt the famous lick was meant to be an acoustic guitar lick from the very beginning, according to Gus Dudgeon. That’s another thing I like about Elton. He’s not just writing for himself; he knows when he has something for others to take center stage. He has multiple guitar-focused songs in his catalog and “Bad Side of the Moon” kind of worked in that way too.

OK, now back to the actual album: the next track is “Indian Sunset”, once again another great song. Lyrically, it has gotten some criticism for inaccuracies and some lines might be considered too dated by today’s standards, but Bernie’s message was clear; it’s about a tragedy and it sympathizes with the Native Americans. Once again, Buckmaster provides a great string arrangement, bringing a certain epic feel to the story.

“Holiday Inn” is where Davey Johnstone really gets to shine. He plays mandolin here, which much like the accordion in “Razor Face” might sound like an odd choice at first, but is really effective. He plays it so fast that it’s impressive, especially in the ending fadeout which gives starts off with a nice solo from him. Just listening to this song, you can see why Elton thought so highly of him.

So, yeah, a really solid first two-thirds. The last third is where things falter a bit, though. “Rotten Peaches” has always been my least favorite song on the album. It’s not necessarily bad; the chorus is kind of catchy, but it doesn’t stand out as much; it’s just kind of an average song on an album that’s otherwise very diverse in its styles.

“All the Nasties” has a great first half. It’s the only song on this album where he’s backed by Dee and Nigel on bass and drums, providing Dee another chance to show his bass skills, Nigel a chance to recreate the live, heavy sounds he created on 17-11-70, and Elton himself showing off a really charming piano part. Then the second half goes full on “My Father’s Gun” mode, with a ridiculously long repeat of the same thing over and over again. It is still cool to hear Nigel’s drumming here, but even that gets a bit tiresome after a while.

And finally, we have “Goodbye”. I guess with a title like that, it’s natural that this would be the ending track on the album. It’s also really short, clocking in at less than 2 minutes. Elton later had a successful short album closer, but I think it kind of works against this one; just when things really start to pick up and get interesting...the song ends. It’s still a nice song; I like the sorrow in Elton’s voice and the orchestra, but it just feels a bit underwhelming.

So, yeah, MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER is another good album overall. However, the first 6 tracks are so great that they kind of overshadow the remaining tracks, none of which are bad, but just don’t quite compare. The album didn’t sell that well; here in the U.S. it did fine but over in the U.K. it was one of his worst selling albums. That would change with the next album.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline metaldams

First off, I’ve been living in a new place for about a year and it’s only been the past few days where I finally improved my home music listening set up.  It wasn’t so much an issue when listening to things I know like the back of my hand, but for having new music grow on me, it definitely helps.

MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER is an album I have heard a few times before, though it’s been well over ten years.  Needless to say, the fresh listen I just had was needed.  Of course, hearing the album or not, I know “Tiny Dancer” and “Levon” as well.  Both excellent songs and the former is especially catchy.  I really like the whole album for the most part.

Knowing my tastes, it’s not surprising the two epics are my favorite tracks on the album, “Madman Across the Water” and “Indian Sunset.”  Even though it’s been years since I’ve heard this album, I never forgot “Indian Sunset,” so that says a lot in terms of leaving an impression.  Both fantastic songs.  I noticed the percussion on “Indian Sunset” at times had a native style beat to it which really lent to the atmosphere.

The rest of the album is quite good and I think overall this album flows the best out of all the albums we’ve listened to so far.  I did notice Elton’s harmonizing on “Razor Face” and the great guitar work on “Holiday Inn.”  I can kind of see how the end of the album is perhaps relatively weaker, but then again, how can you top those two tracks?  “All the Nasties,” while I wouldn’t skip it, is a weaker song compared to everything else.

Pretty cool that Rick Wakeman appeared, that guy is a legend.  He did a lot of studio work and this was shortly before he joined Yes, whose classic era I’m a really big fan of.  Believe it or not, in a couple of albums ahead, he will also show up in the Black Sabbath story.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline HomokHarcos

I preferred the way the orchestra was used here over the previous albums. The opening tracks were indeed the best, and it included my favorite song yet.

