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General Boards => General Discussion => Topic started by: Umbrella Sam on January 09, 2022, 10:45:24 AM

Title: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 09, 2022, 10:45:24 AM
Well, after weeks of debating it, I’ve finally decided to go through with this project. Elton John’s music has always been such a huge part of my life and I thought it would be fun to introduce people to the wide variety of songs he’s recorded over the years. Obviously, we’ve been doing a lot of different discussions lately, so I’ll do my best to accommodate for that (maybe posting on weeks where not a lot is happening; I can figure out as we go along what works best).

A few things I’ve long debated. One is the fact that there are a ton of Elton John albums. I plan on taking part in the Black Sabbath album discussion thread and looking at that discography, there still aren’t nearly as many as there are Elton John albums, and that’s just counting studio albums. So, for now, the goal is to at least get through 1976, which is usually considered the end of Elton John’s classic period, and then I’ll reevaluate from there depending on if people are interested in still continuing. I also am going to focus mainly on the studio albums, but will briefly mention some highlights from the soundtrack/live albums of this period and, much like the Beatles discussion, will devote some time to non-album singles/B-sides as well. I’m also not starting with REGIMENTAL SGT. ZIPPO, which was technically the first Elton John album. The reason for this because it’s currently a vinyl-only album that was made a limited release for Record Store Day, so it’s not officially available to stream, and I’m probably the only person here who went out and bought a copy.I am holding out hope they’ll make it available on CD/streaming eventually.

That being said, before I start the EMPTY SKY discussion, I would like to briefly mention some tracks that were released beforehand (I was going to mention them as part of the EMPTY SKY review, but figured it would take up too much space):

I’ve Been Loving You/Here’s to the Next Time: Not counting two singles he released with his band Bluesology, this was the very first release of an Elton John composition. The A-side was credited to Elton and Bernie Taupin, but Bernie had nothing to do with it. At the time, Dick James wanted Elton and Bernie to write for the likes of Tom Jones and Engelbert Humperdinck, and this is very clearly an attempt to meet that expectation. It’s an extremely poor lyric. When you read the title, you get exactly what you expect; basic lyrics about love matched with a corny arrangement. The B-side, “Here’s to the Next Time”, is another Elton composition that’s way better than its A-side. Reconnecting Elton with his bluesy roots, Elton sounds much more engaged vocally and it’s supported by a nice horn arrangement. I also really like the bass playing on this song (I can’t confirm currently, but I believe that’s Dee Murray on bass). There’s also a rare Portuguese EP that contains two additional songs: “Thank You For All Your Loving”, which is a nice, Motown-style song, and “Angel Tree”, a naive, but still cute song that marked the first official release of an Elton/Bernie composition.

Lady Samantha/All Across the Havens: The A-side is more in the direction Elton and Bernie wanted to take. Encouraged by producer Steve Brown to write more about what interested them, this is a much more unique song than “I’ve Been Loving You”. Elton plays organ and electric piano on this song, and the organ is a really good fit for its depressing theme. I also really like Caleb Quaye’s guitar playing and Roger Pope’s drumming. Both would figure prominently on Elton’s earliest albums and really excelled at heavier rock pieces. The B-side was All Across the Havens, a lighter song I’ve never been a huge fan of, although I kind of like the ragtime piano intro that recurs throughout.

It’s Me That You Need/Just Like Strange Rain: The A-side of this was a bit out of left field for Elton at the time. Released a few weeks before EMPTY SKY, this attempted to present an Elton closer to the one that would be prominent on the ELTON JOHN album in 1970. Unlike I’ve Been Loving You and most of the ZIPPO era tracks ( “Tartan Coloured Lady” being an exception), the orchestra here does not take a pop or overly-sentimental approach, but does feel a bit more in line with the classical approach on ELTON JOHN; heck, I’d argue it does it better than some tracks on ELTON JOHN, since it doesn’t completely overtake the song; Caleb’s acoustic and electric guitar playing is still prominent throughout and when it’s all over, the focus is back on Elton and his piano. It’s a very nice ballad. The B-side, “Just Like Strange Rain”, is a fun rock song that was actually a leftover from EMPTY SKY that should have made the album. Lyrically, it’s very psychedelic, something that would not have been too uncommon in the ZIPPO era. Like “Lady Samantha”, it’s supported by some excellent drumming from Roger Pope and an ending that allows Caleb Quaye to have fun with his guitar playing.

Well, hopefully I’ve convinced some of you. Soon, the discussion will continue with Elton’s first album released, EMPTY SKY.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 09, 2022, 01:27:21 PM
Sweet!  I’ve always wanted to explore Elton’s catalogue.  Yeah, I’ve had people tell me not to bother past 1976, but the older I get, the more I’m interested in exploring those non classic era years.  In Elton’s case, I know the guy has consistently had hits independent of their quality. 

Yeah, I’ll try to pitch in this week.  The pre Empty Sky stuff I’ll search for streaming and on YouTube.  I imagine it will get easier once we get into an actual album and just have to stream the album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 09, 2022, 07:26:35 PM
Sweet!  I’ve always wanted to explore Elton’s catalogue.  Yeah, I’ve had people tell me not to bother past 1976, but the older I get, the more I’m interested in exploring those non classic era years.  In Elton’s case, I know the guy has consistently had hits independent of their quality. 

Yeah, I’ll try to pitch in this week.  The pre Empty Sky stuff I’ll search for streaming and on YouTube.  I imagine it will get easier once we get into an actual album and just have to stream the album.

I personally do think his post-1976 material is better than people give it credit for, although there are certain low periods (mid-1980s in particular). Glad to hear you’ll take part.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on January 09, 2022, 08:54:04 PM
Already here there is quite a bit of variety. "I'll Be Loving You" is a pop song that was quite standard for the time period, but "Here's to the Next Time" is a good song with horns in it. I've always liked hearing horns in music, especially funk. "Thank You for All Your Loving" is very catchy, and I think my favorite song of these mentioned here. The piano solo is just excellent there, and Elton's vocals fit the music perfectly. "Angel Tree" was not too much of a stepdown, but I'll admit I actually never put too much weight on lyrics when it comes to my enjoyment of music.

"Lady Samantha" is a rocking tune that reminds me of the early music Santana released. "All Across the Havens" has a noticeable country influence, the type of song that makes me think of corn fields. "It's Me that You Need" is nice ballad that is enhanced by the guitar playing throughout. "Just Like Strange Rain" is a song that I'd like to use to make an argument that I made before: piano would be a great addition to rock music. Typically rock music is about the drums, guitar and bass, but I would like to add keyboards as an addition.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 10, 2022, 06:46:57 PM


I’ve Been Loving You/Here’s To the Next Time:  Yeah, for the a-side, I agree, I can imagine someone like Tom Jones doing this.  That style of music really doesn’t suit Elton as he has a different kind of character and grit to his voice than a lounge singer.  I hear that character on the verses then the strings in the chorus give the song a completely different vibe.  The b-side is indeed better.  In 6/8 time, a hint bluesier and some killer bass work.

Lady Samantha/All Across the Havens: While I wouldn’t call either an amazing song, they’re both pleasant.  I really like Elton’s voice a lot and the arrangement on “Lady Samantha” is excellent.  I love the lead guitar tone and playing and that’s Elton on the organ?  Excellent, I’m a big fan of that guitar/organ sound of the era.  On the heavier end of the spectrum for the time, worked well with Deep Purple and Uriah Heep (the latter band having Nigel Olsson playing drums on their first album).

It’s Me That You Need/Just Like Strange Rain:  The a-side is definitely the kind of song I imagine Elton John doing.  Really, epic, cinematic, big orchestration, lots of mood changes, and all thrown in a few minutes worth of pop music.  A really cool song.  There were parts at the beginning where with a sparser arrangement, I can picture Bob Dylan doing this.  The b-side is pleasant pop rocker with some good guitar work and a catchy chorus.  Not quite the standard of the a-side but good.

None of these songs were bad, all enjoyable to an extent.  “It’s Me That You Need” is my favorite of the bunch.  Elton is still getting his feet wet here and I know there is better material ahead, but not a bad start.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 10, 2022, 09:02:31 PM
Already here there is quite a bit of variety. "I'll Be Loving You" is a pop song that was quite standard for the time period, but "Here's to the Next Time" is a good song with horns in it. I've always liked hearing horns in music, especially funk. "Thank You for All Your Loving" is very catchy, and I think my favorite song of these mentioned here. The piano solo is just excellent there, and Elton's vocals fit the music perfectly. "Angel Tree" was not too much of a stepdown, but I'll admit I actually never put too much weight on lyrics when it comes to my enjoyment of music.

"Lady Samantha" is a rocking tune that reminds me of the early music Santana released. "All Across the Havens" has a noticeable country influence, the type of song that makes me think of corn fields. "It's Me that You Need" is nice ballad that is enhanced by the guitar playing throughout. "Just Like Strange Rain" is a song that I'd like to use to make an argument that I made before: piano would be a great addition to rock music. Typically rock music is about the drums, guitar and bass, but I would like to add keyboards as an addition.

Variety is the key word I always use when describing Elton John. He covers so many genres that it’s difficult to truly classify him under one specifically.

I’m not too familiar with Santana, but I decided to listen to “Waiting” from their first album and I can already see what you mean with the crazy guitar and organ playing. I’m already kind of hooked on that one song; I’ll definitely have to check the rest of that album out later this week.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 10, 2022, 09:08:11 PM

I’ve Been Loving You/Here’s To the Next Time:  Yeah, for the a-side, I agree, I can imagine someone like Tom Jones doing this.  That style of music really doesn’t suit Elton as he has a different kind of character and grit to his voice than a lounge singer.  I hear that character on the verses then the strings in the chorus give the song a completely different vibe.  The b-side is indeed better.  In 6/8 time, a hint bluesier and some killer bass work.

Lady Samantha/All Across the Havens: While I wouldn’t call either an amazing song, they’re both pleasant.  I really like Elton’s voice a lot and the arrangement on “Lady Samantha” is excellent.  I love the lead guitar tone and playing and that’s Elton on the organ?  Excellent, I’m a big fan of that guitar/organ sound of the era.  On the heavier end of the spectrum for the time, worked well with Deep Purple and Uriah Heep (the latter band having Nigel Olsson playing drums on their first album).

It’s Me That You Need/Just Like Strange Rain:  The a-side is definitely the kind of song I imagine Elton John doing.  Really, epic, cinematic, big orchestration, lots of mood changes, and all thrown in a few minutes worth of pop music.  A really cool song.  There were parts at the beginning where with a sparser arrangement, I can picture Bob Dylan doing this.  The b-side is pleasant pop rocker with some good guitar work and a catchy chorus.  Not quite the standard of the a-side but good.

None of these songs were bad, all enjoyable to an extent.  “It’s Me That You Need” is my favorite of the bunch.  Elton is still getting his feet wet here and I know there is better material ahead, but not a bad start.

Yeah, Elton actually played a lot of organ early on, since that’s what was in at the time and he had lots of experience playing it while touring with Bluesology. We’ll hear more of that on EMPTY SKY. Elton’s always been critical of his organ playing, but I think he’s being overly-critical. To my ears, he really seemed like he knew what he was doing when it came to the heavier organ tracks.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 15, 2022, 11:31:20 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ec/Elton_John_-_Empty_Sky.jpg)

The Elton John journey officially begins with EMPTY SKY. Elton actually had recorded an album before this called REGIMENTAL SGT. ZIPPO, which was an album full of psychedelic songs modeled after acts like the Beatles or Procol Harum, but DJM promotions man Steve Brown didn’t like the album and suggested they try again, this time with Brown producing. Now, Brown was not an experienced producer; as far as I’m aware, Elton was the only act he ever produced for. As such, there are tracks where this feels kind of obvious, especially some of the lighter tracks like “Val-Hala” or “Hymn 2000”.

That being said, this also contributes to the album’s charm. Elton has called it naive, but also considered it an “all or nothing” approach. Nowhere is this more evident than in the title track. This was Elton’s tribute to “Sympathy For the Devil”, but they threw everything they could into it: backwards guitar solos, flutes, harmonicas, congas...it really feels like there was a lot of love and effort put into it. In general, the rock songs here are pretty solid. “Western Ford Gateway” has a great harmony guitar part and “Sails” is a really catchy number; the electric piano, the guitar solo, Elton’s harmony vocals in the chorus...they all come together to create a really fun rock number.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, Elton is not solely on piano here; he pretty much plays every keyboard instrument here, from organ to harpsichord. This is not the norm; it’s not the only instance, but even in the albums immediately following this, other musicians were often brought in to play the non-piano keyboards. I think Elton does a good job on these instruments; I especially like the electric piano on “The Scaffold”. But here you can get the feeling that Elton did feel more comfortable playing piano specifically. Just listen to the way he plays it on the title track; you can already hear elements of what would soon become more prominent in his early live shows.

As I hinted at earlier, some of the lighter songs are the weaker points here;  “Hymn 2000” and “Lady What’s Tomorrow” in particular feel kind of awkward from a songwriting perspective and feel even more dated in terms of the production. Still, I like “The Scaffold”, and “Skyline Pigeon” is of course a great song as well. “Skyline Pigeon” is an important song in the Elton John catalog. Written as far back as the summer of 1968, Elton and Bernie considered it a real breakthrough in their songwriting partnership, a song that had its own unique style and didn’t feel patterned after anyone else. And, to Brown’s credit, he does create this unique atmosphere in his production. It’s just Elton on vocals, harpsichord and organ and it has this very Baroque feel to it. The vocal was recorded on the DJM studios fire escape, making it sound like Elton’s in some sort of echo chamber, which fits the song’s theme of wanting freedom.

As much as I love “Skyline Pigeon”, the song following it, “Gulliver”, is my favorite song on the album. Telling the tale of a dead dog, this folk rock song highlights some really excellent guitar and piano playing between Caleb and Elton. I especially love how the organ sounds after the first chorus; it’s almost as though you can vision the funeral on the farm that the child is giving his dog. It’s a really atmospheric song with great playing from all involved and makes for a satisfying end to the alb...

...It’s not over. Yeah, instead of ending with the obvious choice, they instead decided to segue into a jazzy instrumental called “Hay Chewed” (and yes, the song you’re inevitably thinking of was an intentional reference). It’s not bad; it’s kind of cool to hear the band just letting loose and having fun, but it doesn’t really reach a solid conclusion and leads into an awkward “Reprise” section where they basically play snippets of each song again. This apparently was commonly used on albums back then, and I could see this practice working on albums that are all tied to a specific theme, but this one doesn’t feel that well edited and further ruins the flow of what could have been a great album ending in “Gulliver”.

So, overall, EMPTY SKY is a fun, but still somewhat naive album that shows Elton and Bernie already had a gift for writing interesting songs. I can see why Elton still has such fond memories of it.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 15, 2022, 09:48:15 PM
I was checking out the Wikipedia page and it appears EMPTY SKY did not get a a U.S. release until 1975.  Now I imagine there must have been some hardcore fans of Reggie’s who scoured the import bins and spent a higher price on this thing beforehand, but still.  Shows that Elton hadn’t quite made it commercially yet.  I don’t remember if I told this story before, but a co-worker of mine from years back got married in 1970 in England to a British husband and claims an unknown Elton John played her wedding.  It makes a good story, anyway.

I agree with the idea this still sounds like Elton and Bernie were still trying to find their identity as a team.  None of the songs here are terrible but a lot of it does sound like trying to fit into the times.  David Bowie went through a very similar thing early on before finding himself around the exact same time, even down to the obscure early recordings.  The title track indeed does have some influence from “Sympathy For the Devil,” but is still a good song.  One thing I like about Elton is that as much as he always aims for the pop hit, he’s not only about that.  He’ll go for the longer, more progressive piece and is not afraid of a bit of adventure.  I have a thing for the harpsichord stuff so I actually liked “Val-Halla.”  Baroque pop stuff, but I can recall The Kinks and The Zombies also doing that kind of thing so yeah, Elton is searching here. 

I remember thinking “Western Ford Gateway” had some awkward stereo mixing in the vocals for a bit and made me wonder what the mono version sounds like.  “Hymn 2000” got an eyebrow raise from me.  That flute intro sounds an awful lot like Jethro Tull’s “Cross Eyed Mary,” except this predates the more famous Tull song by two years.  Heck, the AQUALUNG album even has a song called “Hymn 43.”  I’m really starting to think Ian Anderson heard this album. 

“Skyline Pigeon” is indeed the standout.  Cool harpsichord and the lyrics are again, very cinematic.  Just a cool tune overall.  The sentiment of not being a fully realized album but the potential is there - I agree with this.  Doesn’t the next album have “Your Song?”  That alone beats anything here.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 16, 2022, 10:21:56 AM
I was checking out the Wikipedia page and it appears EMPTY SKY did not get a a U.S. release until 1975.  Now I imagine there must have been some hardcore fans of Reggie’s who scoured the import bins and spent a higher price on this thing beforehand, but still.  Shows that Elton hadn’t quite made it commercially yet.  I don’t remember if I told this story before, but a co-worker of mine from years back got married in 1970 in England to a British husband and claims an unknown Elton John played her wedding.  It makes a good story, anyway.

I agree with the idea this still sounds like Elton and Bernie were still trying to find their identity as a team.  None of the songs here are terrible but a lot of it does sound like trying to fit into the times.  David Bowie went through a very similar thing early on before finding himself around the exact same time, even down to the obscure early recordings.  The title track indeed does have some influence from “Sympathy For the Devil,” but is still a good song.  One thing I like about Elton is that as much as he always aims for the pop hit, he’s not only about that.  He’ll go for the longer, more progressive piece and is not afraid of a bit of adventure.  I have a thing for the harpsichord stuff so I actually liked “Val-Halla.”  Baroque pop stuff, but I can recall The Kinks and The Zombies also doing that kind of thing so yeah, Elton is searching here. 

I remember thinking “Western Ford Gateway” had some awkward stereo mixing in the vocals for a bit and made me wonder what the mono version sounds like.  “Hymn 2000” got an eyebrow raise from me.  That flute intro sounds an awful lot like Jethro Tull’s “Cross Eyed Mary,” except this predates the more famous Tull song by two years.  Heck, the AQUALUNG album even has a song called “Hymn 43.”  I’m really starting to think Ian Anderson heard this album. 

“Skyline Pigeon” is indeed the standout.  Cool harpsichord and the lyrics are again, very cinematic.  Just a cool tune overall.  The sentiment of not being a fully realized album but the potential is there - I agree with this.  Doesn’t the next album have “Your Song?”  That alone beats anything here.

Mono pressings of EMPTY SKY are extremely rare and expensive, so I unfortunately can’t tell you how that sounds, but I do see what you mean regarding the stereo vocals. There is something kind of off about it, but it personally never really bothered me.

The idea of Elton playing a wedding back then isn’t totally unbelievable. Prior to Troubadour, he was pretty much still a regular session musician during the day and a lot of the venues he did play live were much smaller things like college shows or country clubs. Sadly, there’s not a ton of information on pre-Troubadour venues/setlists.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on January 17, 2022, 03:06:28 AM
The intro track is a great start to the album. They went all out for it, it has an epic feel. Elton John's vocals reminded me of Mick Jagger here. The song was 8 minutes long but didn't feel like iot. I agree with Metaldams "Val-Hala" is a good track, one of those songs that make me think of being a child in my parent's car driving past corn fields. A lot of the lighter songs give me that feeling, including "Lady What's Tomorrow", "The Scaffold" and "Gulliver".

I like the two later rock songs that are included "Western Ford Gateway" and "Sails". I'm noticing more of that hard rock/blues influenced type of music showing up later in the 1960s, it's also noticeable in the White Album. Before everybody was psychedelic, now they're getting into hard rock. Reading your opening statement about Regimental Sgt. Zippo suggests Elton John went through the some sort of transition like that.