"Tiny Dancer" was the one song I recognized on this album. It's a tune I've heard often before, but would not have known the title. The orchestra and pedal steel guitar mixture is unique and gives symphonic country feeling. I only just recently learned that instrument I associate with country is called pedal steel guitar. "Levon" starts off with just a piano and vocals, but really picks up when the instruments are added. This is making me want to check out more symphonic music sometime down the line. "Razor Face" is the song that sounds more like a rock track to me. It has a good guitar section enhanced by the piano.

"Madman Across the Water" is my favorite song so far. It's just one of those songs so great I knew it was special the first time I listened to it. I like everything about this song, especially the guitar and piano. I listened to this album before I saw your post, so I didn't know it was your favorite song here too. "Indian Sunset" is also very good when there are instruments on. If it wasn't for the song before I probably would have noticed it more on my first listen. "Holiday Inn" is also a good song with an orchestra that fits well with the music.

The lyrics of "Rotten Peaches" make me think of I Am A Fugitive From a Chain Gang for a few reasons. One, the story is set Georgia and Georgia is the peach state. Two, the story about prison makes me think he's on a chain gang, but I don't know if the lyrics were supposed to be literal. The choir is a nice touch. "All the Nasties" also had a choir. "Goodbye" was kind of how I expected it to be when I saw it was the last track, the title and how short it is.


Offline metaldams

I’m looking ahead here, and noticed the next six studio albums all hit #1 in the U.S.  Pretty impressive.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline metaldams

https://rateyourmusic.com/artist/elton-john

The general consensus on Elton albums, though not necessarily ours, lots of ratings and reviews.  The IMDb of music sites.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Umbrella Sam



I consider HONKY CHATEAU to be a transitional album in the Elton catalogue. It’s the first one to feature his classic band lineup of Dee Murray, Nigel Olsson, and Davey Johnstone throughout the entire album and is also the first in what would be a very impressive streak of number 1 albums, as well as many Top 10 singles (prior to this, only “Your Song” had made the Top 10).

The album’s title is a mix between the first track, “Honky Cat”, and the new recording studio Elton and the band recorded at, Chateau d’Herouville. There’s actually a 1971 interview on YouTube where Elton mentions going back to the EMPTY SKY approach of making albums and focusing more on rock-and-roll. So it’s clear that Elton was trying to take things in a completely different direction, and you can hear it in the finished product.

The very first track, “Honky Cat”, is a perfect example of this. It’s a good song, but certainly not something that would have been on any of the previous albums, not even EMPTY SKY. It’s definitely something aimed at mass audiences, with that catchy Fender Rhodes part and a brassy pop arrangement. It’s definitely a fun song.

“Mellow” is a bit closer to the style of the previous Elton albums. It always reminded me a bit of “Razor Face” stylistically. I prefer “Razor Face”, which is a bit more immediate and paced better. “Mellow” is slower and the electric violin solo by Jean-Luc Ponty feels a bit dragged out. Still, I do think the chorus is really catchy and the band already does sound really tight even at this early stage in its formation.

“I Think I’m Going to Kill Myself” is a very obvious vaudeville-inspired song, though certainly darker lyrically than anything Paul McCartney would have done. I actually do think it’s really catchy and I especially like how it kind of changes style when they sing the “blues” portion of the chorus.

“Susie (Dramas)” is another one I think suffers from sounding a bit too much like a previous Elton song, in this case “Ballad of a Well Known Gun”, which was much more atmospheric and full. Unlike “Mellow”, though, “Susie” doesn’t really do enough to stand out on its own and feels more like filler. Not bad filler, but still filler.

“Rocket Man” is, of course, the most known song from this album. Very atmospheric with Davey’s slide guitar and the backing vocals from Dee, Nigel and Davey. It was definitely one of the more different Elton songs at the time and I can see why it’s still so highly regarded. Truth be told, this is one of my least favorites of the big Elton hits, but that’s mostly because there are just so many great ones to choose from. I just happen to think this is one of the less catchy ones, but it still does have such a unique atmosphere that I like.

“Salvation” is probably the most like any of the songs on the previous album, mostly due to the presence of the backing vocalists. It’s a cool song; I like the melody, and the harmonium and guitar really work especially well on it. Not much else to say; it’s a nice song.

“Slave” is my least favorite song on the record. It always felt kind of out of place; there’s a faster rock version that exists that was rejected in favor of it. While I do prefer that version, I still don’t think it’s necessarily good; the melody always sounded kind of generic and it just never really worked for me.

The next track, “Amy”, is awesome. The band is joined by Jean-Luc Ponty again as well as Ray Cooper on congas. And what you get is 4 minutes of really awesome, band-oriented rock. And when I say band-oriented, I really mean band-oriented. Everyone gets their chance to shine at some point or another, and there’s even a really cool jam session at the end. Ponty’s electric violin solo is so much more interesting this time, but I also like how he contributes to the song’s atmosphere itself. I’ve always loved how it sounded once Elton sings the line “I don’t whistle”; it almost sounds like some sort of low-pitched horn. When people doubt whether Elton should be labeled a rock artist, this is one I like to play to prove to them that he indeed should.

While “Amy” comes extremely close, in the end, my favorite song here is “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters”. As a kid, I had a DVD called “Dream Ticket”, which featured a disc where Elton discussed certain songs through his career, and it included the Royal Festival Hall performance of this song. It was one of the most beautiful things I’d ever heard, and I played that performance over and over again. It featured just Elton, Dee, and Davey on mandolin. The melody was so beautiful and Elton’s voice was in fantastic form. And when I eventually got HONKY CHATEAU, I was pleased to discover the album version was pretty much the same, just a minimal lineup doing this unique song in their unique way. I still love this song; I love how unique the lyrics are, the way Elton delivers them...it’s such a beautiful ballad, and thankfully it has gotten some more attention in recent years.

The album ends with a rocker, “Hercules”. And it’s a good one. The chorus is catchy, the backing vocals and guitars are cool and there’s even this really cool Rhino whistle Gus threw in the middle to make it even more fun. I’ve hear that this was considered to be a third single from the album, and I could totally see it working. It does have that upbeat, danceable quality to it that I think could have appealed to radio listeners. It’s a really good way to end the album.

HONKY CHATEAU is one of Elton’s most popular records and most fans rank it very highly. Personally, I do find it a bit overrated; granted, the only song here I don’t like at all is “Slave”, but with that taken into account, I do rank a lot of the other records higher. Still, what’s good is still really good, especially “Amy” and “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters”, and it is impressive how Davey seemed to fit in right away; much like Dee and Nigel, he really feels like he’s there to enhance the music, not overtake it. Elton described in his autobiography how Davey would do things like the slide guitar in “Rocket Man” that most other guitarists wouldn’t have, because his concern was with the songs specifically. Even if I don’t rank it quite as high as the other classic Elton John records, HONKY CHATEAU is still a nice record that shows that Elton could compete with the major rock stars of the time. And it just got better from there.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline metaldams

      Definitely Elton’s most focused and confident sounding album to date.  I think the fact this overall sounds like a band album really helps, as I’m a listener who tends to gravitate towards players and I feel like I’m getting to know the band in addition to Elton’s songs.  I got that feeling listening to 17-11-70 and I get the same feeling here.  I would say the only thing not here from Elton that I like that he’s done up to this point is a long, epic song.  Not that it was 100% needed because what’s here is fine.