OK with the end track I love jazz, so even if it's comes out of nowhere I still had a lot of fun listening to it. It shows Elton John could have been a jazz musician! I'm he occasionally has more jazz influenced songs in the future. May have been unnecessary, but it sounded good to my ears so I won't complain. Now the reprisals didn't make sense to me. That's something I would expect to hear in ending for a documentary or a biopic, not at the end of an album I just listened to.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 17, 2022, 09:10:35 AM
I guess I should have been a little more clear on Val-Hala. I don’t dislike it, I just think it kind of pales compared to the other few Elton harpsichord-focused songs, including “Tartan Coloured Lady” from ZIPPO. I like most of the ZIPPO tracks, but “Tartan Coloured Lady” is the only one I feel could have been on a later album. Here’s the JEWEL BOX version, which is the same one that appears on ZIPPO.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: hiramhorwitz on January 20, 2022, 02:48:31 PM
Lady Samantha/All Across the Havens: The A-side is more in the direction Elton and Bernie wanted to take. Encouraged by producer Steve Brown to write more about what interested them, this is a much more unique song than “I’ve Been Loving You”. Elton plays organ and electric piano on this song, and the organ is a really good fit for its depressing theme. I also really like Caleb Quaye’s guitar playing and Roger Pope’s drumming. Both would figure prominently on Elton’s earliest albums and really excelled at heavier rock pieces. The B-side was All Across the Havens, a lighter song I’ve never been a huge fan of, although I kind of like the ragtime piano intro that recurs throughout.

It’s Me That You Need/Just Like Strange Rain: The A-side of this was a bit out of left field for Elton at the time. Released a few weeks before EMPTY SKY, this attempted to present an Elton closer to the one that would be prominent on the ELTON JOHN album in 1970. Unlike I’ve Been Loving You and most of the ZIPPO era tracks ( “Tartan Coloured Lady” being an exception), the orchestra here does not take a pop or overly-sentimental approach, but does feel a bit more in line with the classical approach on ELTON JOHN; heck, I’d argue it does it better than some tracks on ELTON JOHN, since it doesn’t completely overtake the song; Caleb’s acoustic and electric guitar playing is still prominent throughout and when it’s all over, the focus is back on Elton and his piano. It’s a very nice ballad. The B-side, “Just Like Strange Rain”, is a fun rock song that was actually a leftover from EMPTY SKY that should have made the album. Lyrically, it’s very psychedelic, something that would not have been too uncommon in the ZIPPO era. Like “Lady Samantha”, it’s supported by some excellent drumming from Roger Pope and an ending that allows Caleb Quaye to have fun with his guitar playing.
Sam, I appreciate the history you provided regarding Lady Samantha and It's Me that You Need.  I found out about these two songs when I first purchased MCA's 1973 release of them on opposite sides of a 45 rpm vinyl disk, during my high school years.  Here are scans of the front and back of that 45, in the unlikely event you haven't seen this version before.  I still listen to the 45, and remember the day I first loaded the platter onto my turntable, to find out how the early John singles fared.  Two other of my favorite 45 John releases include Young Man's Blues and Cold Highway.  I definitely find it hard to believe I first obtained these singles about half a century ago.  Yikes!
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 20, 2022, 05:27:20 PM
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 20, 2022, 08:46:17 PM
Sam, I appreciate the history you provided regarding Lady Samantha and It's Me that You Need.  I found out about these two songs when I first purchased MCA's 1973 release of them on opposite sides of a 45 rpm vinyl disk, during my high school years.  Here are scans of the front and back of that 45, in the unlikely event you haven't seen this version before.  I still listen to the 45, and remember the day I first loaded the platter onto my turntable, to find out how the early John singles fared.  Two other of my favorite 45 John releases include Young Man's Blues and Cold Highway.  I definitely find it hard to believe I first obtained these singles about half a century ago.  Yikes!

Thanks for sharing. I was aware there was an MCA pressing at some point, but I’d never actually seen them. Always cool to see the various vinyl releases.

ELTON JOHN review coming either tomorrow or Saturday.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 21, 2022, 04:07:53 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/bd/Elton_John_-_Elton_John.jpg)

After EMPTY SKY’s release, Elton and Bernie kept writing more and more songs, enough so that they actually were able to get two albums’ worth of material out of them (a bit more on that when we get to TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION). Initially, things looked like they might proceed in a similar fashion to EMPTY SKY. In 1969, a few months after EMPTY SKY’s release, Steve Brown recorded run-throughs of some of these songs with Elton and Caleb’s band Hookfoot. In the end, though, Brown came to the conclusion that he was not the right man for the job and instead found arranger Paul Buckmaster and producer Gus Dudgeon, both fresh off working on David Bowie’s “Space Oddity” and both would play an important part throughout the Elton John journey.

For the first album based on this new material, Gus and Paul took a completely different approach. Instead of using a regular band, session musicians were hired, making Caleb the only musician besides Elton to be involved in these sessions, and even he doesn’t appear on that many tracks. And on top of that was the orchestra, which brought an extra layer to the proceedings that gave the album and Elton their initial identities. It both worked for and against him…more on that in a moment.

It starts off with some song called “Your Song”. Of course it’s a classic, we all know that and, yeah, it’s completely deserving of that. The source of inspiration for Elton and Bernie songs has often not been very clear; unlike Lennon-McCartney, they’re usually more willing to let others find their own interpretations. With “Your Song”, Elton had previously claimed it was about Bernie’s girlfriend at the time, while Bernie claimed it was about everyone. I have no idea who’s right, but I think Bernie’s interpretation speaks as to why the song works so well: it’s spoken to the audience, and gives a very positive message.

It’s then followed by “I Need You To Turn To”, which again features Elton on harpsichord. Interestingly, much like “Your Song”, it’s again using the second person. The harpsichord playing is nice and the orchestra is subtle enough that it provides the appropriate backup.

“Take Me to the Pilot” was actually originally an A-Side with “Your Song” as the B-Side, but people tended to prefer the latter when playing it on the radio. But “Take Me to the Pilot” is still a fun song. I especially love the little orchestra flourishes after Elton sings “Take me to the pilot for control”.

“No Shoestrings on Louise” is another Rolling Stones tribute, and you can really hear the Jagger influence in Elton’s vocals. It’s really fun, and the background singers make it even more fun to listen to.

The middle is where things go a bit downhill. “First Episode at Hienton” is kind of a boring song that gets weird due to its use of the Moog synthesizer. The Moog was an instrument that could work, and there is a better example on this album, but here it sounds like a flying saucer is about to abduct Elton while he’s just trying to sing this ballad that has nothing to do with that!

“Sixty Years On” is my least favorite song on the album. The song itself is not the problem (17-11-70 is proof of that), but rather the issue is the ridiculously overdone arrangement. It starts with this weird string part at the beginning that wasn’t even supposed to be part of the song; it was just a random thing Buckmaster recorded and Gus decided to attach it to the beginning of the song. Then the song essentially becomes a showcase for Buckmaster to demonstrate how he uses strings and harp, and…my gosh, it’s so boring! I appreciate certain classical music, but it’s got to have a melody that truly supports it, and this doesn’t. This was meant to be a heavier rock song, as evidenced by the way Elton played the chords on the demo, and instead of following that, Buckmaster had Elton not even play piano at all on it. No, it’s not always a bad thing for Elton to be on vocals only; TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION is proof of that. But this one takes it to a point where it doesn’t even sound like an Elton John song at all, but rather a song he’s the guest on…and let me tell you, considering how many styles Elton covers, that’s pretty hard to do!

Things improve with the next song, “Border Song”, which is a spiritual-like number featuring a much more subtle arrangement backed by a choir. I really like this song; the piano’s in the forefront, Elton’s voice is great, and I especially love the drumming. Actually, the drumming is really good throughout the record in general. The main drummers were Barry Morgan and Terry Cox, both of whom create this incredibly full drum sound that I haven’t hear on many other records. In his book on Elton, TIN PAN ALLEY, Keith Hayward mentions Morgan was hired because he had the ability to make his tom-tom drum sound like an orchestra timpani, and I can hear that in both Morgan and Cox’s work. I love Nigel Olsson, and he also created a full drum sound in his own way, but the drumming style here is its own unique thing that contributes to giving the album its own identity.

“The Greatest Discovery” is another one I’m not a huge fan of. I like the trumpets on it, but overall, it’s another song that kind of bores me and while not nearly as bad as in “Sixty Years On”, it has another drawn out orchestral intro.

“The Cage” picks things up again with a cool, upbeat melody. The drumming, guitar, and bass playing are all excellent and this one does make good use of the Moog synthesizer for the middle instrumental section. It works here because the song is a dark song and it properly contributes to that atmosphere.

And finally, there’s “The King Must Die”, the very definition of grand ending. I love everything about this song; I love the way it starts with just Elton on piano, the way the trumpets come in and really give off this regal sound, the drums that sound like a legitimate orchestral timpani, the way Elton keeps singing “the king is dead” in the coda only to pause and then leave us with a chilling ending…gosh, this song is just so good. This is where the balance between Elton and Buckmaster is at its best. The orchestra does provide a really great support to Elton…but they’re still support. At the end of the day, it’s still Elton who’s leading the charge; just listen to the way he bangs the chords out after the second chorus and try telling me Buckmaster and Dudgeon didn’t realize this! It’s often a toss-up between this and “Your Song” for my favorite song on the album. At the moment, I’m leaning towards this, but tomorrow it could very well be “Your Song”; both songs just have such a great impact in two totally different ways.

ELTON JOHN is an album full of great songs and professional production that usually works very well. But at the same time, I do see what Elton meant when he later said he feared getting labeled specifically as that type of act. There are some cases where Buckmaster and Dudgeon felt like they were going a bit too overboard with the arrangements and lost sight of who they were working with. Luckily, they would not repeat this mistake and, again, it’s only really a problem on a few songs; most of them do benefit from their work and are really memorable songs. Overall, a good album that just has a few flaws that would be worked out in the future.

And now, for the singles:

“Bad Side of the Moon” was the B-Side to the “Border Song” single. This song actually did become a hit in Canada, but it was for a band called April Wine. Every time I drive up to Canada, I somehow manage to catch this on a classic rock station. Elton’s version is great; I love the fade-in with the snare drum and the lead guitar playing as well. Elton doesn’t play piano here, but it works because the musicians properly support the style he was going for, and the orchestra adds an extra flair. I think the album could have benefited from its inclusion; it could have easily replaced “Sixty Years On”.

“Rock and Roll Madonna” was a single-only A-side that was actually recorded at the beginning of the TUMBLEWEED sessions, but it’s usually associated with this album due to being released close to it. This is another early instance where I think Dudgeon made the wrong decision. The song is played kind of slow and he put in these crowd effects, which was an idea he would successfully use for atmosphere later on “Bennie and the Jets”, but here it comes across as them trying to make the song sound more impressive than it actually was. When Giles Martin recorded his version of this song for the ROCKETMAN soundtrack, he made a good decision and modeled it after the faster and looser Steve Brown version instead.

And finally, we have “Madonna”’s B-Side, “Grey Seal”, which some of you may recognize as it was later re-recorded for GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD. Overall, the song itself is great and I do think the arrangement here works. It’s a nice version, but I still prefer the YELLOW BRICK ROAD version. It feels much more at home on that album whereas here it was a fascinating outlier; lyrically, it had a bit of a mythological thing going, which was actually more in line with what was on EMPTY SKY. It just needed a few years before it could properly get the spotlight and when it did, it delivered.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 21, 2022, 05:43:09 PM
      I’ve listened to ELTON JOHN twice. I enjoyed it in the first listen and enjoyed it more on the second listen - always a good sign.  “Your Song” I obviously know and it is unquestionably a classic.  One of those perfect pop songs.  I also have some familiarity with “Border Song” and “Take Me To the Pilot” which are the more joyous and upbeat songs on the album.  Good stuff.

      “No Shoe Strings on Louise” is indeed very Stones like.  Not only does Elton sound like Mick, but the drunken backing vocals even sound like Keith Richards!  Here’s the thing though.  This song was recorded in 1970 and this track sounds like an outtake for 1972’s EXILE ON MAIN STREET so if anything, this sounds like it’s anticipating the Stones.  Yeah, the Stones did country rock on BEGGAR’S BANQUET, but it didn’t sound this full until Exile.

      I actually really dig the symphonic stuff and that includes “Sixty Years On” and especially “First Episode at Hienton.”  Perhaps this kind of thing isn’t standard Elton, I don’t know.  It reminds me of the progressive pop stuff of the time like The Moody Blues and Procol Harum.  I dig that sound and I like moody stuff like that.  “I Need You To Turn To” and “The King Must Die” are really awesome too.  Again, the moody arrangements and epic sounding nature is pretty aligned with my taste.

      Overall, this sounds like a much more confident and consistent album than EMPTY SKY.  Looking forward to the next several.
     

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 21, 2022, 10:21:41 PM
      I’ve listened to ELTON JOHN twice. I enjoyed it in the first listen and enjoyed it more on the second listen - always a good sign.  “Your Song” I obviously know and it is unquestionably a classic.  One of those perfect pop songs.  I also have some familiarity with “Border Song” and “Take Me To the Pilot” which are the more joyous and upbeat songs on the album.  Good stuff.

      “No Shoe Strings on Louise” is indeed very Stones like.  Not only does Elton sound like Mick, but the drunken backing vocals even sound like Keith Richards!  Here’s the thing though.  This song was recorded in 1970 and this track sounds like an outtake for 1972’s EXILE ON MAIN STREET so if anything, this sounds like it’s anticipating the Stones.  Yeah, the Stones did country rock on BEGGAR’S BANQUET, but it didn’t sound this full until Exile.

      I actually really dig the symphonic stuff and that includes “Sixty Years On” and especially “First Episode at Hienton.”  Perhaps this kind of thing isn’t standard Elton, I don’t know.  It reminds me of the progressive pop stuff of the time like The Moody Blues and Procol Harum.  I dig that sound and I like moody stuff like that.  “I Need You To Turn To” and “The King Must Die” are really awesome too.  Again, the moody arrangements and epic sounding nature is pretty aligned with my taste.

      Overall, this sounds like a much more confident and consistent album than EMPTY SKY.  Looking forward to the next several.
     

The symphonic stuff is kind of an “on-off” thing in those earlier years; it’s only on a few songs on TUMBLEWEED whereas it returns full swing on MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER. I do like this part of Elton’s career; the orchestra often does add a really great edge to songs like “The King Must Die” and “Madman Across the Water”. It’s just those few songs I mentioned in my review that I think they kind of misfired on, especially the overextended intros on “Sixty Years On” and “The Greatest Discovery”. Pretty much every time they used an orchestra after this album, though, they got it right. There’s a really excellent concert from 1972 at the Royal Festival Hall where he performed with a full orchestra; “Tiny Dancer” and “Madman Across the Water” were especially excellent performances at that show.

Here’s something I always thought was interesting. Around the time of this album’s release, Elton did a special where he performed some of the songs on the album with Buckmaster and the orchestra. It’s one of his earliest TV appearances, but what interests me most is, when he plays “I Need You To Turn To”, he actually plays it on the harpsichord. To my knowledge, this is the only time he ever played this instrument live.



Glad you liked the album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on January 22, 2022, 10:20:17 PM
"Your Song" is a song I've heard a lot but never actually knew it was called. I assumed it was called "I Hope You Don't Mind". I also didn't know the instrument in "I Need You to Turn To" was called a harpischord. It makes me think of medieval Europe and royalty, whether it was used then or not.

"Take Me to the Pilot" is a groovy song that had me moving my feet. I liked when the guitar in the second verse and in the solo. The nanana scat singing was also fun. "No Shoe Strings on Louise" is a good follow-up. He does sound like Mick Jagger here. He's got a pretty diverse vocal style, if I didn't know better I might not catch that it was the same singer. The piano playing is also enjoyable, it reminds me of boogie woogie.

Aside from power ballads I've never been the biggest fan of them for the most part. Your description made me laugh, that sounds like the plot for a cheesy sci-fi horror.

I actually liked "Sixty Years On". Once or twice on an album a song like that can be pretty effective. Music in this orchestral style always sound like film score music to me. "Border Song" gives me a church feeling. The way Elton sings in addition to the backing music reminds me of gospel music. My mom might hate that but I don't.

"The Cage" is more of my style. It sort of has a funk and R&B feel. The synthesizer break is different, but it goes right back.

I've heard "Bad Side of the Moon" quite a bit, I didn't even realize it was a cover. April Wine are played quite a bit in Canada, another song of theirs that gets played a lot is "Sign of the Gypsy Queen" that is also a cover. There are quite a few bands that get a lot of airplay in Canada and I wonder if they are known in the U.S.

I stated a few times in the Beatles thread that I really like 1950s style rock and roll, so "Rock and Roll Madonna" is is one of my favorite songs of this bunch. I agree with the crowd noise, it disrupts the music. I see no need for that outside of live performances.

The ending for "Grey Seal" was excellent. The vocals, pianos and strings made for an epic climax.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 22, 2022, 10:39:19 PM
Yeah, I was shocked to hear Elton and April Wine linked together.  I definitely know “Sign of the Gypsy Queen.”

….and a harpsichord is a baroque era instrument.  Goes back to Bach.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 23, 2022, 08:58:21 AM
"Your Song" is a song I've heard a lot but never actually knew it was called. I assumed it was called "I Hope You Don't Mind". I also didn't know the instrument in "I Need You to Turn To" was called a harpischord. It makes me think of medieval Europe and royalty, whether it was used then or not.

"Take Me to the Pilot" is a groovy song that had me moving my feet. I liked when the guitar in the second verse and in the solo. The nanana scat singing was also fun. "No Shoe Strings on Louise" is a good follow-up. He does sound like Mick Jagger here. He's got a pretty diverse vocal style, if I didn't know better I might not catch that it was the same singer. The piano playing is also enjoyable, it reminds me of boogie woogie.

Aside from power ballads I've never been the biggest fan of them for the most part. Your description made me laugh, that sounds like the plot for a cheesy sci-fi horror.

I actually liked "Sixty Years On". Once or twice on an album a song like that can be pretty effective. Music in this orchestral style always sound like film score music to me. "Border Song" gives me a church feeling. The way Elton sings in addition to the backing music reminds me of gospel music. My mom might hate that but I don't.

"The Cage" is more of my style. It sort of has a funk and R&B feel. The synthesizer break is different, but it goes right back.

I've heard "Bad Side of the Moon" quite a bit, I didn't even realize it was a cover. April Wine are played quite a bit in Canada, another song of theirs that gets played a lot is "Sign of the Gypsy Queen" that is also a cover. There are quite a few bands that get a lot of airplay in Canada and I wonder if they are known in the U.S.

I stated a few times in the Beatles thread that I really like 1950s style rock and roll, so "Rock and Roll Madonna" is is one of my favorite songs of this bunch. I agree with the crowd noise, it disrupts the music. I see no need for that outside of live performances.

The ending for "Grey Seal" was excellent. The vocals, pianos and strings made for an epic climax.

One thing about Elton is that you can find connections to things you wouldn’t even imagine, April Wine being a perfect example. Elton hasn’t played this song live since the mid-1970s, so it doesn’t surprise me that many people don’t know it was his song.

Fair enough regarding “Sixty Years On”, and I know people who do like this version. You’re right, the middle section does kind of sound like something you’d hear in a ‘70s/‘80s horror film. It’s just not really my style; my cutoff for horror films is probably sometime in the 1960s. The 17-11-70 version is the definitive version of this song to me.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 23, 2022, 10:22:24 AM
I think I may have mentioned this before, but Elton plays piano on a couple of tracks from Saxon’s 1986 album, ROCK THE NATIONS.  A traditional British metal band with Elton.  “Northern Lady,” which Elton plays on, is a cool song.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 28, 2022, 12:29:09 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c7/Elton_John_-_Tumbleweed_Connection.jpg)

TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION is a special kind of album. It’s the only studio album in Elton John’s classic period which doesn’t ever have tracks included in Greatest Hits compilations, as the album didn’t have any singles released (“Your Song” started to gain some traction around this time). As such, it’s an album of discovery; one that shows a side of Elton that’s not really known to most fans of the current generation.

Inspired by the likes of Laura Nyro, David Ackles and especially the Band’s MUSIC FROM BIG PINK, TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION is an Americana-focused album. Considering the fact that it was released after Elton’s famous Troubadour shows, one might assume it was written after visiting America for the first time. In fact, this album was entirely written and recorded before Elton and Bernie had set foot in America; heck, some of them were written before a lot of the ELTON JOHN songs (a cover version of “Son of Your Father” was released the same month as EMPTY SKY).

Gus Dudgeon and Paul Buckmaster were both back for this album, but unlike the previous album, there was a more band-oriented approach and only a select number of songs had orchestrations. There still are some similarities to ELTON JOHN; various lineups are used instead of one consistent one, for example. But overall the mood was quite different to the ELTON JOHN album, which was good because it showed already how versatile Elton was.