      As far as standout songs, perhaps a bit unfair because of course it’s “Honky Cat” and “Rocket Man.”  I’ve heard these two songs dozens of times while these other songs are new to me.  They’re both great songs.  The former is a real butt shaker with an awesome groove to it and the latter is simply pop perfection.  I love the fade out at the end of the song.  The rest of the album I really enjoyed, there was nothing I disliked.  The rhythm section cooks throughout this album and I agree “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters” was definitely a standout.  I thought I heard some mandolin in there.  I loved the arrangement and tune overall, I could picture Rod Stewart doing it, for some reason.

      Also, gotta say, as an Alice Cooper fan, there were parts of this album, band wise, that sound like they could be on his mid to late 70’s albums where his sound got softer in parts.  Safe to say Elton was an influence on Alice (and vice versa in the image and theatrics department),  considering Alice wrote with Bernie Taupin and Davey Johnstone at one point.  This is overall a very good album and probably my favorite so far.  Again, it’s the band focus that reels me in initially.  Who knows how things will go when I hear these more and certain songs stand out more.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Umbrella Sam

      Definitely Elton’s most focused and confident sounding album to date.  I think the fact this overall sounds like a band album really helps, as I’m a listener who tends to gravitate towards players and I feel like I’m getting to know the band in addition to Elton’s songs.  I got that feeling listening to 17-11-70 and I get the same feeling here.  I would say the only thing not here from Elton that I like that he’s done up to this point is a long, epic song.  Not that it was 100% needed because what’s here is fine.

      As far as standout songs, perhaps a bit unfair because of course it’s “Honky Cat” and “Rocket Man.”  I’ve heard these two songs dozens of times while these other songs are new to me.  They’re both great songs.  The former is a real butt shaker with an awesome groove to it and the latter is simply pop perfection.  I love the fade out at the end of the song.  The rest of the album I really enjoyed, there was nothing I disliked.  The rhythm section cooks throughout this album and I agree “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters” was definitely a standout.  I thought I heard some mandolin in there.  I loved the arrangement and tune overall, I could picture Rod Stewart doing it, for some reason.

      Also, gotta say, as an Alice Cooper fan, there were parts of this album, band wise, that sound like they could be on his mid to late 70’s albums where his sound got softer in parts.  Safe to say Elton was an influence on Alice (and vice versa in the image and theatrics department),  considering Alice wrote with Bernie Taupin and Davey Johnstone at one point.  This is overall a very good album and probably my favorite so far.  Again, it’s the band focus that reels me in initially.  Who knows how things will go when I hear these more and certain songs stand out more.

Interesting you mention Rod Stewart, as he and Elton were close friends for many years and Rod did cover multiple Elton songs, but not “Mona Lisas”.

The lack of a long, epic song is a very good observation. Rest assured, the next album brings that back.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline HomokHarcos

I think this is my favorite album so far, it's got rock and roll, ragtime, country and boogie woogie influences.

"Honky Cat" is a fun opening. The piano sounds like boogie woogie in the verse, and I like the brass used in the music. It's even got a great piano solo near the end. "Mellow" is one of my least favorite songs on this album, and again like usual I want to say that is because I like the rest of the album and not because this song is weak. I will admit, I'm shocked Jean-Luc Ponty appeared on this album. My mom's a big fan of his so I heard his music a lot growing up, and he's one of my favorite jazz fusion artists.

"I Think I'm Gonna Kill Myself" also reminded me of Paul McCartney's music hall-like songs. It's definitely got a ragtime-like feel. It's actually pretty upbeat and fun despite the lyrics. "Susie" is another great follow up. It's got a very catchy chorus, along with great piano playing and I like the guitar playing. "Rocket Man" is one of Elton John's signature songs and probably the song I most associate with him. It's actually not as upbeat as the rest of the album. "Salvation" is another song that goes for a slower-paced feel.

"Slave" is probably his most country sounding song yet. I think it would have fit more with Tumbleweed Connection as he had more of a country theme on that album. "Amy" is a good song on this track. Very good rock song, and one that is probably one of my favorite Elton John songs so far. Of course I'm happy to hear more Jean-Luc Ponty. Ballads for the most part are not my thing, but "Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters" works well enough. I was expecting it to build to something, but didn't. "Hercules" is a very good way to finish the album. It's probably the most 1950s sounding song on here.


Offline Umbrella Sam

I think this is my favorite album so far, it's got rock and roll, ragtime, country and boogie woogie influences.

"Honky Cat" is a fun opening. The piano sounds like boogie woogie in the verse, and I like the brass used in the music. It's even got a great piano solo near the end. "Mellow" is one of my least favorite songs on this album, and again like usual I want to say that is because I like the rest of the album and not because this song is weak. I will admit, I'm shocked Jean-Luc Ponty appeared on this album. My mom's a big fan of his so I heard his music a lot growing up, and he's one of my favorite jazz fusion artists.

"I Think I'm Gonna Kill Myself" also reminded me of Paul McCartney's music hall-like songs. It's definitely got a ragtime-like feel. It's actually pretty upbeat and fun despite the lyrics. "Susie" is another great follow up. It's got a very catchy chorus, along with great piano playing and I like the guitar playing. "Rocket Man" is one of Elton John's signature songs and probably the song I most associate with him. It's actually not as upbeat as the rest of the album. "Salvation" is another song that goes for a slower-paced feel.

"Slave" is probably his most country sounding song yet. I think it would have fit more with Tumbleweed Connection as he had more of a country theme on that album. "Amy" is a good song on this track. Very good rock song, and one that is probably one of my favorite Elton John songs so far. Of course I'm happy to hear more Jean-Luc Ponty. Ballads for the most part are not my thing, but "Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters" works well enough. I was expecting it to build to something, but didn't. "Hercules" is a very good way to finish the album. It's probably the most 1950s sounding song on here.

I’m curious, do you have any album recommendations for Jean-Luc Ponty? I’ve heard a few of his songs, but never really tried exploring any of his albums. I like acts like that who can take classical music and incorporate more modern elements to it, and he would definitely fit into that category.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline metaldams


Offline HomokHarcos

I’m curious, do you have any album recommendations for Jean-Luc Ponty? I’ve heard a few of his songs, but never really tried exploring any of his albums. I like acts like that who can take classical music and incorporate more modern elements to it, and he would definitely fit into that category.
I'd recommend Cosmic Messenger. It has two of my favorite songs of his on there: "Egocentric Molecules" and "Ethereal Mood".


Offline Umbrella Sam



First of all, yes, that is indeed a poster for GO WEST on the front cover. Groucho was allegedly the inspiration for the album’s title, but I’ve always wondered why GO WEST was chosen specifically. I like GO WEST, but the later MGMs are often considered among their weaker films by Marx Brothers fans. It’s a stretch, but I’ve long suspected the choice was made because of the fact that the song “Blues For My Baby and Me” makes heavy use of the phrase “Go West”.

DON’T SHOOT ME I’M ONLY THE PIANO PLAYER is where I feel Elton’s transition to stardom was finally complete. True, HONKY CHATEAU did hit number one here in the U.S., but even “Rocket Man” didn’t manage the number one spot on the singles charts. But DON’T SHOOT ME did achieve this feat with “Crocodile Rock”, and it even got another single that made it to the number two spot as well in “Daniel”. While it certainly has its fans, I don’t think this album has entirely gotten its due, partly due to being sandwiched between two albums that are ranked very highly in the Elton catalogue.

It starts off with “Daniel”, which is of course a great song. As with HONKY CHATEAU, Elton is back to playing multiple keyboards outside of just the acoustic piano, which is interesting to think about. That classic image of him is at a grand piano, and yet on one of his most popular songs, that’s not even present at all; he plays Fender Rhodes and Mellotron, which definitely feel more in line with the 70s as a whole, but I mean that in a good way. The lyrics have often been up to interpretation, as Elton cut out the third verse. This was a common occurrence with Elton and Bernie’s lyrics; “Border Song” is another example, although in that case Elton wrote a completely new verse. Regarding “Daniel”, it’s believed it was supposed to be about the Vietnam War. I love this song; it has that amazing 70s feel to it that you just don’t see in songs today, even ones I like. There’s actually a rare mix of this from an album called THE SUPERIOR SOUND OF ELTON JOHN that I highly recommend; it features the original first chorus that was mixed out and replaced with the repeated second chorus, and you can make out Davey’s banjo part a lot better.