It starts off with “Ballad of a Well-Known Gun”, a great song that has this really interesting delayed guitar intro. I really love the energy on this one; the interplay between Elton and Caleb, the cowbell, the backing vocals…it’s such a good number to open with. The backing band on this and a decent amount of other songs on this album was Caleb’s band Hookfoot, who usually backed Elton for his 1969 live shows and who also specialized in blues and progressive numbers, making them a great lineup for these types of songs.

The second song is “Come Down in Time”, which is more in line with the previous album’s songs. The arrangement is lighter; it makes use especially out of the harp and the oboe. Elton doesn’t play piano on it, but that’s OK because the light arrangement is so beautiful that that’s all it really needed. And Elton gives such a great vocal performance here; you can really here the sorrow in his voice, especially during the verses.

The third song, “Country Comfort” is more of a generic country song compared to the others on the album. I still like it, though. The chorus is catchy, the steel guitar is cool, and the addition of violin and harmonica adds a nice touch.

“Son of Your Father” is one of those great, unknown Elton songs that I wish more people knew about. To be fair, I could say that about most of the songs on this album, but “Son of Your Father” feels like the one that’s really flown under the radar. It does appear on a couple BBC set lists from 1969 and probably was done live by Elton and Hookfoot at some point, but it’s the only song on the album that has no documented live performance post-Troubadour. Once again, Hookfoot is backing Elton and when combined with the really energetic backing vocals and a subtle brass arrangement from Buckmaster, it creates this really fun, upbeat, bluesy sound that’s not really present on most other Elton recordings.

“My Father’s Gun” is probably my least favorite song on the album, but that doesn’t mean it’s a bad song. Heck, Bob Dylan apparently mentioned this song specifically when he first met Elton and Bernie. It’s in the same key as “Son of Your Father”, had the same backing band…heck, it was even recorded on the same day. But unlike “Son of Your Father”, repetition gets in the way of this one; the ending goes on forever, and unlike something like “Empty Sky”, where a lot of different stuff is going on to keep it from dragging, this consists of Elton and the backing vocalists repeating the same lyrics over and over again. I think Elton himself may have realized this, because the few existing live recordings of this song never reach 5 minutes, and they play better as a result.

Remember when I mentioned “great, unknown Elton John songs that I wish more people knew about?” “Where to Now St. Peter?” really fits this description. Telling a tale of a dead soldier and the afterlife, this one creates a very unique atmosphere with Caleb’s Leslie guitar effects, Dee Murray and Nigel Olsson’s surprisingly very high pitched voices, and a beautiful piano part from Elton. It’s one of his most progressive pieces, an area he really excelled at.

“Love Song” is actually not an Elton composition, but was instead written by Lesley Duncan, who had quite the interesting career of her own. In addition to performing backing vocals for Elton on his early albums, her work included singing lead on an Alan Parsons Project song and backing vocals on Pink Floyd’s DARK SIDE OF THE MOON. She also was a singer-songwriter, and “Love Song” was probably her most famous composition. I know some people have argued against its inclusion, but of all the albums to include it on, I think this makes the most sense. It’s an album of artistic integrity and I think the song with its light acoustic arrangement fits that bill just right. And, there’s also the fact that I like the song; the light arrangement does work and it is nice to hear just him and Lesley performing together. She really had a great voice; very Karen Carpenter-like, a type of voice you don’t hear often.

That’s followed by “Amoreena”, which features Caleb on guitar, Dee Murray on bass, and Nigel Olsson on drums, the latter two by this point already having become part of the official Elton John Band. Unlike Hookfoot, they didn’t have a certain specialty, which made them more suited for Elton in the long run; they could play pop music in addition to the more progressive stuff, and they had a real chemistry with Elton; whether it was just them or them with Davey, they sounded like a real unit, not just backing musicians, and that can be heard clearly even here. The playing is just so tight; there’s the right balance between the piano, the drums, the bass and Caleb’s guitar. Yeah, Hookfoot was great too (I mean, come on, this is the band that played on “Tiny Dancer”), but they were their own act with their own interests; Dee and Nigel were in it for the long haul and that reflects in their varying styles throughout the years. And of course, it helps that the song itself is catchy too.

“Talking Old Soldiers” features just Elton on piano and vocals with no backing band, and it was the perfect choice to do so. The tale of an old soldier at a bar remembering the tragedies he’s seen, the piano-only decision really captures that lonely atmosphere of a bar. It doesn’t have a standard musical structure; no chorus or anything, it really is just Elton singing this story, and doing it very well with this complicated piano piece.

Then there’s “Burn Down the Mission”, another complicated song musically. Overall, it’s an effective ending; the sudden changes for the instrumental sections are really cool, and Buckmaster provided a suitable arrangement. But this is a song that overall works better live than in the studio, especially in that first year. It’s a song that already has so many chord changes, so being able to change to other songs in the middle of it makes complete sense, and it made for such an effective closer on 17-11-70. The studio version is still good, though; Elton’s piano playing in the fadeout is really cool and I like the way the orchestra builds up in the final vocal section.

And, finally, we have the only B-side from these sessions, “Into the Old Man’s Shoes”, which was the B-Side to the UK release of “Your Song”. And it is a shame that a song this beautiful had to get cut from the album. I understand why; there were already so many worthy candidates, but it’s still a wonderful song that deserved more attention. It tells the tale of a man who has to deal with standing in the shadow of his late father. Bernie really could tell such interesting stories with these lyrics, and Elton delivers it with a wonderful vocal performance backed by Hookfoot and another really good Buckmaster arrangement. There is a certain other song that was recorded during these sessions, but it wasn’t released at the time and I think it makes more sense to talk about it during the next album discussion.

TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION is an essential album in the Elton John journey. The various stories in Bernie’s lyrics combined with the excellent atmosphere created by the musicians with each song make this such a wonderful experience. Metaldams mentioned in the PARANOID discussion the overkill regarding the earlier Black Sabbath albums in live performances and how he wished there would be more attention from fans to the other albums. This is the album I really wish Elton would play more live tracks from; he brought “Burn Down the Mission” back for the farewell tour, but I find it unlikely any other songs from it will surface before his retirement. It’s not my absolute favorite Elton album, but it comes very close. Such a wonderful album, highly recommended.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on January 29, 2022, 02:49:27 AM
Safe to say this is my favorite album so far. I've never really listened to country, but I do like southern influenced rock.

"Ballad of a Well-Known-Gun" is different from what I expected after seeing the title. I thought it would be more of a, well, ballad. It's not... and that makes it even better! Terrific opening with excellent guitar and piano playing. I like the high pitched vocalists at the end, do you know who's doing them?

"Come Down in Time" and "Country Comfort" are my least favorite songs on the album. That's not to say they are bad songs, they are just not as good as the rest of the album (which is a pretty high standard).

"Son of Your Father" is a very fun song. I think it could have been a big hit, it's very catchy and it seems like the type of song my mom would like. I wonder if she's aware of it, I'll probably show it to her. I like "My Father's Gun", but I agree it could have been shorter.

You said what I was thinking when I heard "Where to Now St. Peter?" in that the piano playing is very beautiful. In "Love Song" it's the guitar that is beautiful. I also think the harmonies are pretty good here. "Amoreena" is the only song I was familiar with because it was featured in the opening of the movie Dog Day Afternoon. It was actually the first song I really liked by Elton John and made me want to discover more of his music.

"Talking Old Soldiers" is a song I could imagine him playing at a public appearance by himself. It's all him and he's a good enough singer and pianist that's all you need. "Burn Down the Mission" was the perfect way to end the album as it has an epic feel. The end of the song fires on all cylinders.

"Into the Old Man's Shoes" is a wonderful song. It's a good thing you and metaldams mention the singles that the bands release, I probably I would have missed a lot of songs otherwise.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 29, 2022, 09:18:29 AM
Safe to say this is my favorite album so far. I've never really listened to country, but I do like southern influenced rock.

"Ballad of a Well-Known-Gun" is different from what I expected after seeing the title. I thought it would be more of a, well, ballad. It's not... and that makes it even better! Terrific opening with excellent guitar and piano playing. I like the high pitched vocalists at the end, do you know who's doing them?

"Come Down in Time" and "Country Comfort" are my least favorite songs on the album. That's not to say they are bad songs, they are just not as good as the rest of the album (which is a pretty high standard).

"Son of Your Father" is a very fun song. I think it could have been a big hit, it's very catchy and it seems like the type of song my mom would like. I wonder if she's aware of it, I'll probably show it to her. I like "My Father's Gun", but I agree it could have been shorter.

You said what I was thinking when I heard "Where to Now St. Peter?" in that the piano playing is very beautiful. In "Love Song" it's the guitar that is beautiful. I also think the harmonies are pretty good here. "Amoreena" is the only song I was familiar with because it was featured in the opening of the movie Dog Day Afternoon. It was actually the first song I really liked by Elton John and made me want to discover more of his music.

"Talking Old Soldiers" is a song I could imagine him playing at a public appearance by himself. It's all him and he's a good enough singer and pianist that's all you need. "Burn Down the Mission" was the perfect way to end the album as it has an epic feel. The end of the song fires on all cylinders.

"Into the Old Man's Shoes" is a wonderful song. It's a good thing you and metaldams mention the singles that the bands release, I probably I would have missed a lot of songs otherwise.

These are the backing vocalists on “Ballad of a Well-Known Gun”:
Dusty Springfield
Lesley Duncan
Madeline Bell
Kay Garner
Tony Burrows
Tony Hazzard

Yeah, I meant to mention DOG DAY AFTERNOON, but couldn’t fit it in. Such an unusual choice to pick, but it clearly worked; lots of people tend to associate it with this movie.

Glad you’re enjoying the singles, too. B-Sides tend to get unfairly overlooked in album discussions, which is why I’m glad we decided to include them in our discussions.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 29, 2022, 10:11:02 AM
      OK, so I gave TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION a listen.  First off, I can totally understand why Elton doesn’t play most of these songs live.  He has a huge catalog and has a ton of hits.  As much as I complain about Black Sabbath and PARANOID, Sabbath were not really a hits oriented band beyond that.  So because Elton has all these hits, I can imagine Elton attracting all these extremely casual fans, the type who watch American Idol to discover new artists (my Mom is in that category, I had to explain to her who Steven Tyler was when he was a judge on that show).  All those normies buying Elton tickets and Elton only has two hours with songs to pick from thirty plus albums.  Of course he plays the hits.  Yeah, you hardcore Elton fans who rightly know Elton is deeper and better than that, I can truly imagine the lack of hearing these songs live driving you mad.

      This definitely is a rootsier album in parts and at least on side one, had really big production.  With this style of music, the more low key it is, the more immediate for me.  I appreciate NASHVILLE SKYLINE from Dylan because it was recorded in two minutes.  With The Stones, STICKY FINGERS was more immediate to me than EXILE ON MAIN STREET.  I can see parallels again with that latter album and this album - roots oriented Americana with really big production.  Lots of gospel, really big and loud arrangements.  I now love EXILE ON MAIN STREET, but it took me a while.  I could picture the same thing happening with TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION if I took a year long deep dive into classic Elton - which I just might do.

      Here’s another thing I noticed.  That big production I talked about?  I noticed as we get to side two of the album, things get sparser and that grabbed me more on first listen.  Though not written by Elton, I thought “Love Song” was beautiful.  Sparse arrangements and effective and simple two part vocal harmonies.  “Where to Now St. Peter?” is indeed a strong album side opener and Burn Down the Mission” is an appropriate closer.  “Talking Old Soldiers?”  Beautiful and personable.  The flow of the album is start with a bunch of big arrangements, take it down a notch on side two and then end with the big finale where the rhythm really pucks up.  Album construction like that is a lost art form these days.

      So yeah, upon immediate listen, the second half grabbed me more, but again, I can see this album being a grower.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 29, 2022, 02:36:59 PM
….and a question.  Will you be doing the live album?  Either way, I’ll give it a listen.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 29, 2022, 07:40:31 PM
….and a question.  Will you be doing the live album?  Either way, I’ll give it a listen.

It’s up to you guys. Originally I was planning to move on to MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER and briefly mention my favorite tracks from FRIENDS and 17-11-70, but I would be up for doing a whole post dedicated to 17-11-70, and I could even kind of work FRIENDS in there since one of the tracks played at the show was from that (FRIENDS wouldn’t get its own post since they only really wrote five songs for it and I refuse to see the supposedly awful movie it was associated with). Let me know what you guys want to do.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on January 29, 2022, 08:32:56 PM
It’s up to you guys. Originally I was planning to move on to MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER and briefly mention my favorite tracks from FRIENDS and 17-11-70, but I would be up for doing a whole post dedicated to 17-11-70, and I could even kind of work FRIENDS in there since one of the tracks played at the show was from that (FRIENDS wouldn’t get its own post since they only really wrote five songs for it and I refuse to see the supposedly awful movie it was associated with). Let me know what you guys want to do.

You’re the emcee and Elton expert so you present it relative to how important you think it is to the story.

With Sabbath, their first official live album wasn’t until 1982,  so I’m just thinking of mentioning it with the studio album they toured for and how it fits into the story (and fits into the story it does).

With Zeppelin, I think I’m giving Song Remains the Same it’s own entry because it has such a huge cult following.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on January 30, 2022, 11:41:51 AM
You’re the emcee and Elton expert so you present it relative to how important you think it is to the story.

With Sabbath, their first official live album wasn’t until 1982,  so I’m just thinking of mentioning it with the studio album they toured for and how it fits into the story (and fits into the story it does).

With Zeppelin, I think I’m giving Song Remains the Same it’s own entry because it has such a huge cult following.

Good point. I do think 17-11-70 is an important part of the Elton John story, so it’s settled. We will cover that next.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on February 04, 2022, 11:03:07 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/26/171170UK.jpg)

It cannot be said enough how important Elton John’s first U.S. tour was. While ELTON JOHN did sell better than EMPTY SKY even before then, it still wasn’t doing great at first and it wasn’t until after coming to America that the album sales really started to pick up, and it all started with the famous Troubadour shows in August 1970. In terms of recordings, only one promo film of Sixty Years On” is known to exist from any of the Troubadour shows.

Fast forward a few months, specifically to the date of November 17, 1970. Elton was in New York and would perform at the Fillmore East a few days later, opening for Leon Russell. On this specific day, though, he was at Phil Ramone’s recording studio, A&R Studios, performing his live act for a radio broadcast. The response was…well, fantastic judging from the crowd reaction in the studio! So fantastic that bootlegs of the broadcast began circulating. It’s been said that the live album was only released to fight bootlegs, which never made a ton of sense to me. If you weren’t planning to release it regardless, why would you want to suddenly cut into a market where sales would already not be as high, especially since they only picked specific tracks and not the full show.

Regardless, 17-11-70 became Elton’s first live album, and what a great live album it was. I decided this was important enough to be given its own discussion because, really, it shows the side of Elton that wasn’t on the records, the side that truly made Elton famous in the first place.

The band consisted of Elton, Dee Murray on bass, and Nigel Olsson on drums. Yes, you read that right. Even though he used guitarists on his recordings, the Elton John Band for this first tour did not have one. I love the guitar work on many of Elton’s songs, but this shows that Elton really didn’t need one in those early days. The three of them were such a unit that they could create an exciting, full sound with just the three of them.

The original record starts with “Take Me to the Pilot”, itself already an upbeat song. But here, the groove at the end is so much cooler. Dee actually gets bass solos, which is not something that’s common in Elton recordings. Dee was a very melodic bassist. He especially had to be here because a lot of these songs were lacking the orchestral arrangements and he had to fill in that sound.

We’ve spoken so much of the Rolling Stones and Elton connections in this thread that it should come as no surprise by this point that Elton and the band performed “Honky Tonk Women” at these early live shows. This one shows off the band’s fantastic vocal harmonies throughout the choruses; again, a reminder that only three people are on stage and not only do they play great together, but they can also sing well together at the same time. They didn’t even need additional backing vocalists!

I’ve spoken about this version of “Sixty Years On” a few times in this thread. As you guys know, I can’t stand the album version and for a while I did think the song itself was the problem, but when I heard this version, I realized that it truly was a great song. Quiet and piano focused in the verses, but with instrumental sections that are much more rock focused with Elton and Dee’s chords and Nigel really pounding the drums hard, it manages to sound so much more complex and thought-provoking this way than with the rambling orchestrations of the album that make me want to press skip.

“Can I Put You On” is a song we have not talked about yet. It comes from FRIENDS:



No, not that FRIENDS. Before going to America, Elton and Bernie accepted an offer to write songs for the Lewis Gilbert movie, FRIENDS. I’ve never seen the film and don’t plan on it, as it’s apparently really bad and creepy (I’ve heard Bernie only skimmed through the script). But I have heard the soundtrack, which much like the Beatles and YELLOW SUBMARINE consisted of only a few new songs and the rest was the Paul Buckmaster film score. Of the five Elton songs, I like all of them except “Seasons”, with “Can I Put You On” and “Michelle’s Song” being the standouts. On the album, “Can I Put You On” is structured in a way that the main body of the song finishes fairly early and they jam until the fade-out. And this version pretty much follows the same principle, only minus the backing vocalists and Caleb’s guitar part. And, once again, they manage to keep it going in a way that it’s always interesting and properly balanced between the three of them. A very underrated song in the Elton catalog in both versions.

Side 2 only has 2 songs, the first being “Bad Side of the Moon”. Much like “Sixty Years On”, it’s become almost like a completely different song here, and in this case I actually like the original. This one’s still cool, too, once again with Nigel really pounding the drums hard and Elton applying a rougher vocal style that makes it sound especially cool.

And finally we have the Burn Down the Mission medley, which starts with the Tumbleweed finale and transitions multiple times to the point that they’re also performing “My Baby Left Me” and “Get Back”. This is the reason Side 2 only has two songs. This finale lasts 18 minutes, but because of the way the song is structured, it works. It’s not just Elton and the band repeating the same things over and over again; because of the structure of the song, they’re able to branch out into multiple styles from blues to jazz. It’s such an epic finale and you can tell from the crowd response that they just ate it all up. What a fantastic way to end the album.

And that’s the original 17-11-70. As I mentioned earlier, this was not the whole show fit on to the album. For the CD remaster in the 1990s, “Amoreena” was added as a bonus track. It’s a decent performance, but kind of plays similarly to the album version without Caleb or Elton’s organ playing, and of course that makes sense considering Dee and Nigel are on the original recording. The rest of the songs were included on a Record Store Day only release called 17-11-70+. “Country Comfort” is kind of an average performance, but otherwise, the rest of it is also pretty good, although I can see why they made the track selection that they did. They were trying to show the heavier rock side of Elton and most of these remaining tracks were ballads or lighter songs, including the future MADMAN track “Indian Sunset”. The only track I could see them include on the original and have the same impact is “Border Song”. Regardless, the album is truly wonderful, one of my absolute favorite Elton albums. Elton’s still a great live act, but for a different reason: he has so many hits to choose from that he can practically just fill an entire setlist full of them, and we’ll still enjoy it. But this was the side of Elton that had something to prove, someone who didn’t have hits and needed to show why he was significant. 17-11-70 is like a historical record in that regard, presenting us with a determined rock-and-roller who was indeed significant.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 04, 2022, 04:02:32 PM
I’m hanging out with a friend tomorrow and one of the things we do is make a big playlist of music to listen to.  I am including this album and will comment on it on Sunday.  On paper, this sounds really intriguing.  Just Elton and some bass and drums playing some good songs.  More stripped down and I can’t wait to hear these guys work together.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on February 04, 2022, 07:12:17 PM
I'll probably also be giving my thoughts and listening to this on Sunday.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on February 06, 2022, 01:21:39 AM
I think the songs here are more enjoyable than the studio releases. The piano playing is great, with boogie woogie style in "Take Me to the Pilot." Elton's vocals were also good. Most of the time I've seen a band play live you can barely hear the vocalist and it sounds much different from what you usually hear on the album, not here. Elton John's vocals were almost like listening to the original studio release. The bass playing was probably the biggest revelation for me hearing 17-11-70. I noticed it throughout the album and really liked the style that was used.