“Teacher I Need You” is a very obvious ‘50s callback song, but again, it’s in all the best possible ways. The uptempo drumming from Nigel, Elton’s fast piano playing and the joyful backing vocals make it feel like a truly faithful throwback, and it’s a lot of fun.

“Elderberry Wine” is also a fun song. This is one I’m actually kind of surprised they never really pushed for as an A-side, because it seemed like a good choice. A catchy chorus, a groovy bass part, lots of horns; it feels like something that would have made a great party song. Oh well, at least it made the album, and in the context of the album itself, it keeps the fun pace moving. Just when you think that’s what the tone is going to continue to be...they throw you for a loop.

“Blues For My Baby and Me” is a really great, underrated Elton John ballad. It’s one of the only two songs on the album to feature an arrangement from Paul Buckmaster (who had been missing from HONKY CHATEAU and would not return again until BLUE MOVES in 1976) and he does a really good job properly supporting the song. I especially love how the horns sound after Elton sings “it looks so sweet and so free”; it really feels like he captures the essence of that line with that arrangement. Davey also plays sitar on this one, which isn’t a super common occurrence on Elton recordings (it does appear on “Holiday Inn” but is completely overshadowed by the mandolin playing), but much like with George Harrison using it with the Beatles, it gives the song an extra, worldly feel to it. It’s a song that needs to be heard to be believed; Elton recently chose it as one of the “Deep Cuts” on JEWEL BOX, so I think he would agree with it being massively underrated.

“Midnight Creeper” brings things back to the more upbeat, brassy style of “Elderberry Wine”. Davey’s electric guitar part here is pretty cool and he plays well off of the brass players. It keeps things moving at a good pace musically.

“Have Mercy on the Criminal” is the album’s epic. It’s a much better version of “Rotten Peaches”, dealing with a prisoner on the run from the law. It reminds me a bit of “I’ve Seen That Movie Too” in its arrangement; very cinematic with the orchestra and Davey’s guitar, and Elton gives a really powerful vocal performance. It’s so passionate that he really captures the feeling of someone who has been on the run for a long time and has been suffering as a result. It’s so vivid and atmospheric; Elton also chose this for the “Deep Cuts” section of JEWEL BOX and I can see why. It’s a song I can feel people not aware of it being really impressed by.

“I’m Going to Be a Teenage Idol” is another horn heavy song, allegedly inspired by Elton’s friend, T-Rex frontman Marc Bolan. The horn riff here is probably the catchiest one yet, and I love how during the choruses it kind of transitions in a way that makes it feel like a completely different song; when Elton starts singing about being a teenage idol, it’s like he’s in some sort of fantasy or dream sequence, only for reality to come crashing back when the horns returns. I can really see why they went for the cover they did; the cinematic imagery of the lyrics and production is really noticeable here, just as much as on GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD or TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION.

“Texan Love Song” is kind of what you’d expect; a country song, but one that’s still really entertaining. Elton gives another fantastic vocal performance here; his voice is so clear and captures that beautiful nighttime atmosphere I get every time I listen to this. Here’s something I didn’t mention earlier: Elton actually was suffering from glandular fever while this album was recorded. I’ve always found this interesting because his vocals are so on point throughout this album that it’s not noticeable in the slightest; heck, I’d argue he sounds at his best so far on this record.