I admit I was not too sure I'd like Burn Down the Mission when I saw how long the live performance was, it turned out to actually be really good. I liked that it transitioned into an instrumental jam session, I didn't get sick of it at all.

A good listen overall, not a single weak track on the album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 06, 2022, 07:10:17 AM
They were trying to show the heavier rock side of Elton

A six song single live LP trying to show the heavier side of the band.  Exactly like LIVE AT LEEDS from The Who.  After the big studio production of TOMMY, The ‘orrible ‘oo’s live album definitely was a much heavier effort and initially edited down from a larger concert to be as such.  It was also remixed in the 90’s with a different track listing and some added songs and then even later released with the complete show.  I read the Wikipedia page on 17-11-70 with the complicated release history then this above comment and thought I’ve heard this story before.

Much like The Who document, this is unquestionably a different side to Elton and I’m really glad this was released.  The most immediate of the albums for me I’ve heard so far.  I was able to hunt down the original mix and track listing from a vinyl rip uploaded on YouTube.

It was indeed great just being able to hear the band and focus on individual performances.  While I enjoyed the studio version of “Sixty Years On,” I can understand Sam’s preference for this live version.  Elton’s playing in and of itself is pretty orchestrated and is great to hear.  I was really impressed listening to his piano throughout but especially in this track.

With “Honky Tonk Woman,” I love the a cappella harmonies in the beginning and the laughter of the small studio audience.  It really did lend an intimate feel to the vibe of this album and is a fun moment.  The “Burn Down the Mission” epic medley was a lot of fun and it was nice hearing Elton throw in some Elvis and Beatles bits in there.  Hey, it was the 70’s, long medleys and jams were common so it’s all cool with me.

The rhythm section was of course fabulous,  Nigel was really in the pocket the whole time and Dee was a fantastic player.  He was doing some really fast runs in “Burn Down the Mission” and seemed to play tons of melodic parts using both the upper and lower register.  Very smooth feel, I thought he might be playing a fretless bass, but I could find nothing online confirming this.

A good live album shows a different side to the artist than the studio and 17-11-70 definitely fits that bill.  Every song here is a winner and it’s nice to hear Elton just rock out with the boys.  It feels very natural and I know these guys are going to be used more often in the studio recordings for the next five years or so.  I’m looking forward to seeing these guys settle into a groove.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on February 06, 2022, 09:31:40 AM
Really glad you both enjoyed this, as this is one of my favorite Elton recordings and one that I think deserves more attention than it gets (it does have a small following among Elton fans, but I never see it included in discussions of the greatest live albums). I agree HomokHarcos, I too was skeptical the first time I heard there was an 18 minute version of “Burn Down the Mission”, but it really does work. Metaldams, I have heard LIVE AT LEEDS, but never knew the history behind it. Now that I think about it, though, it is structurally quite similar, with the longer medleys taking up the second side. It’s a format I really like, keeps things moving in an epic way.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on February 12, 2022, 08:55:36 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d4/Elton_John_-_Madman_Across_the_Water.jpg)

MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER is kind of in between the ELTON JOHN and TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION styles. Much like ELTON JOHN, Paul Buckmaster and the orchestra are a big part of most of these songs. However, in this case, they’re playing less like an actual classical orchestra and more in the progressive style of something like “The Cage”.

In some ways, MADMAN could be viewed as the end of an era for Elton John. It’s the last album to feature the wide range of session musicians that had appeared on ELTON JOHN and TUMBLEWEED. In fact, for this specific album they were even joined by some newcomers, including future Yes keyboardist Rick Wakeman and an acoustic guitarist named Davey Johnstone, who would go on to impress Elton so much during these sessions that Elton himself asked him to join him, Dee and Nigel for his next album.

The first song is “Tiny Dancer”. Now, I can understand people thinking some Elton songs are overrated; heck, many artist has hits that are played like crazy on the radio. But I will never be able to understand anyone getting sick of this wonderful song. The beautiful melody, the innocent lyric, the orchestra, the pedal steel and acoustic guitars, Elton’s vocal performance...everything about this song mixes together so well to create an undeniable classic. Interestingly, it’s actually a cult classic, because it was not a big hit back then, just barely missing the top 10 here in the U.S. These days, it’s one of his most popular songs, a status it truly deserves.

“Levon” is probably the second most known song on this album, and it’s also deserving of that status. Such a great rock song; Barry Morgan really puts his all into what ultimately was his last drumming performance for Elton. The orchestra is really effective here, especially during the choruses, and I also really like how powerful Elton’s voice sounds whenever he shouts “he shall be Levon”.

“Razor Face” is also a really cool song. I know I’ve praised Elton’s voice twice already, but I can’t help it; that voice is just so distinct and on point! I love how it sounds when he’s harmonizing with himself; every time I hear him sing “needs a man who’s young to walk him around”, I marvel at how well done it was. It’s also supported by great guitar work from Caleb Quaye, organ from Rick Wakeman, and even an accordion part, which actually does work; it helps build atmosphere and make the song even more progressive.

Then we move on to the title track. I’m going to state right here and now that “Madman Across the Water” is my favorite Elton John song. It’s kind of similar to “Burn Down the Mission” in that it’s written in a way where, while the actual singing parts are great and fleshed out, they also leave in parts where the musicians can breach out and do something exciting. It also has a really interesting lyrical theme that’s open to lots of interpretation. I love this song in just about any form: from the Royal Festival Hall version where the orchestra goes even crazier to the live version with Dee and Nigel where Elton goes full on jazz mode, it always works. And yet, my favorite version is neither of those versions and it’s actually not this version either, even though I really like it as well.

No, believe it or not, my favorite version is actually the very first one that they recorded with Mick Ronson on electric guitar for TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION. I’ve had to think about this for a while, because at first glance it is basically Ronson taking over for those middle sections, which is obviously great, but isn’t exactly a staple of Elton John recordings. I thought about this and when listening to “Babe I’m Gonna Leave You” a few weeks ago for the LED ZEPPELIN discussion, I realized what it was: much like the Zeppelin track, I love how it naturally is able to change from quiet acoustic number to harder rock number and back again. It packs everything into one single song with a limited roster. Michael Chapman is on acoustic guitar and brings such a haunting approach to it that makes it really effective for opening and closing the song. Barry Morgan’s on drums again and really going crazy in the background. And, yes, Ronson’s guitar part is awesome. It’s interesting comparing this to the album version and seeing how he’s able to naturally create the “madness” of those middle sections with just his guitar whereas the album version had to use a full scale orchestra. That’s not meant to slight the album version; I like how fast the orchestra is and how it quiets down in certain sections. But in the end, I do still lean slightly towards the first one, especially the way it delivers the chorus. Elton’s voice sounds so cool in the chorus combined with all the hard rocking that’s going on with the musicians in the background. It’s true that Elton’s piano gets buried a bit in the mix, but it’s prominent when it needs to be, such as the initial transition to the chorus and the quieter moments. Plus, Elton felt the famous lick was meant to be an acoustic guitar lick from the very beginning, according to Gus Dudgeon. That’s another thing I like about Elton. He’s not just writing for himself; he knows when he has something for others to take center stage. He has multiple guitar-focused songs in his catalog and “Bad Side of the Moon” kind of worked in that way too.

OK, now back to the actual album: the next track is “Indian Sunset”, once again another great song. Lyrically, it has gotten some criticism for inaccuracies and some lines might be considered too dated by today’s standards, but Bernie’s message was clear; it’s about a tragedy and it sympathizes with the Native Americans. Once again, Buckmaster provides a great string arrangement, bringing a certain epic feel to the story.

“Holiday Inn” is where Davey Johnstone really gets to shine. He plays mandolin here, which much like the accordion in “Razor Face” might sound like an odd choice at first, but is really effective. He plays it so fast that it’s impressive, especially in the ending fadeout which gives starts off with a nice solo from him. Just listening to this song, you can see why Elton thought so highly of him.

So, yeah, a really solid first two-thirds. The last third is where things falter a bit, though. “Rotten Peaches” has always been my least favorite song on the album. It’s not necessarily bad; the chorus is kind of catchy, but it doesn’t stand out as much; it’s just kind of an average song on an album that’s otherwise very diverse in its styles.

“All the Nasties” has a great first half. It’s the only song on this album where he’s backed by Dee and Nigel on bass and drums, providing Dee another chance to show his bass skills, Nigel a chance to recreate the live, heavy sounds he created on 17-11-70, and Elton himself showing off a really charming piano part. Then the second half goes full on “My Father’s Gun” mode, with a ridiculously long repeat of the same thing over and over again. It is still cool to hear Nigel’s drumming here, but even that gets a bit tiresome after a while.

And finally, we have “Goodbye”. I guess with a title like that, it’s natural that this would be the ending track on the album. It’s also really short, clocking in at less than 2 minutes. Elton later had a successful short album closer, but I think it kind of works against this one; just when things really start to pick up and get interesting...the song ends. It’s still a nice song; I like the sorrow in Elton’s voice and the orchestra, but it just feels a bit underwhelming.

So, yeah, MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER is another good album overall. However, the first 6 tracks are so great that they kind of overshadow the remaining tracks, none of which are bad, but just don’t quite compare. The album didn’t sell that well; here in the U.S. it did fine but over in the U.K. it was one of his worst selling albums. That would change with the next album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 12, 2022, 11:16:21 AM
First off, I’ve been living in a new place for about a year and it’s only been the past few days where I finally improved my home music listening set up.  It wasn’t so much an issue when listening to things I know like the back of my hand, but for having new music grow on me, it definitely helps.

MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER is an album I have heard a few times before, though it’s been well over ten years.  Needless to say, the fresh listen I just had was needed.  Of course, hearing the album or not, I know “Tiny Dancer” and “Levon” as well.  Both excellent songs and the former is especially catchy.  I really like the whole album for the most part.

Knowing my tastes, it’s not surprising the two epics are my favorite tracks on the album, “Madman Across the Water” and “Indian Sunset.”  Even though it’s been years since I’ve heard this album, I never forgot “Indian Sunset,” so that says a lot in terms of leaving an impression.  Both fantastic songs.  I noticed the percussion on “Indian Sunset” at times had a native style beat to it which really lent to the atmosphere.

The rest of the album is quite good and I think overall this album flows the best out of all the albums we’ve listened to so far.  I did notice Elton’s harmonizing on “Razor Face” and the great guitar work on “Holiday Inn.”  I can kind of see how the end of the album is perhaps relatively weaker, but then again, how can you top those two tracks?  “All the Nasties,” while I wouldn’t skip it, is a weaker song compared to everything else.

Pretty cool that Rick Wakeman appeared, that guy is a legend.  He did a lot of studio work and this was shortly before he joined Yes, whose classic era I’m a really big fan of.  Believe it or not, in a couple of albums ahead, he will also show up in the Black Sabbath story.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on February 13, 2022, 04:39:16 AM
I preferred the way the orchestra was used here over the previous albums. The opening tracks were indeed the best, and it included my favorite song yet.

"Tiny Dancer" was the one song I recognized on this album. It's a tune I've heard often before, but would not have known the title. The orchestra and pedal steel guitar mixture is unique and gives symphonic country feeling. I only just recently learned that instrument I associate with country is called pedal steel guitar. "Levon" starts off with just a piano and vocals, but really picks up when the instruments are added. This is making me want to check out more symphonic music sometime down the line. "Razor Face" is the song that sounds more like a rock track to me. It has a good guitar section enhanced by the piano.

"Madman Across the Water" is my favorite song so far. It's just one of those songs so great I knew it was special the first time I listened to it. I like everything about this song, especially the guitar and piano. I listened to this album before I saw your post, so I didn't know it was your favorite song here too. "Indian Sunset" is also very good when there are instruments on. If it wasn't for the song before I probably would have noticed it more on my first listen. "Holiday Inn" is also a good song with an orchestra that fits well with the music.

The lyrics of "Rotten Peaches" make me think of I Am A Fugitive From a Chain Gang for a few reasons. One, the story is set Georgia and Georgia is the peach state. Two, the story about prison makes me think he's on a chain gang, but I don't know if the lyrics were supposed to be literal. The choir is a nice touch. "All the Nasties" also had a choir. "Goodbye" was kind of how I expected it to be when I saw it was the last track, the title and how short it is.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 13, 2022, 07:50:14 AM
I’m looking ahead here, and noticed the next six studio albums all hit #1 in the U.S.  Pretty impressive.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 19, 2022, 08:55:53 AM
https://rateyourmusic.com/artist/elton-john

The general consensus on Elton albums, though not necessarily ours, lots of ratings and reviews.  The IMDb of music sites.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on February 20, 2022, 09:08:35 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f0/Elton_John_-_Honky_Château.jpg)

I consider HONKY CHATEAU to be a transitional album in the Elton catalogue. It’s the first one to feature his classic band lineup of Dee Murray, Nigel Olsson, and Davey Johnstone throughout the entire album and is also the first in what would be a very impressive streak of number 1 albums, as well as many Top 10 singles (prior to this, only “Your Song” had made the Top 10).

The album’s title is a mix between the first track, “Honky Cat”, and the new recording studio Elton and the band recorded at, Chateau d’Herouville. There’s actually a 1971 interview on YouTube where Elton mentions going back to the EMPTY SKY approach of making albums and focusing more on rock-and-roll. So it’s clear that Elton was trying to take things in a completely different direction, and you can hear it in the finished product.

The very first track, “Honky Cat”, is a perfect example of this. It’s a good song, but certainly not something that would have been on any of the previous albums, not even EMPTY SKY. It’s definitely something aimed at mass audiences, with that catchy Fender Rhodes part and a brassy pop arrangement. It’s definitely a fun song.

“Mellow” is a bit closer to the style of the previous Elton albums. It always reminded me a bit of “Razor Face” stylistically. I prefer “Razor Face”, which is a bit more immediate and paced better. “Mellow” is slower and the electric violin solo by Jean-Luc Ponty feels a bit dragged out. Still, I do think the chorus is really catchy and the band already does sound really tight even at this early stage in its formation.

“I Think I’m Going to Kill Myself” is a very obvious vaudeville-inspired song, though certainly darker lyrically than anything Paul McCartney would have done. I actually do think it’s really catchy and I especially like how it kind of changes style when they sing the “blues” portion of the chorus.

“Susie (Dramas)” is another one I think suffers from sounding a bit too much like a previous Elton song, in this case “Ballad of a Well Known Gun”, which was much more atmospheric and full. Unlike “Mellow”, though, “Susie” doesn’t really do enough to stand out on its own and feels more like filler. Not bad filler, but still filler.

“Rocket Man” is, of course, the most known song from this album. Very atmospheric with Davey’s slide guitar and the backing vocals from Dee, Nigel and Davey. It was definitely one of the more different Elton songs at the time and I can see why it’s still so highly regarded. Truth be told, this is one of my least favorites of the big Elton hits, but that’s mostly because there are just so many great ones to choose from. I just happen to think this is one of the less catchy ones, but it still does have such a unique atmosphere that I like.

“Salvation” is probably the most like any of the songs on the previous album, mostly due to the presence of the backing vocalists. It’s a cool song; I like the melody, and the harmonium and guitar really work especially well on it. Not much else to say; it’s a nice song.

“Slave” is my least favorite song on the record. It always felt kind of out of place; there’s a faster rock version that exists that was rejected in favor of it. While I do prefer that version, I still don’t think it’s necessarily good; the melody always sounded kind of generic and it just never really worked for me.

The next track, “Amy”, is awesome. The band is joined by Jean-Luc Ponty again as well as Ray Cooper on congas. And what you get is 4 minutes of really awesome, band-oriented rock. And when I say band-oriented, I really mean band-oriented. Everyone gets their chance to shine at some point or another, and there’s even a really cool jam session at the end. Ponty’s electric violin solo is so much more interesting this time, but I also like how he contributes to the song’s atmosphere itself. I’ve always loved how it sounded once Elton sings the line “I don’t whistle”; it almost sounds like some sort of low-pitched horn. When people doubt whether Elton should be labeled a rock artist, this is one I like to play to prove to them that he indeed should.

While “Amy” comes extremely close, in the end, my favorite song here is “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters”. As a kid, I had a DVD called “Dream Ticket”, which featured a disc where Elton discussed certain songs through his career, and it included the Royal Festival Hall performance of this song. It was one of the most beautiful things I’d ever heard, and I played that performance over and over again. It featured just Elton, Dee, and Davey on mandolin. The melody was so beautiful and Elton’s voice was in fantastic form. And when I eventually got HONKY CHATEAU, I was pleased to discover the album version was pretty much the same, just a minimal lineup doing this unique song in their unique way. I still love this song; I love how unique the lyrics are, the way Elton delivers them...it’s such a beautiful ballad, and thankfully it has gotten some more attention in recent years.

The album ends with a rocker, “Hercules”. And it’s a good one. The chorus is catchy, the backing vocals and guitars are cool and there’s even this really cool Rhino whistle Gus threw in the middle to make it even more fun. I’ve hear that this was considered to be a third single from the album, and I could totally see it working. It does have that upbeat, danceable quality to it that I think could have appealed to radio listeners. It’s a really good way to end the album.

HONKY CHATEAU is one of Elton’s most popular records and most fans rank it very highly. Personally, I do find it a bit overrated; granted, the only song here I don’t like at all is “Slave”, but with that taken into account, I do rank a lot of the other records higher. Still, what’s good is still really good, especially “Amy” and “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters”, and it is impressive how Davey seemed to fit in right away; much like Dee and Nigel, he really feels like he’s there to enhance the music, not overtake it. Elton described in his autobiography how Davey would do things like the slide guitar in “Rocket Man” that most other guitarists wouldn’t have, because his concern was with the songs specifically. Even if I don’t rank it quite as high as the other classic Elton John records, HONKY CHATEAU is still a nice record that shows that Elton could compete with the major rock stars of the time. And it just got better from there.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 21, 2022, 12:20:20 PM
      Definitely Elton’s most focused and confident sounding album to date.  I think the fact this overall sounds like a band album really helps, as I’m a listener who tends to gravitate towards players and I feel like I’m getting to know the band in addition to Elton’s songs.  I got that feeling listening to 17-11-70 and I get the same feeling here.  I would say the only thing not here from Elton that I like that he’s done up to this point is a long, epic song.  Not that it was 100% needed because what’s here is fine.

      As far as standout songs, perhaps a bit unfair because of course it’s “Honky Cat” and “Rocket Man.”  I’ve heard these two songs dozens of times while these other songs are new to me.  They’re both great songs.  The former is a real butt shaker with an awesome groove to it and the latter is simply pop perfection.  I love the fade out at the end of the song.  The rest of the album I really enjoyed, there was nothing I disliked.  The rhythm section cooks throughout this album and I agree “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters” was definitely a standout.  I thought I heard some mandolin in there.  I loved the arrangement and tune overall, I could picture Rod Stewart doing it, for some reason.

      Also, gotta say, as an Alice Cooper fan, there were parts of this album, band wise, that sound like they could be on his mid to late 70’s albums where his sound got softer in parts.  Safe to say Elton was an influence on Alice (and vice versa in the image and theatrics department),  considering Alice wrote with Bernie Taupin and Davey Johnstone at one point.  This is overall a very good album and probably my favorite so far.  Again, it’s the band focus that reels me in initially.  Who knows how things will go when I hear these more and certain songs stand out more.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on February 21, 2022, 07:27:21 PM
      Definitely Elton’s most focused and confident sounding album to date.  I think the fact this overall sounds like a band album really helps, as I’m a listener who tends to gravitate towards players and I feel like I’m getting to know the band in addition to Elton’s songs.  I got that feeling listening to 17-11-70 and I get the same feeling here.  I would say the only thing not here from Elton that I like that he’s done up to this point is a long, epic song.  Not that it was 100% needed because what’s here is fine.

      As far as standout songs, perhaps a bit unfair because of course it’s “Honky Cat” and “Rocket Man.”  I’ve heard these two songs dozens of times while these other songs are new to me.  They’re both great songs.  The former is a real butt shaker with an awesome groove to it and the latter is simply pop perfection.  I love the fade out at the end of the song.  The rest of the album I really enjoyed, there was nothing I disliked.  The rhythm section cooks throughout this album and I agree “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters” was definitely a standout.  I thought I heard some mandolin in there.  I loved the arrangement and tune overall, I could picture Rod Stewart doing it, for some reason.

      Also, gotta say, as an Alice Cooper fan, there were parts of this album, band wise, that sound like they could be on his mid to late 70’s albums where his sound got softer in parts.  Safe to say Elton was an influence on Alice (and vice versa in the image and theatrics department),  considering Alice wrote with Bernie Taupin and Davey Johnstone at one point.  This is overall a very good album and probably my favorite so far.  Again, it’s the band focus that reels me in initially.  Who knows how things will go when I hear these more and certain songs stand out more.

Interesting you mention Rod Stewart, as he and Elton were close friends for many years and Rod did cover multiple Elton songs, but not “Mona Lisas”.

The lack of a long, epic song is a very good observation. Rest assured, the next album brings that back.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on February 22, 2022, 08:34:27 AM
I think this is my favorite album so far, it's got rock and roll, ragtime, country and boogie woogie influences.

"Honky Cat" is a fun opening. The piano sounds like boogie woogie in the verse, and I like the brass used in the music. It's even got a great piano solo near the end. "Mellow" is one of my least favorite songs on this album, and again like usual I want to say that is because I like the rest of the album and not because this song is weak. I will admit, I'm shocked Jean-Luc Ponty appeared on this album. My mom's a big fan of his so I heard his music a lot growing up, and he's one of my favorite jazz fusion artists.

"I Think I'm Gonna Kill Myself" also reminded me of Paul McCartney's music hall-like songs. It's definitely got a ragtime-like feel. It's actually pretty upbeat and fun despite the lyrics. "Susie" is another great follow up. It's got a very catchy chorus, along with great piano playing and I like the guitar playing. "Rocket Man" is one of Elton John's signature songs and probably the song I most associate with him. It's actually not as upbeat as the rest of the album. "Salvation" is another song that goes for a slower-paced feel.

"Slave" is probably his most country sounding song yet. I think it would have fit more with Tumbleweed Connection as he had more of a country theme on that album. "Amy" is a good song on this track. Very good rock song, and one that is probably one of my favorite Elton John songs so far. Of course I'm happy to hear more Jean-Luc Ponty. Ballads for the most part are not my thing, but "Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters" works well enough. I was expecting it to build to something, but didn't. "Hercules" is a very good way to finish the album. It's probably the most 1950s sounding song on here.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on February 22, 2022, 09:34:40 PM
I think this is my favorite album so far, it's got rock and roll, ragtime, country and boogie woogie influences.

"Honky Cat" is a fun opening. The piano sounds like boogie woogie in the verse, and I like the brass used in the music. It's even got a great piano solo near the end. "Mellow" is one of my least favorite songs on this album, and again like usual I want to say that is because I like the rest of the album and not because this song is weak. I will admit, I'm shocked Jean-Luc Ponty appeared on this album. My mom's a big fan of his so I heard his music a lot growing up, and he's one of my favorite jazz fusion artists.

"I Think I'm Gonna Kill Myself" also reminded me of Paul McCartney's music hall-like songs. It's definitely got a ragtime-like feel. It's actually pretty upbeat and fun despite the lyrics. "Susie" is another great follow up. It's got a very catchy chorus, along with great piano playing and I like the guitar playing. "Rocket Man" is one of Elton John's signature songs and probably the song I most associate with him. It's actually not as upbeat as the rest of the album. "Salvation" is another song that goes for a slower-paced feel.

"Slave" is probably his most country sounding song yet. I think it would have fit more with Tumbleweed Connection as he had more of a country theme on that album. "Amy" is a good song on this track. Very good rock song, and one that is probably one of my favorite Elton John songs so far. Of course I'm happy to hear more Jean-Luc Ponty. Ballads for the most part are not my thing, but "Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters" works well enough. I was expecting it to build to something, but didn't. "Hercules" is a very good way to finish the album. It's probably the most 1950s sounding song on here.

I’m curious, do you have any album recommendations for Jean-Luc Ponty? I’ve heard a few of his songs, but never really tried exploring any of his albums. I like acts like that who can take classical music and incorporate more modern elements to it, and he would definitely fit into that category.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on February 25, 2022, 04:27:55 PM
(https://i.discogs.com/NaaRJFFLNwq16XptB13M5qh2iGY4j1TaOC04POzBtQI/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:295/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWltYWdlcy9SLTQ3/MjMyNC0xMzI0MjE3/NTYzLmpwZWc.jpeg)

(https://i.discogs.com/nDib1S4JYhPdWRi96KcFeA8mSyvrK2vQYrGQOWuvuls/rs:fit/g:sm/q:90/h:600/w:600/czM6Ly9kaXNjb2dz/LWltYWdlcy9SLTQ3/MjMyNC0xMzI0MjE3/NTU2LmpwZWc.jpeg)

The band is pictured and advertised.  Pretty cool.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on February 27, 2022, 02:15:17 PM
I’m curious, do you have any album recommendations for Jean-Luc Ponty? I’ve heard a few of his songs, but never really tried exploring any of his albums. I like acts like that who can take classical music and incorporate more modern elements to it, and he would definitely fit into that category.
I'd recommend Cosmic Messenger. It has two of my favorite songs of his on there: "Egocentric Molecules" and "Ethereal Mood".
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 01, 2022, 10:46:29 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/6e/Elton_John_-_Don%27t_Shoot_Me_I%27m_Only_the_Piano_Player.jpg)

First of all, yes, that is indeed a poster for GO WEST on the front cover. Groucho was allegedly the inspiration for the album’s title, but I’ve always wondered why GO WEST was chosen specifically. I like GO WEST, but the later MGMs are often considered among their weaker films by Marx Brothers fans. It’s a stretch, but I’ve long suspected the choice was made because of the fact that the song “Blues For My Baby and Me” makes heavy use of the phrase “Go West”.

DON’T SHOOT ME I’M ONLY THE PIANO PLAYER is where I feel Elton’s transition to stardom was finally complete. True, HONKY CHATEAU did hit number one here in the U.S., but even “Rocket Man” didn’t manage the number one spot on the singles charts. But DON’T SHOOT ME did achieve this feat with “Crocodile Rock”, and it even got another single that made it to the number two spot as well in “Daniel”. While it certainly has its fans, I don’t think this album has entirely gotten its due, partly due to being sandwiched between two albums that are ranked very highly in the Elton catalogue.

It starts off with “Daniel”, which is of course a great song. As with HONKY CHATEAU, Elton is back to playing multiple keyboards outside of just the acoustic piano, which is interesting to think about. That classic image of him is at a grand piano, and yet on one of his most popular songs, that’s not even present at all; he plays Fender Rhodes and Mellotron, which definitely feel more in line with the 70s as a whole, but I mean that in a good way. The lyrics have often been up to interpretation, as Elton cut out the third verse. This was a common occurrence with Elton and Bernie’s lyrics; “Border Song” is another example, although in that case Elton wrote a completely new verse. Regarding “Daniel”, it’s believed it was supposed to be about the Vietnam War. I love this song; it has that amazing 70s feel to it that you just don’t see in songs today, even ones I like. There’s actually a rare mix of this from an album called THE SUPERIOR SOUND OF ELTON JOHN that I highly recommend; it features the original first chorus that was mixed out and replaced with the repeated second chorus, and you can make out Davey’s banjo part a lot better.

“Teacher I Need You” is a very obvious ‘50s callback song, but again, it’s in all the best possible ways. The uptempo drumming from Nigel, Elton’s fast piano playing and the joyful backing vocals make it feel like a truly faithful throwback, and it’s a lot of fun.

“Elderberry Wine” is also a fun song. This is one I’m actually kind of surprised they never really pushed for as an A-side, because it seemed like a good choice. A catchy chorus, a groovy bass part, lots of horns; it feels like something that would have made a great party song. Oh well, at least it made the album, and in the context of the album itself, it keeps the fun pace moving. Just when you think that’s what the tone is going to continue to be...they throw you for a loop.

“Blues For My Baby and Me” is a really great, underrated Elton John ballad. It’s one of the only two songs on the album to feature an arrangement from Paul Buckmaster (who had been missing from HONKY CHATEAU and would not return again until BLUE MOVES in 1976) and he does a really good job properly supporting the song. I especially love how the horns sound after Elton sings “it looks so sweet and so free”; it really feels like he captures the essence of that line with that arrangement. Davey also plays sitar on this one, which isn’t a super common occurrence on Elton recordings (it does appear on “Holiday Inn” but is completely overshadowed by the mandolin playing), but much like with George Harrison using it with the Beatles, it gives the song an extra, worldly feel to it. It’s a song that needs to be heard to be believed; Elton recently chose it as one of the “Deep Cuts” on JEWEL BOX, so I think he would agree with it being massively underrated.

“Midnight Creeper” brings things back to the more upbeat, brassy style of “Elderberry Wine”. Davey’s electric guitar part here is pretty cool and he plays well off of the brass players. It keeps things moving at a good pace musically.

“Have Mercy on the Criminal” is the album’s epic. It’s a much better version of “Rotten Peaches”, dealing with a prisoner on the run from the law. It reminds me a bit of “I’ve Seen That Movie Too” in its arrangement; very cinematic with the orchestra and Davey’s guitar, and Elton gives a really powerful vocal performance. It’s so passionate that he really captures the feeling of someone who has been on the run for a long time and has been suffering as a result. It’s so vivid and atmospheric; Elton also chose this for the “Deep Cuts” section of JEWEL BOX and I can see why. It’s a song I can feel people not aware of it being really impressed by.

“I’m Going to Be a Teenage Idol” is another horn heavy song, allegedly inspired by Elton’s friend, T-Rex frontman Marc Bolan. The horn riff here is probably the catchiest one yet, and I love how during the choruses it kind of transitions in a way that makes it feel like a completely different song; when Elton starts singing about being a teenage idol, it’s like he’s in some sort of fantasy or dream sequence, only for reality to come crashing back when the horns returns. I can really see why they went for the cover they did; the cinematic imagery of the lyrics and production is really noticeable here, just as much as on GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD or TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION.

“Texan Love Song” is kind of what you’d expect; a country song, but one that’s still really entertaining. Elton gives another fantastic vocal performance here; his voice is so clear and captures that beautiful nighttime atmosphere I get every time I listen to this. Here’s something I didn’t mention earlier: Elton actually was suffering from glandular fever while this album was recorded. I’ve always found this interesting because his vocals are so on point throughout this album that it’s not noticeable in the slightest; heck, I’d argue he sounds at his best so far on this record.

“Crocodile Rock”, that silly song everyone likes to make fun of, even Elton himself. It’s been subject to lots of criticism over the years, but I still really enjoy it, for the pure nostalgic fact that it was the song that introduced me to Elton John. Yes, for me, it all started here, and while I’ll admit it is silly and not the greatest representation of Elton’s versatility, it is still a really catchy song. I love the Farfisa organ, the guitar work, the “Speedy Gonzales”-inspired “la la las”. It still holds a special place in my heart and I’m always happy to hear it.

The final song is “High Flying Bird”, another wonderful ballad. A more piano and acoustic guitar-focused song, this is a perfect ending to the album, one that demonstrates how well in check the Elton John Band was with each other, both from a musical and vocal standpoint. The way they build everything up and keep the rhythm moving is absolutely perfect; it reminds me a lot of a longer version of “Harmony” in a way, especially with the soaring backing vocals. It’s another track that has a truly cinematic feel to it and it’s conveyed so perfectly.

Only one B-side to talk about this time, and it’s one you guys will be familiar with: “Skyline Pigeon”, the standout EMPTY SKY track was remade with the Elton John Band and a Buckmaster arrangement. I can kind of see why it was relegated to B-side status; there were two bird-themed songs and one had to get the cut, plus considering the fact “Skyline Pigeon” had already had its chance in the spotlight...well, I can see why they made the decision they did. Still, this version of “Skyline Pigeon” is pretty darn good; Elton’s voice is in great shape, Nigel’s drumming is fantastic, and the Buckmaster arrangement again really suits the song’s needs and contributes when necessary. I especially love the oboe in the second chorus; much like the sitar in “Blues For My Baby and Me”, it really gives off this worldly feel to it. Which version do I prefer? I think I slightly lean towards this one mostly due to the vocals, but the original is still such a unique song on its own with its lighter arrangement that both are well worth checking out.

DON’T SHOOT ME I’M ONLY THE PIANO PLAYER is an album I think very highly of; I like every song on it and it flows in a way that feels really balanced between the ballads and rockers. Add in a natural flow, tight band, and suitable supporting arrangements from Dudgeon and Buckmaster, and you get an album that demonstrates why Elton John is such a great artist. I’ve tried doing rankings of Elton’s albums multiple times and often find myself shifting albums around, yet DON’T SHOOT ME always somehow finds itself in the number two spot (there is one other Elton album I slightly prefer to this one). Highly recommended.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 03, 2022, 09:25:08 AM
      Again, like these past couple of Elton albums there are two hits I am familiar with and the rest of the album is new to me.  So of course the hits are more embedded in my brain versus songs I’ve just heard for the first time in the past week.

      I’ll get it out if the way.  Throw me in the group who has never been a fan of “Crocodile Rock.”   The verses are pretty good, but the synths seem completely out of place on what sounds like a nostalgic 50’s song.  That chorus?  Too sugary for me, just not my thing.  “Daniel” I do like.  A more mature soft rock track about a Vietnam vet and a real good song.  That one I like. 

      As far as the rest of the album?  “Crocodile Rock” is the worst song on the album, because the rest I enjoyed.  As far as an overall impression, the thing I noticed the most is Davey Johnstone is really stepping it up with the electric guitar sounds, always a plus with me.  Again, very much a band effort and the electric guitars combined with pop made me think of this as perhaps the closest Elton came to the UK glam scene of the time.  Yes Sam, I see you mentioned he was friends with Marc Bolan.

      As far as songs, “Teacher I Need You” is a lusty teacher song, in the latter tradition of Van Halen’s “Hot For Teacher” or Venom’s “Teacher’s Pet.”  Yes folks, I slipped in a Venom reference in an Elton John review.  The line “I’ve got John Wayne stances, I’ve got Errol Flynn advances” is brilliant.  Great song overall.

      The other standouts for me were “Blues For Baby and Me,” a Davey Johnstone tour de force that even has sitar, “Have Mercy On the Criminal” and the socially charged “Texan Love Song.”  Really though, all the songs minus “Crocodile Rock” I enjoy and the band is getting more electric.  Should transition them well into that next album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: hiramhorwitz on March 03, 2022, 12:43:32 PM
https://rateyourmusic.com/artist/elton-john

The general consensus on Elton albums, though not necessarily ours, lots of ratings and reviews.  The IMDb of music sites.

Without getting into all the details, this list of ratings seems totally consistent with my opinions: a) the Goodbye Yellowbrick Road album being squarely on top; b) the glory albums being Elton John, 11-17-70, Tumbleweed Connection, Madman, Honky Chateau, Don't Shoot Me, and Captain Fantastic; and c) Victim of Love being the absolute worst, with Leather Jackets a close second.  Can't argue with that one bit.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 03, 2022, 04:07:04 PM
I’m kind of curious as to how I’ll think of BLUE MOVES.  Really unusual for an artist to do two double studios.  Dylan and The Clash (a double and triple) are the only other artists I can think of.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 03, 2022, 09:07:58 PM
Yeah, from the opinions I’ve heard, that list does seem to match up with the general consensus as far as the top and bottom albums go (although I will say I’m in the very rare camp that actually considers ICE ON FIRE to be worse than LEATHER JACKETS).

As for BLUE MOVES, we’ll cross that bridge when we get there, but let’s just say for now that the response is much more mixed than GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on March 06, 2022, 01:01:07 AM
I think this my new pick for favorite Elton John album so far, it's got a lot songs that are upbeat and catchy, while some of the slower songs are also memorable.

I didn’t know what the lyrics for "Daniel" are about, but I can say what the song brings to mind for me. My uncle (who I'm very closed to) had an older brother named Daniel, as the song mentions. He died so my Uncle wanted to play the song at his funeral, I can't remember if he ended up doing that or not (I wasn't there). My uncle was crying when he heard this song because it reminds him of his brother Dan. "Teacher I Need You" is one of those upbeat songs that I mentioned that I really like. Catchy piano and I like the "ooh ah oooh" at the end. Elton John is also a good song that as Umbrella Sam said could have been a hit. The 1970s is probably my favorite decade in music when it comes to hit singles. "Blues for My Baby and Me" is one of the more enjoyable Elton John ballads so far.

I think "Midnight Creeper" is a great guitar song and would be perfect for a family gathering party (my family used to have lots of those before COVID). I'm glad to hear another epic on here, Elton John was great at those and "Have Mercy on the Criminal" is no exception. "I'm Going to be a Teenage Idol" is another great 1970s style song with the horns. I don't know if Elton John is going to be using synthesizers later on, but I preferred the use of horns to the synthesizers which basically replaced them in mainstream pop in the late 1970s and 1980s. "Texan Love Song" is a song that goes back to the sort of country influence on Tumbleweed Connection, I'm happy to hear that style make a return for a song.

I had no idea "Crocodile Rock" was so disliked. It was one of two songs I was familiar with on this album, and think it's a pretty good guitar rock song that even has a sort of Creedence Clearwater Revival roots rock feel. "High Flying Bird" for me was not as enjoyable as the other ballad on the album. I did like the "Skyline Pigeon" version featured here more than the original recording.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 09, 2022, 10:15:23 PM


Listening to this Alice Cooper 1978 show on YouTube.  King Biscuit Flower Hour radio broadcast, so good quality.  Checked out the lineup - Dee Murray on bass!  He definitely adds his own style to these songs.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 10, 2022, 07:43:34 AM
….and I have “Funeral For a Friend” stuck in my head this morning.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 10, 2022, 02:35:35 PM


Listening to this Alice Cooper 1978 show on YouTube.  King Biscuit Flower Hour radio broadcast, so good quality.  Checked out the lineup - Dee Murray on bass!  He definitely adds his own style to these songs.

You seem to know a lot about Alice, so I have a question. I know Dee plays on FROM THE INSIDE, but was he ever actually in Alice’s touring band? I used to think not, but the fact that he played on that radio broadcast has me curious again (I know Dave was part of the touring lineup, since that was the one period he wasn’t working with Elton).

Interestingly, there’s a Ringo Starr special from the late 1970s and Dee appears in that. It seems like in that period especially people were really starting to take notice of his talents.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: hiramhorwitz on March 10, 2022, 05:05:25 PM

Interestingly, there’s a Ringo Starr special from the late 1970s and Dee appears in that.

Sounds like the TV special where Ringo played himself and Ognir Rrats.  I remember seeing that when I was in college, and thinking it was pretty good.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 10, 2022, 05:21:33 PM
You seem to know a lot about Alice, so I have a question. I know Dee plays on FROM THE INSIDE, but was he ever actually in Alice’s touring band? I used to think not, but the fact that he played on that radio broadcast has me curious again (I know Dave was part of the touring lineup, since that was the one period he wasn’t working with Elton).

Interestingly, there’s a Ringo Starr special from the late 1970s and Dee appears in that. It seems like in that period especially people were really starting to take notice of his talents.

Alice has worked with so many different musicians since 1975 after the original group broke up that I can’t keep track of all of them.  I literally didn’t know until yesterday Dee Murray toured with Alice.  That would have been the spring and summer of ‘78 tour.  Alice introduces the band towards the end, Davey Johnstone also one of the guitar players.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 10, 2022, 06:31:23 PM
Sounds like the TV special where Ringo played himself and Ognir Rrats.  I remember seeing that when I was in college, and thinking it was pretty good.

Yes, that’s the one.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 10, 2022, 06:36:05 PM
Alice has worked with so many different musicians since 1975 after the original group broke up that I can’t keep track of all of them.  I literally didn’t know until yesterday Dee Murray toured with Alice.  That would have been the spring and summer of ‘78 tour.  Alice introduces the band towards the end, Davey Johnstone also one of the guitar players.

Looking at the entire FROM THE INSIDE lineup, it looks like there are even more Elton and Alice connections than I realized, including Kiki Dee. Speaking of Kiki, this is a song I’ve been meaning to share. It’s a song that was written during the YELLOW BRICK ROAD sessions, but not used for obvious reasons, so it was given to Kiki. Elton and the entire Elton John Band are backing her on it, making it feel even more like an authentic YELLOW BRICK ROAD song:

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 12, 2022, 12:11:33 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/86/Elton_John_-_Goodbye_Yellow_Brick_Road.jpg)

We now move on to arguably Elton’s most popular album, GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD. This is the one that had the most hits and as far as deep cuts go, is also the one fans are likely to know songs from.