“Crocodile Rock”, that silly song everyone likes to make fun of, even Elton himself. It’s been subject to lots of criticism over the years, but I still really enjoy it, for the pure nostalgic fact that it was the song that introduced me to Elton John. Yes, for me, it all started here, and while I’ll admit it is silly and not the greatest representation of Elton’s versatility, it is still a really catchy song. I love the Farfisa organ, the guitar work, the “Speedy Gonzales”-inspired “la la las”. It still holds a special place in my heart and I’m always happy to hear it.

The final song is “High Flying Bird”, another wonderful ballad. A more piano and acoustic guitar-focused song, this is a perfect ending to the album, one that demonstrates how well in check the Elton John Band was with each other, both from a musical and vocal standpoint. The way they build everything up and keep the rhythm moving is absolutely perfect; it reminds me a lot of a longer version of “Harmony” in a way, especially with the soaring backing vocals. It’s another track that has a truly cinematic feel to it and it’s conveyed so perfectly.

Only one B-side to talk about this time, and it’s one you guys will be familiar with: “Skyline Pigeon”, the standout EMPTY SKY track was remade with the Elton John Band and a Buckmaster arrangement. I can kind of see why it was relegated to B-side status; there were two bird-themed songs and one had to get the cut, plus considering the fact “Skyline Pigeon” had already had its chance in the spotlight...well, I can see why they made the decision they did. Still, this version of “Skyline Pigeon” is pretty darn good; Elton’s voice is in great shape, Nigel’s drumming is fantastic, and the Buckmaster arrangement again really suits the song’s needs and contributes when necessary. I especially love the oboe in the second chorus; much like the sitar in “Blues For My Baby and Me”, it really gives off this worldly feel to it. Which version do I prefer? I think I slightly lean towards this one mostly due to the vocals, but the original is still such a unique song on its own with its lighter arrangement that both are well worth checking out.

DON’T SHOOT ME I’M ONLY THE PIANO PLAYER is an album I think very highly of; I like every song on it and it flows in a way that feels really balanced between the ballads and rockers. Add in a natural flow, tight band, and suitable supporting arrangements from Dudgeon and Buckmaster, and you get an album that demonstrates why Elton John is such a great artist. I’ve tried doing rankings of Elton’s albums multiple times and often find myself shifting albums around, yet DON’T SHOOT ME always somehow finds itself in the number two spot (there is one other Elton album I slightly prefer to this one). Highly recommended.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline metaldams

      Again, like these past couple of Elton albums there are two hits I am familiar with and the rest of the album is new to me.  So of course the hits are more embedded in my brain versus songs I’ve just heard for the first time in the past week.

      I’ll get it out if the way.  Throw me in the group who has never been a fan of “Crocodile Rock.”   The verses are pretty good, but the synths seem completely out of place on what sounds like a nostalgic 50’s song.  That chorus?  Too sugary for me, just not my thing.  “Daniel” I do like.  A more mature soft rock track about a Vietnam vet and a real good song.  That one I like. 

      As far as the rest of the album?  “Crocodile Rock” is the worst song on the album, because the rest I enjoyed.  As far as an overall impression, the thing I noticed the most is Davey Johnstone is really stepping it up with the electric guitar sounds, always a plus with me.  Again, very much a band effort and the electric guitars combined with pop made me think of this as perhaps the closest Elton came to the UK glam scene of the time.  Yes Sam, I see you mentioned he was friends with Marc Bolan.

      As far as songs, “Teacher I Need You” is a lusty teacher song, in the latter tradition of Van Halen’s “Hot For Teacher” or Venom’s “Teacher’s Pet.”  Yes folks, I slipped in a Venom reference in an Elton John review.  The line “I’ve got John Wayne stances, I’ve got Errol Flynn advances” is brilliant.  Great song overall.

      The other standouts for me were “Blues For Baby and Me,” a Davey Johnstone tour de force that even has sitar, “Have Mercy On the Criminal” and the socially charged “Texan Love Song.”  Really though, all the songs minus “Crocodile Rock” I enjoy and the band is getting more electric.  Should transition them well into that next album.
- Doug Sarnecky