Originally, the album was set to be recorded in Jamaica, as The Rolling Stones had recently recorded their album GOAT HEAD SOUP there. However, the studio ended up not being up to par, and Elton and the band instead returned to the Chateau d’Herouville, where they had recorded their previous two albums. The time in Jamaica was not entirely wasted, though, as Elton found time to write a good amount of songs, and wrote even more at the Chateau to the point where they had enough for a double album. It wasn’t even meant to be a double album, but it just happened to end up that way. There’s a lot to cover, so let’s just get straight into it.

It opens with “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding”. And, really, could you start with anything better? The synth opening (performed by engineer David Hentschel) perfectly sets the mood for the album; very grand and atmospheric. Then, when Elton is finally introduced on piano, we get to hear this very chilling instrumental, something very moody. I don’t know why, but I always think of Halloween when I hear this song; people talk about Christmas songs being played in December, but this is the type of song I think is perfect in October. It builds up perfectly with even more cool synths and guitars supporting it, until finally it transitions into the great rocker, “Love Lies Bleeding”, featuring one of Davey’s catchiest guitar riffs and some really amazing camaraderie between the entire band throughout. I love this song so much; I remember the first time I got this album, hearing this for the first time, and realizing that it actually was cool to be an Elton John fan. It’s 11 minutes, but it flows so perfectly that it doesn’t feel like it; it’s a perfect song.

Next up is “Candle in the Wind”, probably one of Elton’s most known songs. Telling the tragic tale of actress Marilyn Monroe, this is a very memorable song, highlighted by the sad backing vocals and the equally sad electric guitar playing (as well as a surprisingly understated acoustic) from Davey. Considering how well-known it is, I do see this one often cited as one of the more overrated Elton songs, and I can kind of see that, but it is still a very atmospheric song that tells its tale so well, and I think it still deserves a lot of praise for that.

“Bennie and the Jets” was another big hit from the album, probably the biggest here in the U.S. Remember how I mentioned the audience effects in “Rock and Roll Madonna”? Well, Gus gave it another shot here, and this time it worked. Being that the song is about a fictional band, it makes complete sense that it would be here, and Dudgeon even mentioned how the opening, lone chord is the kind of thing you would sometimes hear in a live show. It once again helps make for a very atmospheric song, and Elton uses the Farfisa organ to create this very memorable sound near the end. I’ve seen people try to classify Elton in the “glam rock” category of music, and I don’t really agree with that, as I think it’s difficult to truly classify him under any genre. But if they were just basing it off of this song specifically, then I could kind of see that logic. It has a very showy, glamorous feel to it, something that really gets your attention from the get-go.

Then we have the title track, a beautiful ballad that takes the “No Place Like Home” message of THE WIZARD OF OZ, and pretty much builds a song around it. The orchestrations and the vocals have a very whimsical feel to them; it really does feel like they could be in a magical land like Oz, even if it’s not exactly the same style as the movie.

“This Song Has No Title” is a really interesting one because it’s pretty much an Elton solo performance. But it’s not like “Talking Old Soldiers”, where it’s just Elton and a piano, something that could be done the same live. Instead, it’s Elton tracking multiple layers of vocals and different types of keyboards, and it’s really cool. One track actually sounds a lot like a flute, but it’s actually Elton himself recreating that on Mellotron. Elton has often been critical of his playing of non-piano keyboards, but I think this is a song that really proves that perception wrong; it’s just as cool as the tracks that preceded it.

Next is “Grey Seal”, given a second chance at life after the failure of the “Rock and Roll Madonna” single. And, yeah, it really does work better here. It’s funny, because I was shocked the first time I found out it wasn’t written for this album, as it fits in so naturally; the band is again really tight and that ending fade out, while impressive in the original version, feels so much more spirited and full of life here. So glad they decided to bring this back.

“Jamaica Jerk-Off” is usually the one I see listed as the worst song on the album, and I can understand why; I’m still not entirely sure what the lyrics are about (other than they have something to do with their disastrous Jamaica trip), but I wouldn’t be surprised if some found it offensive. I do have to admit, though, that I actually do enjoy it. The chorus is really catchy, and much like in “This Song Has No Title”, Elton uses the chance to experiment with his upper vocal range. Everyone sounds like they’re having a fun time recording and it’s kind of infectious in a way. So, yeah, I understand why people don’t like it and admit it’s definitely more dated than most Elton songs, but I enjoyed it when I was younger and still enjoy it now.

“I’ve Seen That Movie Too” continues the cinematic theme that was especially prevalent at the beginning with songs like “Candle in the Wind” and the title track. And again, it’s very atmospheric in its production, with Elton’s piano and the strings sounding like something you’d hear in a ‘30s/‘40s crime drama, and Elton once again gives a gradually passionate vocal performance as the song continues.

“Sweet Painted Lady” is the one song on this album that I just flat out dislike. Sorry, I know a lot of people like this song, but it’s always really annoyed me for some reason; something about Elton’s voice in the choruses just sounds off, almost like he’s trying too hard when he goes for the upper range. I always thought the main melody itself was kind of bland too; nothing about it ever made me want to listen to it outside of the ending with the seagull effects.

Thankfully, the next song is “The Ballad of Danny Bailey (1909-34)”, one of my absolute favorite tracks on this album. It starts off with just Elton on piano, followed by a brief drum part from Nigel to represent the gunshot that killed the title bootlegger; I always thought that was such a clever effect. Then you also get to hear some really great bass playing from Dee before finally they’re joined by Davey and the orchestra. And, wow, it sounds so awesome with the orchestra. The arranger on this album was Del Newman, and he really came up with some clever uses of the strings throughout the whole album, but especially here. I especially love the end of the final chorus where the strings and Dee, Nigel and Davey’s backing vocals are all in sync. It’s almost as though they’re all representing the giant uproar this character’s death causes, and the orchestral fadeout is the result of that uproar. Such an awesome song, another one that proves that it is cool to be an Elton John fan.

Next is “Dirty Little Girl”, a song that always reminded me a bit of “Ballad of a Well-Known Gun” and “Susie” if you slowed it down. Not a bad idea, and I think it works for a certain amount of time. But it does get a bit repetitive and I think they could have easily cut it by a minute.

“All The Girls Love Alice” is pure rock, and does very a good job at it, with another one of Davey’s most memorable guitar riffs, some really cool bass parts from Dee and Kiki Dee also killing it on backing vocals. It’s so strange how Elton is able to take such dark topics and actually make rock songs out of them, but he really can do it so well, and “Alice” is proof of this. In fact, it actually stops being a rock song for two brief moments and goes in a completely different direction, yet transitions back so perfectly. Another really catchy song.

The rock focus continues with “Your Sister Can’t Twist (But She Can Rock ‘n Roll)”, which is a playful tribute to the early rock songs of the late ‘50s and early ‘60s. You can hear some Beach Boys influence; heck, even the backing vocals are a nod to “Twist and Shout”. The only things that make it inauthentic are how fast it is and the fact that Elton swears at one point. This is another one of my favorite songs on the album. I know I’ve said this before, but why is Elton so overly-critical of his organ playing? That little Farfisa organ instrumental section he does in the middle is so fantastic; every time I hear it, I’m so blown away by it. I love the energy, the fast tempo, the drums, the backing vocals, Davey’s especially crazy guitar playing at the end, and the fact that it transitions perfectly into the next track, which is of course...

“Saturday Night’s Alright (For Fighting)”. Another song you often hear on “Greatest Hits” compilations, and for good reason. One of his more guitar-driven hits, this has a real drive to it, the type of song I can imagine them really wanting to push towards the public to prove Elton was a legitimate hard rock act. Ironically enough, this was the lowest charting of the songs on the album, and they didn’t really push for this side of Elton again until “Grow Some Funk of Your Own” in 1975. What can I say? It’s another catchy song, with a strong vocal performance from Elton and another tight band performance showing that the Elton John Band really meant business when it came to rock music.

“Roy Rogers” obviously mentions the famous cowboy actor multiple times, but in general is about 1950s nostalgia, and the orchestration combined with Elton’s beautiful vocal harmonies does a great job at it. It’s another fantastic, atmospheric ballad, and the galloping ending enforces that. I’ve always wondered what Rogers himself thought of the song, since he was still alive when it came out.

“Social Disease” is a bit more country. I’m not crazy about how ridiculously low in volume the opening to this song is, but once it picks up, it actually does become a super good song. The ending of the chorus especially has a real singalong vibe to it, that’s how catchy it is. It keeps the fun pace still moving, before you’re inevitably reminded that it does indeed have to end soon.

And that’s where “Harmony” comes in. Short, simple, and to the point, that’s what this song is and does so well. All the voices are fantastic, there’s more of a piano focus, and the repeating of the title character’s name at the end make for what ultimately ends up being a memorable conclusion to a very memorable album.

Is GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD my favorite Elton John album? Well, since “Sweet Painted Lady” is on it, I do have to say no, but that still doesn’t take away from how fantastic most of the other songs on it. As with most Elton albums, there’s a great variety of rockers and ballads, and all of them are of such high quality that, even with “Sweet Painted Lady” on there, it definitely is still in my top 5. GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD is definitely deserving of the iconic status that it’s usually given, and is a great choice for people wanting to explore Elton’s catalog for the first time.

Now, believe it or not, there are a few B-sides, but don’t worry, most of them are short:

First up is “Jack Rabbit” one of the two B-sides to the “Saturday Night’s Alright” single. It’s a country song, so I can see why it wasn’t included considering “Social Disease” really filled that spot. Still, it’s a really fun song (despite also having a dark lyrical theme). I especially love Elton’s harmonizing during the choruses and Davey’s fast guitar playing throughout.

The other “Saturday” B-side was “Whenever You’re Ready (We’ll Go Steady Again)”. Again, I can see why this was cut, as it’s very clearly a ‘50s style number, and “Your Sister Can’t Twist” filled that spot on the album. Still, it’s a very catchy song with Elton and Davey’s awesome piano solos and another strong vocal performance from Elton.

And finally we have “Screw You (Young Man’s Blues)”, the B-side to “Goodbye Yellow Brick Road”. The opening on this one for some reason reminds me of the opening to Ringo’s “It Don’t Come Easy”. It’s a decent song; I don’t like it quite as much as the other two B-sides, but it still allows for Elton and the band to have some fun, and the saxophone especially near the end is pretty cool.

I know this is a lot to take in, but luckily this review comes at a perfect time, as I’m going on vacation this week, so I’ll be delaying the review of the next album by a week anyway.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 12, 2022, 05:34:22 AM
Funny how Elton thought The Stones studio for GOATS HEAD SOUP wasn’t up to par.  Jethro Tull thought Château d'Hérouville wasn’t up to par when recording A PASSION PLAY and recorded somewhere else.  One musical artists gold is another’s dust.  All three of these albums were number one albums in 1973.

Looking forward to revisiting GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD in the next few days.  Some of my favorite Elton songs are here.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 12, 2022, 08:41:16 AM
From the great CLASSIC ALBUMS documentary on the making of this album, this illustrates perfectly what makes “Danny Bailey” such a great song.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 12, 2022, 09:17:41 AM
From the great CLASSIC ALBUMS documentary on the making of this album, this illustrates perfectly what makes “Danny Bailey” such a great song.




The entire documentary is available for free on Amazon Prime.  If you guys subscribe, it’s available.  I’m going to check it out.  Also a doc from the same series of Black Sabbath’s PARANOID.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on March 13, 2022, 03:04:42 AM
I know it will sound like I'm falling victim to recently bias as I keep saying that each new Elton John album is my favorite one so far, but I really do believe they are getting progressively better. This was a fantastic rock album.

The opening track is certainly a contender for favorite Elton John so far, especially the instrumental bit at the beginning of the song. The synthesizers, the guitars, the keyboards, all of it give the song an epic feel. It's so good I wondered how the rest of the album could possibly match up to it. Thankfully, there are more good tracks through the rest of the album. I was mainly familiar with "Candle in the Wind" from the 1997 version, but this one is much better and I actually liked it when I wasn't expecting to. "Bennie and the Jets" was the first Elton John song I really liked. The piano playing is excellent and there is a good section near the end. There was a time I was very frustrated because I could only find a live version, until I was told that it's actually a studio song with audience noise piped in.

Ballads can be hit or miss for me, but "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road" was a good one. Not the top track of the album for me, but good enough. "This Song Has No Title" feels like a filler track to me, and one where if I had to trim it down to a single LP would miss the cut. "Grey Seal" is a very good 1970s style song, I like the upbeat piano playing style. "Jamaica Jerk-Off" was probably the weak point in the album. "I've Seen That Movie Too" is a good song done in a less upbeat, slower paced style.

I agree with "Sweet Painted Lady" another filler-like song that I think could have been removed for a LP. "The Ballad of Danny Bailey (1909-1934)" is listed a ballad in the title, but it's not what I typically think of when a ballad comes to mind. It's a good song that has a good story in the lyrics. "Dirty Little Girl" has a guitar that reminds me of "Bennie and the Jets". I think I liked this song more then you did. "All the Girls Love Alice" was a song that took me by surprise, I liked it a long and is another contender for favorite Elton John song. It's a good rocking tune with a catchy riff.

“Your Sister Can’t Twist (But She Can Rock ‘n Roll)” is a very upbeat catchy 1950s style song. Like Umbrella Sam this is one of my favorite songs on the album, the backing vocals are cool. I like these 1950s throwback songs. "Saturday Night’s Alright (For Fighting)", on the other hand is a very 1970s sounding hard rock song. This was one of the few tracks I was familiar with, the bass playing was my favorite part of the song (it's most notable towards the end). "Roy Rogers" is a country-influenced song that is not one of my favorite songs on the album. Maybe if I heard it by itself I would like it more, but it doesn't stand out for me compared to the rest of the album. "Social Disease" also has a country influence, but it's more of the kind I like, being upbeat. "Harmony" was a fitting enough closer.

Talking about country again, "Jack Rabbit" is also a song that I like. Funny, as a child I would have stayed away from most songs with a pedal steel guitar, but I'm starting to like it more. "Whenever You're Ready (We'll Go Steady Again)" is another 1950s rock and roll style song that I like. I'm wondering where I heard "Screw You (Young Man's Blues)" before, because it's a B side single, but I'm definitely familiar with it. These B-sides are all good.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 14, 2022, 07:25:08 PM


      GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD is a classic and has the one necessary ingredient to make a double album stand out - songs with character that stand out as little islands in and of themselves.  The White Album has that in spades and so does this album.  Truthfully, if I listened to this more, which I will, I can easily see this join SABBATH BLOODY SABBATH and BILLION DOLLAR BABIES as one of the better albums of 1973.  I will say the only song I don’t like that much was “Your Sister Can’t Twist” but even that is not bad enough to skip. Just seemed a bit plain compared to all the gems surrounding it.  I’m not going to comment on every track, but I will mention the ones that stood out or I have more history with.

“Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding.”  A masterpiece for sure and one that changed my perception on Elton.  As a kid who only liked heavy stuff, I used to think of Elton as a lightweight pop singer who is the kind of things Moms listened to.  Keep in mind Homok, Moms of kids in my generation didn’t listen to Megadeth.  When I was a fifteen year old kid discovering Slayer, Elton was doing The Lion King soundtrack.  Just not where my young overly testosterone fueled hormones raging self was at the time.  When I heard this song on the radio one day, I couldn’t believe it was Elton John.   Really progressive, grand, moody, rocking and awesome.  I’ve kept more of an open mind towards Elton ever since.

“Candle in the Wind”. No, I was not alive in 1973.  I was alive in 1997.  When Princess Diana tragically passed away in that accident it was the weekend I was moving into my dorm my Freshman year in college.  This song got a serious second life back then.  Some people may criticize this song but I adore it.  I love the lyrics, the melody, Davey Johnstone’s guitar playing, everything.  As a Kinks fan, I want to suggest a song from the year before in a similar vein, “Celluloid Heroes.”  A Ray Davies penned classic worth your time.

“Benny and the Jets” I did watch the Classic Album Series documentary on Amazon Prime and was really surprised that this was a number one R&B hit.  I simply never associated it with R&B music,  it a cool song.

“Goodbye Yellow Brick Road”  One of those perfect pop songs.  This album really does play like a greatest hits up until this point.

“Jamaica Jerk-Off”. I generally am not a fan of rock bands doing reggae type stuff, something you will notice in a few weeks with a certain song from a certain other band we are discussing.  The fact that Elton and Bernie penned one that I like speaks volumes.

“I’ve Seen That Movie Too”. My all-time favorite Elton song tied with the opening track on this album.  I love the movie themed lyrics and the way it compares movie cliches to relationship cliches.  I also love the film noir like atmosphere of the song and that amazing Davey Johnstone guitar solo.

“Sweet Painted Lady”. Love this song.  The kind of song I can picture McCartney doing in a lighter moment - except it’s about a prostitute!  Really relaxing and breezy.

“The Ballad of Danny Bailey (1909 - 1934)”  Yes, that isolated bass thing in the video was cool.  Another very catchy, atmospheric tune that tells a cool story

“All the Girls Love Alice”  With a title like that, I figure it’s either about lesbians or Alice Cooper groupies.  Don’t laugh, the latter would be very believable subject matter in 1973.  Turns out to be the former.  Brave and edgy for 1973.  A really cool song.

“Saturday Night’s Alright (For Fighting)” Believe it or not, the first version of this song I ever heard was the Flotsam and Jetsam cover.  On the rare occasions metal bands cover Elton, this is the song.  I like Elton’s version much better.  A classic.

A really fantastic album overall and the kind of thing that made the seventies special.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 14, 2022, 07:37:55 PM
Oh, and to piggyback on your glam rock comment, Sam.  That was mentioned in the documentary.  Elton says he never classified himself like Jagger, Bowie and Bolan and said it was impossible to be a sex symbol while playing the piano.  Obviously Elton forgot about Chico Marx.  [pie]

I also liked the way he talked about the camaraderie with his band around this time and how it made things comfortable.  He also admitted he was more creative back then which I found so refreshing.  There are certain artists I like, forty and fifty years into their career, still acting like their newest is their best.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on March 15, 2022, 07:19:37 AM

      GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD is a classic and has the one necessary ingredient to make a double album stand out - songs with character that stand out as little islands in and of themselves.  The White Album has that in spades and so does this album.  Truthfully, if I listened to this more, which I will, I can easily see this join SABBATH BLOODY SABBATH and BILLION DOLLAR BABIES as one of the better albums of 1973.  I will say the only song I don’t like that much was “Your Sister Can’t Twist” but even that is not bad enough to skip. Just seemed a bit plain compared to all the gems surrounding it.  I’m not going to comment on every track, but I will mention the ones that stood out or I have more history with.

“Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding.”  A masterpiece for sure and one that changed my perception on Elton.  As a kid who only liked heavy stuff, I used to think of Elton as a lightweight pop singer who is the kind of things Moms listened to.  Keep in mind Homok, Moms of kids in my generation didn’t listen to Megadeth.  When I was a fifteen year old kid discovering Slayer, Elton was doing The Lion King soundtrack.  Just not where my young overly testosterone fueled hormones raging self was at the time.  When I heard this song on the radio one day, I couldn’t believe it was Elton John.   Really progressive, grand, moody, rocking and awesome.  I’ve kept more of an open mind towards Elton ever since.

“Candle in the Wind”. No, I was not alive in 1973.  I was alive in 1997.  When Princess Diana tragically passed away in that accident it was the weekend I was moving into my dorm my Freshman year in college.  This song got a serious second life back then.  Some people may criticize this song but I adore it.  I love the lyrics, the melody, Davey Johnstone’s guitar playing, everything.  As a Kinks fan, I want to suggest a song from the year before in a similar vein, “Celluloid Heroes.”  A Ray Davies penned classic worth your time.

“Benny and the Jets” I did watch the Classic Album Series documentary on Amazon Prime and was really surprised that this was a number one R&B hit.  I simply never associated it with R&B music,  it a cool song.

“Goodbye Yellow Brick Road”  One of those perfect pop songs.  This album really does play like a greatest hits up until this point.

“Jamaica Jerk-Off”. I generally am not a fan of rock bands doing reggae type stuff, something you will notice in a few weeks with a certain song from a certain other band we are discussing.  The fact that Elton and Bernie penned one that I like speaks volumes.

“I’ve Seen That Movie Too”. My all-time favorite Elton song tied with the opening track on this album.  I love the movie themed lyrics and the way it compares movie cliches to relationship cliches.  I also love the film noir like atmosphere of the song and that amazing Davey Johnstone guitar solo.

“Sweet Painted Lady”. Love this song.  The kind of song I can picture McCartney doing in a lighter moment - except it’s about a prostitute!  Really relaxing and breezy.

“The Ballad of Danny Bailey (1909 - 1934)”  Yes, that isolated bass thing in the video was cool.  Another very catchy, atmospheric tune that tells a cool story

“All the Girls Love Alice”  With a title like that, I figure it’s either about lesbians or Alice Cooper groupies.  Don’t laugh, the latter would be very believable subject matter in 1973.  Turns out to be the former.  Brave and edgy for 1973.  A really cool song.

“Saturday Night’s Alright (For Fighting)” Believe it or not, the first version of this song I ever heard was the Flotsam and Jetsam cover.  On the rare occasions metal bands cover Elton, this is the song.  I like Elton’s version much better.  A classic.

A really fantastic album overall and the kind of thing that made the seventies special.

I’m surprised the first track was played on the radio, it must have been a shortened version of the track. Listing favorite albums by year of the 1970s would be fun, but seeing how much I like Santana and Steely Dan they’d probably take it most years.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 26, 2022, 08:03:50 PM
Sam, I know you’ve got some catching up to do after your vacation, so take your time with Zeppelin and Sabbath, but I hope you review Elton if need be before listening to that stuff.  I’m enjoying this thread.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 26, 2022, 11:28:29 PM
Sam, I know you’ve got some catching up to do after your vacation, so take your time with Zeppelin and Sabbath, but I hope you review Elton if need be before listening to that stuff.  I’m enjoying this thread.

Don’t worry, if I don’t get to it tomorrow, then I’ll definitely get to CARIBOU sometime early this week. Glad you’re enjoying this thread; it’s a lot of fun getting to share these and seeing everyone’s thoughts on these songs, especially the lesser known ones.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 26, 2022, 11:31:12 PM
I’m surprised the first track was played on the radio, it must have been a shortened version of the track. Listing favorite albums by year of the 1970s would be fun, but seeing how much I like Santana and Steely Dan they’d probably take it most years.

Obviously not being from the ‘70s, I can’t confirm, but I’ve long assumed it was played in full. Oddly enough, my local bowling alley plays a lot of classic rock staples, usually hits, and somehow “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding” always ends up on there. Sure enough, it’s always played in full, no evidence of any type of shortening.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 27, 2022, 08:40:05 AM
Obviously not being from the ‘70s, I can’t confirm, but I’ve long assumed it was played in full. Oddly enough, my local bowling alley plays a lot of classic rock staples, usually hits, and somehow “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding” always ends up on there. Sure enough, it’s always played in full, no evidence of any type of shortening.

Yeah, I’m pretty sure I heard the whole version on the radio as well.

“In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida,” all seventeen minutes of it, was an FM staple back in the day and a bathroom break for DJ’s.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 27, 2022, 10:03:58 AM
Forgot to mention, my Aunt and her boyfriend were at the New York City show a few weeks back.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 27, 2022, 09:13:21 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/54/Elton_John_-_Caribou.jpg)

January 1974. Hot off the success of an instant classic in GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD, Elton John and band find themselves in the position of having to follow that up...and if that wasn’t stressful enough, they only had about 9 days to do it since they were set to start a tour of Japan soon after. On top of all of this, there were also multiple changes to their approach to recording albums.

First of all was a new studio. Despite practically saving them at a time of need for GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD, Elton and crew decided not to record at the Chateau again, instead taking the opportunity to record in the United States at Caribou Ranch in Colorado. Additionally, there was a new member of the Elton John Band: percussionist Ray Cooper. Ray’s association with Elton actually goes back as early as 1971, appearing sporadically on select tracks, including “Amy” and “All the Girls Love Alice”. Ray is a very good percussionist who can play a wide variety of instruments and has a real entertainer’s approach to playing them. To put it simply, he makes playing the tambourine look like fun! At the same time, though, he essentially is adding color to what’s needed for each recording, not overtaking them completely, so he fits in naturally with the Elton John Band. And, though they didn’t officially join the band, they were also joined by the Tower of Power horn section, effectively bringing back the brass focus that had been present on HONKY CHATEAU and DON’T SHOOT ME I’M ONLY THE PIANO PLAYER, but largely absent from GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD. The reception at the time was great (two more top 10 singles and another number 1 album for Elton), but these days it has gotten a bit of a reputation for being rushed and, of course, the obvious YELLOW BRICK ROAD comparisons. Heck, Gus Dudgeon himself was quoted as being very critical of the album. Does it deserve that reputation? In my opinion, no.

It starts with “The Bitch is Back”, another Elton classic lots of people know. I find it odd that Elton was able to get away with a song with this title at the time. “Your Sister Can’t Twist” has swearing, but “The Bitch is Back” was a single played on the radio. I think it speaks to how popular Elton was that he could get away with a song like this at the time. The phrase itself was inspired by something Bernie’s wife said, allegedly referring to Elton himself when he was in a bad mood. It has a real party song vibe to it, with a saxophone solo and backing vocals from Dusty Springfield. It’s good, but I think it plays better live, because the key is changed and it feels more like a proper rock song. Still, the studio version is a lot of fun too.

Next is “Pinky”, an incredibly beautiful ballad that’s more piano-based. I love this song; I love the beauty of the backing vocals, the fantastic chorus, and the way the congas add to the atmosphere. This doesn’t sound rushed in the slightest; it’s completely natural from start to finish.

“Grimsby” follows, based on a port town that Bernie lived near growing up. This is a very solid rock song with some awesome guitars from Davey and cool drumming from Nigel; super catchy and again something that feels completely natural from beginning to end.

“Dixie Lily” is one I used to not care much for, but now, I do find some enjoyment out of it. It’s sort of a country-style song, but much more campy in its musical approach compared to previous Elton country songs. Listening again, I do find myself appreciating more of that campy approach, with those fun whistles and guitars standing out.

“Solar Prestige a Gammon”, on the other hand, is a song I’ve strangely grown to dislike more over the years. When I first heard it, I kind of enjoyed it due to the chorus being catchy, but as the years have gone along, I’ve realized truly how little substance there is to it...which, to be fair, was the point, but the song just sounds bizarre and while the chorus is still catchy, I actually find it in that annoying, earworm type of way, not in a way that I want to keep hearing it again.

“You’re So Static” brings the album back to its full focus, with an awesome horn part from the Tower of Power and a really fun piano part from Elton near the end. A lot of Elton fans actually really dislike this song, and I’ve never entirely understood why. I find it catchy and enjoyable, never viewed it in a bad light, so I’d be curious to see what you guys think to see if I’m missing something.

“I’ve Seen the Saucers” is my favorite song on the album. You may get “Rocket Man” vibes from it, and that’s understandable, but, believe it or not, I actually kind of prefer it to “Rocket Man”, and there’s one reason for that: the vocals. The vocals on this song from both Elton and the band are fantastic! Just listen to that chorus; the passion Elton has in his voice is super emotional. And those soaring backing vocals keep the atmosphere so rich...gosh, every time I hear them, I just want to go back and listen to them again! Again, this might be something you’ll disagree with me on, and I get it; again, being a song about flying saucers, people might find it silly, but I love this song and the full atmosphere it creates.

“Stinker” is more of a blues-based song, and a darn good one. Once again, the Tower of Power horn section are back to keep things moving at a steady pace (including Chester D. Thompson on organ) and Davey’s guitar part is consistently cool throughout. Elton has that slightly harsher vocal tone that makes “Saturday Night’s Alright” so effective and it’s equally effective here.

“Don’t Let the Sun Go Down on Me” is, of course, another classic, with a grand brass arrangement by Del Newman and a roster of guest backing vocalists including Carl Wilson and Toni Tennille. It’s a grand arrangement that seems fitting given the song’s tale of potential heartbreak. I can see someone try to make the argument that it’s overblown in that sense, but for me, it makes sense; it’s a very cinematic thing, and Elton excels at those kind of things, as GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD and DON’T SHOOT ME I’M ONLY THE PIANO PLAYER prove.

It finishes with “Ticking”, a story about a man who’s brought up by a household not realizing the mental problems he’s struggling with until it’s too late...he ends up being a mass shooter in a bar and shot by the police. Bernie’s cinematic lyrics are backed up by a light arrangement, mostly Elton with some synth from David Hentschel. It supports the lonely atmosphere as this man continues with these struggles. It’s very effective...but that’s also kind of the problem. This song is unfortunately more relevant than ever these days, and it’s just hard to listen to as a result. Again, it’s a good song, I’d even argue it makes a great closer considering the way the synth part just keeps going and going, kind of like the ending to “A Day in the Life” and “The King Must Die”. But, man, it’s just so difficult to listen to; it would have been difficult to listen to back then, but it’s even harder now given what we’re always seeing in the news.

So, yeah, as a whole, I still really like CARIBOU. The only song I dislike is “Solar Prestige a Gammon”. While “Ticking” is hard to sit through, it’s still a good song, and the rest of it is very entertaining and still has the same charm that Elton and his band had had since they’d officially started recording together. Even if it’s not as good as the albums that immediately preceded and followed it, CARIBOU still very much deserves to be considered a classic Elton John album.

OK, now for some additional tracks:

First up is some songs we missed last time, the Christmas songs “Step Into Christmas/ Ho! Ho! Ho! (Who’s Be a Turkey at Christmas)”. Considering how much there was to talk about last time, I decided to wait until here to discuss them. The A-side is commonly heard on Christmas stations and now considered a Christmas classic, which makes me happy as I’ve always loved it. Essentially, it’s the Elton John Band doing their own Christmas song in the tradition of people like the Ronettes or Bobby Helms. It captures the Christmas spirit perfectly and always makes me happy when I listen to it. The B-side is possibly one of the most British recordings Elton ever made; much more silly, but the chorus is still pretty catchy. Interestingly, metaldams, these were both recorded at Morgan Studios, where both SABBATH BLOODY SABBATH and SABOTAGE were recorded. I’ve kept meaning to bring this up, but this studio was owned by Elton’s old studio drummer, Barry Morgan.

Next is the B-side to “Don’t Let the Sun Go Down on Me”, “Sick City”. There are many Elton B-sides that I consider album-worthy material; “Bad Side of the Moon”, “Into the Old Man’s Shoes”, the list goes on. But if I had to make the case for one of them specifically, it would be this one. I think it was a mistake for them to leave this awesome song off the album. I love this song so much; I love the horn riff, Dee’s groovy bass playing, Elton’s piano playing, the backing vocals, Elton’s vocals and the overall R&B feel combine to creative this wickedly catchy song. Anytime I hear Elton sing “stage door monkey’s on my back”, I just can’t resist joining in; it deserves a lot more attention than it gets. This easily could have replaced “Solar Prestige a Gammon”.

The B-side to “The Bitch is Back” was “Cold Highway”, which is a song I also like, but unlike “Sick City”, I can kind of see why this one didn’t make the cut. It kind of sounds similar to “You’re So Static” and “Stinker” and therefore would have probably been considered as making the album too repetitive. Again, though, it’s a really good song, the vocals being the standout parts.

And, finally, even though it wasn’t released until 1975, I’m going to mention Elton’s version of “Pinball Wizard” for the movie version of TOMMY, which was recorded in early 1974. To the surprise of probably none of you, this is the version I grew up with, and while I like The Who version, I prefer the overall pace of the Elton version; even without watching the film, you can feel the frustration and adrenaline rush Elton’s character, “The Champ”, is having facing off against Tommy, trying to defend his crown. On top of that, it actually sounds like an Elton John song through and through, probably because, unlike the other performers on the TOMMY soundtrack, Elton was allowed to be backed by his own band and have Gus Dudgeon produce. It’s a great rendition, highlighted by Elton’s fantastic vocals and the great interplay between his piano and Davey’s guitar.

By this point, Elton was definitely a superstar, and there was no sign of that slowing down yet. The next album is proof of that.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 27, 2022, 09:13:58 PM
Forgot to mention, my Aunt and her boyfriend were at the New York City show a few weeks back.

Cool, I hope they had a good time. I’ll be seeing him again this July.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 28, 2022, 08:29:18 PM
This time I took notes while listening to the songs, something I should have done before.  It’s easier to write about songs I’ve heard a million times versus songs I’m mostly not familiar with.  CARIBOU is another very enjoyable album and I can see how it was recorded quicker.  The rhythm section really stands out as there isn’t quite as much over it.  Just vocals, guitar, horns and piano.  A little more of a live feel which is to be expected when you only have nine days.  The seventies in general were crazy for bands with their touring and recording schedules - the first three KISS albums were released over a thirteen month period, for example.  Elton had a really hectic schedule, and I imagine the band had to be getting tired or would be soon at this point, not to mention the drugs.  But hey, the music is still good.  It is interesting hearing a comparatively bare album (by Elton standards, this is still way more produced than PARANOID), following up GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD.



“The Bitch is Back” is simply a good, solid, no bullshit (gotta keep the swearing up in the spirit of the song) hard rock song I really like a lot.  There’s a real cool machine gun like rhythm guitar thing going here and a real strong Elton vocal.  Cool song.

“Pinky” is nothing more than a nice, mellow relaxing song with a cool intro.  I dig it.

“Grimsby” Is a good driving rocker with some strong bass and some real interesting guitar parts throughout.

“Dixie Lilly” The harmonies here sound total Mick and Keith and the instrumental section had a seventies AOR feel to it.

“Solar Prestige a Gammon” is a fun, light and humorous song.  Perhaps the most humorous I have heard from Elton at this point.  I really enjoyed the foreign dialect vocals.

“You’re So Static” Love the little intro and again, the bass playing.  Another simple driving song with cool guitar parts.

“I’ve Seen the Saucers”. Great song!  I actually thought the guitar and bass had a very Beatles like ABBEY ROAD feel to it.  Loved the dramatic chords in between the verses and Elton’s vocals.  Really awesome.

“Stinker”. Bare bones blues number, sound like mid 70’s Stones of the same era.

“Don’t Let the Sun Go Down On Me” A real dramatic and beautiful build up to the chorus that’s real effective.  There’s really no mistaking which parts Carl Wilson is singing, God only knows that voice is unmistakable.  This has always been one of my favorite Elton tunes.

“Ticking”  Sometimes tough topics need to be sung about and Elton does a good job here.  Your analysis made me want to read the lyrics and I think I’ll do that with future Elton albums.  Lyrically, if not musically, reminds me of early Dylan the way the story is told and Dylan could do a social commentary or two.  This has shades of “Ballad of Hollis Brown” of a man snapping and going on a murder rampage, though in the Dylan song it was his own family he could no longer feed.  This sounds like a case where rage was building up for years and the upbringing had a big part of it.  Powerful song.

A good album overall.  Not one of the better ones so far but still quite solid.  It’s always a sign an artist is on a good run when the lesser albums of the period are still enjoyable.  I’m really looking forward to the next album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on March 29, 2022, 01:00:53 AM
After a few albums where each one was better than the preceding one, I think this one is a step down from what came before. Knowing it was really rushed out, though, does make it more tolerable knowing that fact.

“The Bitch is Back” is an upbeat song with a great horns section and awesome bass playing. Definitely a sort of funk feel he had going on here. “Pinky” is a ballad that’s passable for me. Probably not a song I’d listen to by itself. “Grimsby” brings back the upbeat feeling, and it has a noticeable guitar riff playing throughout that goes through most of the song. “Dixie Lily” was a refreshing country-inspired song. I didn’t know it was supposed to be campy, I liked it at face value. “Solar Prestige A Gammon” is so-so. “You’re So Static” is quite catchy, the piano playing gives me a ragtime feel, which is always welcome.

“I’ve Seen the Saucers” has a very goofy title and lyrics, but the music itself of pretty serious and doesn’t fit the lyrics. “Stinker” is the most rocking song on the album. A song I’d recommend to the average classic rock fan. “Don’t Let the Sun Go Down in Me” has very good vocals from Elton John, I think the best on the whole album. “Ticking” was my favorite song on the album and a good closer. I really liked the piano work here, and it’s a song that could easily be played by Elton John himself.

For the singles:
“Pinball Wizard”: Was not aware of this version as I only heard The Who version. It’s got a really good piano and guitar solo section.
“Sick City”: Another great guitar and horns song. It could have easily been the A song.
“Cold Highway” is my least favorite of these B-sides, but that doesn’t mean it’s not a good song by itself.
“Step into Christmas” is a fun song with a really good bass. I like the chorus for the vocals. I’ve never heard this song before.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on March 29, 2022, 01:13:18 PM
Read the lyrics to “Ticking” again, I think it’s about sexual repression and hiding one’s sexuality. I figured there was something from childhood snapping in the guy, but yeah, I think I get it more now.  Powerful song either way.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 05, 2022, 07:48:17 PM
Aiming to get the CAPTAIN FANTASTIC review in this Friday. I’m very excited, as this is an album that I think very highly of.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on April 05, 2022, 08:58:52 PM
Aiming to get the CAPTAIN FANTASTIC review in this Friday. I’m very excited, as this is an album that I think very highly of.

I’ve heard some people call this the best Elton album.  I’m looking forward to it too.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 08, 2022, 10:47:23 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/16/Elton_John_-_Captain_Fantastic_and_the_Brown_Dirt_Cowboy.jpg)

I’m going to state right now that CAPTAIN FANTASTIC AND THE BROWN DIRT COWBOY is my absolute favorite Elton John album. It’s a special kind of album in the Elton John catalogue; as I’ve mentioned multiple times, Elton and Bernie created very cinematic songs in their careers, but what sets CAPTAIN FANTASTIC apart from the other albums is that it tells a complete story from start to finish, that story being the story of Elton John and Bernie Taupin. There really feels like there was a lot of love put into it, and not just in the songs either. I actually have the original vinyl and it’s loaded with extras: posters, early memorabilia and diary entries, there’s even a nice (somewhat fictionalized) little comic book that essentially recaps Elton’s rise to success.

What might seem shocking is that CAPTAIN FANTASTIC doesn’t tell the story up to the then-present day. Instead, it tells of that early period before Troubadour, where Elton and Bernie were struggling songwriters finding their place in the world. I think this was a perfect idea because it makes the story more relatable, and keeps us rooting for our heroes until we can finally leave them on their path to glory. This is what CAPTAIN FANTASTIC does so well; it tugs at the emotions in all the same ways as a movie can.

The first song is the title track, which introduces us to our main characters. Elton himself is Captain Fantastic, a city-life boy who at the time was part of a band called Bluesology. Bernie, meanwhile, is the Brown Dirt Cowboy, a small town kid obsessed with the American West. The two meet and are destined for greatness. I love the acoustic focus on it, it really feels like it captures that humble background that they both came from, and the more uptempo chorus captures that urgency for achievement that the duo strove for. Nigel and Dee especially really kill it during the chorus; Dee really could play these very melodic parts well and Nigel really builds things up so well on his drum parts. It properly sets the nostalgic mood for the album.

Next is “Tower of Babel”, which is about the business side of the music industry, particularly the publishers. It’s no surprise that it starts with the word ”snow”, because it kind of has a winter vibe to it; kind of dark and depressing, but still part of that lifestyle. The guitar playing here is cool, especially during the little instrumental section after the first chorus.

“Bitter Fingers” refers to Elton and Bernie’s time spent trying to write commercial songs for other artists, something they really struggled at. I love the irony of the music compared to the lyrics; the music is actually quite jolly, Elton’s fast piano at the beginning of the verses emphasizing that. And the way Elton sings “la de das” with the band backing him up on that at first glance would sound jolly, but as you examine the lyrics more, it is clear that he’s criticizing that style, which was what he was supposed to write. Once again, Davey’s guitar playing is great, especially near the end, and I love that combination of voices; when I think of the classic Elton John sound, those backing voices are just as much a part of it as anything else, and it’s again impressive to think that it was literally just Dee, Davey and Nigel; they didn’t need to hire professional backing singers, because they filled that spot perfectly.

“Tell Me When the Whistle Blows” is a really interesting song. Very funky, and I always felt that orchestra sounded like something out of a disco track. This one is about Bernie mainly, who was trying to adjust to city life. The band is great, the orchestra is great, and Elton gets the chance to remind us he can play multiple keyboards, as he plays electric piano and clavinet here.

“Someone Saved My Life Tonight” was the only single from this album. I remember hearing this as a kid on GREATEST HITS 1970-2002 and finding it to be one of the most emotional things I’ve ever heard, and I loved it, even without knowing it was actually rooted in real life events. Elton had been engaged during the period referenced in this song, but found himself conflicted between his music and settling down (I would also say the fact that he was gay, though judging from his autobiography, it doesn’t seem like he’d entirely realized that yet). He made a suicide attempt by putting his head in an oven, although he had left the window open and put a pillow under his head. Finally, both Long John Baldry and Bernie talked Elton out of it and it was for the best. It’s such a well-written song. The power of Elton’s piano, the passion in his falsetto, the way it builds up to the final chorus with Elton constantly singing “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” beforehand...it all creates this very majestic and emotional piece. I still love this song; the way it fades out still gets to me. So beautiful.

Next is “(Gotta Get a) Meal Ticket”, the most rocking song on the album. This is another song I love, for the complete opposite reason of “Someone Saved My Life Tonight”. “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” tugs at your heart strings; “Meal Ticket” pumps you up with energy. Elton and Bernie were not making a ton of money in those days, and this captures those struggles. Davey’s electric guitar playing is in the forefront here, as it should be, and I love that wicked little guitar solo he does. But I also think Elton’s clavinet playing deserves to be noticed too; the fast style captures the urgency of the lyrics and it’s such a unique, fun sound you don’t hear on too many Elton songs.

“Better Off Dead” refers to the time Elton and Bernie would spend in a bar after recording sessions for REGIMENTAL SGT. ZIPPO, observing the hopelessness of some of the characters they would see. This is a very percussion heavy song; while I love the melody Elton is playing on the piano and find it very catchy, it was always the drums that stood out the most to me on this song; this is probably the closest Nigel came to recapturing that hard pounding style of his early live shows with just Elton and Dee. The vocals on this track are also worth calling out; I love the middle with just Dee, Nigel and Davey and the way Elton sings “Better Off Dead” at the end is very haunting and atmospheric.

“Writing” is about...well, writing. The more laid back atmosphere captures the feeling of just staying at home, which makes sense considering that Elton and Bernie were living at Elton’s mom’s and would often write their songs (including “Your Song”) there. Truth be told, this is my least favorite song on the album, but that’s simply just because the rest of it is so fantastic. This one’s great too, another chance for Davey to show off (according to the album credits, Davey apparently plays a little piano on this too. Elton is on electric piano).

“We All Fall in Love Sometimes” and “Curtains” are technically separate songs, but much like “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding”, I find that, really, the two songs fit so well together that they should be considered as one. The first part, “We All Fall in Love Sometimes”, is about finding happiness, which is ironic because it does start off sounding almost kind of wistful, but as it goes along, you do realize that the memories are happy and, as Bernie wrote, “It’s all worth it”. I really love the attention to detail on this song; when Elton sings about EMPTY SKY, not only does he play harpsichord, but it even kind of sounds like the ending to “Val-Hala”. That’s a really good callback, the kind that shows they were truly dedicated to this project. And finally, “Curtains” brings everything to a satisfying close. In this song, Elton and Bernie specifically recall some of their earliest songs, such as “Scarecrow” and “A Dandelion Dies in the Wind”. Considering the title, I always considered this to be them preparing for some type of show, maybe Troubadour or maybe even a little later. As the curtains go up, we leave them as they are reminiscing on the brink of greatness. Elton’s “lum de lums” are such a perfect way to go out; that combined with the backing vocals and Ray’s bells especially creates such an uplifting, emotional atmosphere. I love it so much; the perfect ending to the perfect album.

CAPTAIN FANTASTIC continued the Elton John momentum that had built the past several years. Not only did it reach number one, but it also debuted at number one, apparently the first ever album to do so. And it feels so fitting; almost as though everything on the album was building up to this, like a reward for all of the hard work and memories that the album reflects. It really is a wonderful album and I hope you all enjoy it as much as I have over the years.

Before we go, there are a few singles and B-sides to discuss:

First up is “Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds”, a reggae-influenced cover of the Beatles classic that also features John Lennon himself on guitar. Much like Elton’s version of “Pinball Wizard”, he does a great job of making the song his own. It’s fitting that it was released in November, because despite not being a Christmas song, it does have a bit of a holiday feel to it in Ray’s bell part and the overall nostalgic tone. Its B-side is a cover of a John Lennon solo song from MIND GAMES, “One Day At a Time”. Truth be told, I’m not all that crazy about the original and this doesn’t do much for me either, but I do kind of like the little jazz-influenced piano playing in the instrumental section.

Next is “House of Cards”, the B-side to “Someone Saved My Life Tonight”. It’s nothing super special; it’s stylistically kind of similar to the title track, but missing the nostalgic charm. Thematically, it has nothing to do with the CAPTAIN FANTASTIC album, which has led some to suggest it was written during the CARIBOU sessions, but since none of the CARIBOU tracks have electric piano on them (which “House of Cards” does have), this would suggest it was indeed recorded around the time of CAPTAIN FANTASTIC.

And finally, we have “Philadelphia Freedom”, a fun little song dedicated to Elton’s friend Billie Jean King. Everyone knows it, obviously it’s a great song. Elton does some fun experimenting with his voice, Gene Page again provides great orchestrations and it has that great ‘70s charm to it that you could also hear on “Daniel”. The B-side is a live track that we will discuss real soon...just not today.

“Philadelphia Freedom” was credited to The Elton John Band. It was a great nod to the fact that they were truly a unit that knew how to work off of each other. They weren’t just a backing band, they truly were “The Elton John Band”. So, it came as a shock to all that, shortly before CAPTAIN FANTASTIC’s release, Elton announced he was splitting the band. Yes, even though Davey and Ray stayed on, Dee and Nigel were dropped from the lineup. Elton said he wanted to take a different direction. How did that work out for him? We’ll find out with the next album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on April 11, 2022, 02:28:30 PM
I just discovered Spotify on my TV can show lyrics while listening to songs.  This should come in handy for this album since it’s conceptual.  Hoping to get to it Thursday.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on April 12, 2022, 01:39:44 AM
I like the album cover there, it looks like a comic book cover. Interesting that the vinyl does come with a comic. I liked this album a lot, too.

"Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboy" does have an Americana feel to it, something that they have delved into several times before. It's cool to see a throwback here. "Tower of Babel" does have an electric guitar in it, but it still has more of a soft rock feel than a hard rock one. Elton John's vocals and lyrics are the highlights of this song. "Bitter Fingers" is a good upbeat song that again focuses on electric guitars. I noticed the synthesizers seem like they were toned down on this album. "Tell Me When The Whistle Blows" is very disco sounding, which would have been rising into the mainstream around this same time. My favorite part of the song are the keyboards. "Somebody Saved My Life Tonight" is a ballad that shows off Elton's keyboarding skills. The story behind it is interesting; that's a really odd way to attempt suicide.

"Gotta Get A Meal Ticket" is my favorite song on the album. It's an excellent rock track in the glorious 1970s style. "Better Off Dead" almost sounds like a cool down song after the great rocker before. The piano reminds of boogie woogie and ragtime playing. "Writing" has a country feel to it. It sort of sounds like a pedal steel guitar was used, but I don't think any were. "We All Fall in Love Sometimes" and "Curtains" from the sounds of it was intended to be an epic to end the album. It reminds me of "Hey Jude" with the buildup and the climax to fade out the song. It's even got a few backing singers.

Speaking of The Beatles "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" was a song I was familiar with, but not this version. I think I've almost always heard the Beatles version, but apparently this was also a big hit. The reggae stuff was completely unexpected, I guess we can add Elton John to the list of musicians who did reggae influenced music. "One Day at a Time" does have a very good piano section at the end. "Philadelphia Freedom" sounds like a very mid 1970s song with the strings that also give the song a sort of disco feeling.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on April 14, 2022, 06:11:26 PM
      Fantastic album overall.  I don’t like to make bold statements on albums I have just been introduced to, but I can see this possibly being the best Elton album, or at least darn close.  What I do know is there are no cases where Elton sounds like The Rolling Stones or Elton sounds like Tom Jones or whoever.  Here, Elton sounds like Elton and that should be the biggest take away of this post..  Everybody sounds like a complete unit and this sounds like a complete album that gels together.  I think by 1975 bands of this generation really seemed to hit a peak before the excesses of drugs, punk, disco or whatever hit them.

      This felt much more like an album experience so this is less of a case where the songs stand out early.  The two exceptions are “Tower of Babel” and “Someone Saved My Life Tonight.” I love all the biblical references with rock n roll 70’s excess.  The crazy imagery with the call girls under the table and the medication prescribed to give a heart attack (Bill Ward just had one around this time, these guys were all going through the same garbage).  The malaise with all the adoring people yet no one truly there with a shoulder to cry on when they need it.  A rocking tune and really fantastic, gives the vibe of the Elton bio pic for sure in the crazy moments.  “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” again is a song I know, so of course I have a stronger opinion of it than the others at the moment.  A really beautiful and moving song for sure.  Cinematic is the right word,  it really does paint the story well.

      I’ve always enjoyed the cover of “Lucy In the Sky with Diamonds” and like the reggae twist Elton adds.  It seems like he’s one of the few who can do reggae and have me like it.  Had no clue until now Elton covered “One Day At a Time.”  I really enjoyed his version.  It should also be mentioned Elton worked with John Lennon on “Whatever Gets You Through the Night” at this time and the song hit number one.  There’s also the John Lennon appearance at Elton’s Madison Square Garden concert around this time - I believe John’s last concert.  The night John and Yoko reconciled.  So yeah, a fruitful collaboration with Elton John Lennon.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 14, 2022, 10:59:54 PM
I like the album cover there, it looks like a comic book cover. Interesting that the vinyl does come with a comic. I liked this album a lot, too.

"Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboy" does have an Americana feel to it, something that they have delved into several times before. It's cool to see a throwback here. "Tower of Babel" does have an electric guitar in it, but it still has more of a soft rock feel than a hard rock one. Elton John's vocals and lyrics are the highlights of this song. "Bitter Fingers" is a good upbeat song that again focuses on electric guitars. I noticed the synthesizers seem like they were toned down on this album. "Tell Me When The Whistle Blows" is very disco sounding, which would have been rising into the mainstream around this same time. My favorite part of the song are the keyboards. "Somebody Saved My Life Tonight" is a ballad that shows off Elton's keyboarding skills. The story behind it is interesting; that's a really odd way to attempt suicide.

"Gotta Get A Meal Ticket" is my favorite song on the album. It's an excellent rock track in the glorious 1970s style. "Better Off Dead" almost sounds like a cool down song after the great rocker before. The piano reminds of boogie woogie and ragtime playing. "Writing" has a country feel to it. It sort of sounds like a pedal steel guitar was used, but I don't think any were. "We All Fall in Love Sometimes" and "Curtains" from the sounds of it was intended to be an epic to end the album. It reminds me of "Hey Jude" with the buildup and the climax to fade out the song. It's even got a few backing singers.

Speaking of The Beatles "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" was a song I was familiar with, but not this version. I think I've almost always heard the Beatles version, but apparently this was also a big hit. The reggae stuff was completely unexpected, I guess we can add Elton John to the list of musicians who did reggae influenced music. "One Day at a Time" does have a very good piano section at the end. "Philadelphia Freedom" sounds like a very mid 1970s song with the strings that also give the song a sort of disco feeling.

Very interesting comparison of “Curtains” to “Hey Jude”. It’s funny, because I have seen “Bite Your Lip” compared to “Hey Jude”, but “Curtains” definitely seems to fit that description more; very dramatic and the “lum de lums” are a unique type of thing to sing in the same way as the “nah-nah-nah-nahs” from “Hey Jude”.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 14, 2022, 11:05:01 PM
      Fantastic album overall.  I don’t like to make bold statements on albums I have just been introduced to, but I can see this possibly being the best Elton album, or at least darn close.  What I do know is there are no cases where Elton sounds like The Rolling Stones or Elton sounds like Tom Jones or whoever.  Here, Elton sounds like Elton and that should be the biggest take away of this post..  Everybody sounds like a complete unit and this sounds like a complete album that gels together.  I think by 1975 bands of this generation really seemed to hit a peak before the excesses of drugs, punk, disco or whatever hit them.

      This felt much more like an album experience so this is less of a case where the songs stand out early.  The two exceptions are “Tower of Babel” and “Someone Saved My Life Tonight.” I love all the biblical references with rock n roll 70’s excess.  The crazy imagery with the call girls under the table and the medication prescribed to give a heart attack (Bill Ward just had one around this time, these guys were all going through the same garbage).  The malaise with all the adoring people yet no one truly there with a shoulder to cry on when they need it.  A rocking tune and really fantastic, gives the vibe of the Elton bio pic for sure in the crazy moments.  “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” again is a song I know, so of course I have a stronger opinion of it than the others at the moment.  A really beautiful and moving song for sure.  Cinematic is the right word,  it really does paint the story well.

      I’ve always enjoyed the cover of “Lucy In the Sky with Diamonds” and like the reggae twist Elton adds.  It seems like he’s one of the few who can do reggae and have me like it.  Had no clue until now Elton covered “One Day At a Time.”  I really enjoyed his version.  It should also be mentioned Elton worked with John Lennon on “Whatever Gets You Through the Night” at this time and the song hit number one.  There’s also the John Lennon appearance at Elton’s Madison Square Garden concert around this time - I believe John’s last concert.  The night John and Yoko reconciled.  So yeah, a fruitful collaboration with Elton John Lennon.

Yes, the Madison Square Garden Show is indeed something I plan on covering, as that makes up part of the live album, HERE AND THERE.

I agree with the idea of this album really needing to be viewed as a full album experience. “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” was of course a big single, but everything else always feels like it should be played one after another, it should be viewed as a whole. One thing I forgot to mention in my initial post is the fact that this was written in chronological order. That goes to show how dedicated they were to this concept.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on April 14, 2022, 11:17:33 PM
Yes, the Madison Square Garden Show is indeed something I plan on covering, as that makes up part of the live album, HERE AND THERE.

I agree with the idea of this album really needing to be viewed as a full album experience. “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” was of course a big single, but everything else always feels like it should be played one after another, it should be viewed as a whole. One thing I forgot to mention in my initial post is the fact that this was written in chronological order. That goes to show how dedicated they were to this concept.

I checked out the Wikipedia page and the bonus disc live from Wembley 1975 has all the songs played live sequentially, so yeah, definitely meant to be an album experience.  Interesting that they wrote it sequentially as well, very unusual. I’m going to listen to this one again on Saturday.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on April 15, 2022, 07:42:08 AM
I'm interested in listening to some of Elton John's live performances knowing that Jeff Baxter, Steely Dan's pedal steel guitarist in their early albums, was a tour musician for Elton John.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 15, 2022, 09:52:47 AM
I'm interested in listening to some of Elton John's live performances knowing that Jeff Baxter, Steely Dan's pedal steel guitarist in their early albums, was a tour musician for Elton John.

I was about to bring this up since metaldams brought up the 1975 Wembley show and I know you’re a big Steely Dan fan. Baxter only played at that show, though, and it’s infamous for being the show where The Beach Boys upstaged Elton. While I like the idea of playing CAPTAIN FANTASTIC in full, it’s generally accepted that doing that was considered a huge mistake, as the album was still so new and fans were expecting to hear him play more hits.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 19, 2022, 09:26:18 PM
Aiming to get the ROCK OF THE WESTIES review up on Friday or Saturday. Also excited for this one, as I consider it to be the most underrated Elton John album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 23, 2022, 12:11:28 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/ae/Elton_John_-_Rock_of_the_Westies.jpg)

ROCK OF THE WESTIES is kind of in a strange spot in the Elton John catalogue. I’ve mentioned before that 1970-1976 is generally considered Elton John’s classic period, and just looking at the chart numbers from that period, it seems to be supported. Heck, much like the album that preceded it, WESTIES debuted at number 1 and even had a number 1 hit single. But it doesn’t feel like time has been quite as kind to it. I have no doubt that there are a lot of fans of this album, but I have seen multiple opinions considering this the weakest of the classic albums. I disagree with this assessment; I love this album and think it very much still deserves to be considered part of the classic period.

As you might imagine, ROCK OF THE WESTIES is a rock heavy album, which was intentional. Elton decided he wanted to quickly record a new album to show off his new lineup, which promised to be heavier and funkier. The lineup was a combination of old, present, and new. The “present” was Davey Johnstone and Ray Cooper, who were retained from the previous lineup. The “old” were Hookfoot members Roger Pope on drums and Caleb Quaye as another guitarist. Then we get the two new guys. The bassist was Kenny Passarelli, who had previously played with Joe Walsh. Finally, Elton decided to add a second keyboardist to the band. James Newton Howard was a session musician who had played keyboards for artists like Melissa Manchester and Ringo Starr (playing synthesizer on the Elton- and Bernie-penned “Snookeroo”). He has since gone on to become a famous film score composer, with credits including THE HUNGER GAMES series and THE DARK KNIGHT. While it is kind of a shame that Elton chose not to continue doing the various types of keyboard parts himself as he had on the previous album, Newton Howard still proves himself to be a very impressive player and has some real shining moments throughout the album.

The album starts with “Medley: Yell Help/Wednesday Night/Ugly”, which, as you can probably guess, is a medley. Immediately the tone of the album is established here. Lyrically, the album is not capturing the conceptual feelings of CAPTAIN FANTASTIC or TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION. Instead, the focus is rock, and the minute you hear those heavy guitars and synthesizers, you know what you’re getting in to. As you could probably guess, synthesizers start becoming more prominent here than on previous albums. Later on in Elton’s career, this would start to become an issue, but on this album, the natural guitar tones play well off of them; it still feels like a full rock and roll band playing, just with the addition of synthesizers. I really love the structure of this medley. “Yell Help” is pure rock full of guitars and synths, then it cuts into a brief interlude with “Wednesday Night”; the combination of Elton and Labelle’s voices with the synthesizers creates an otherworldly sound that’s very effective. It then focuses more on the guitars with “Ugly” before coming full circle at the end. That’s what I love most about this song; how everything ties together, especially the way Elton sings “Wednesday Night” over his “Yell Helps”. I thought that was really clever. Oh, and if there’s a part near the end where Labelle sounds suspiciously like a man, no, your ears are not playing tricks on you; Gus Dudgeon found out he needed additional vocals and ended up imitating Labelle himself!

That awesome opener is followed by “Dan Dare (Pilot of the Future)”. Written about a British comic book character, this song really focuses on the “futuristic” element, starting with Davey’s hilarious low vocals through a voice bag. One huge drawback to the loss of Dee and Nigel was the loss of that distinct backing vocal combination that had helped define Elton John records and the band here never really captures a consistent voice in that aspect, but it’s still interesting to hear them experiment with different styles. Here, they actually sound a lot like Queen, which works for me since I like Queen too. This is a very catchy song, featuring some great bass work, guitars and clavinets.

Next up is “Island Girl”, the big hit on the album. I do find this song catchy, but it’s also my least favorite song here and, in my opinion, a terrible representation of the album. The tone of it sounds so much more commercial than any other Elton John single this period, and in the kind of way that makes it more dated. It really is not a heavy rock song, and I feel like it gives the whole album a bad reputation as a result. Again, I must stress that I do enjoy it despite how obviously dated and formulaic it is, but...man, why couldn’t any other song have been the big hit? Speaking of which...

Next is “Grow Some Funk of Your Own”, which is more along the lines of the overall album tone. This kind of falls in “Saturday Night’s Alright (For Fighting)” territory, with more of a focus on guitars and Elton intentionally making his voice sound a bit rougher. I love the little comments he makes between the choruses, and the ending is a really good showcase for both Elton on piano and Ray on the vibraphone. This was part of a double A-side with the song that followed it, and sadly, they did not do as well as “Island Girl”, despite clearly being superior songs.

“I Feel Like a Bullet (In the Gun of Robert Ford)” is the perfect companion song to “Grow Some Funk of Your Own” given their reliance on vibraphone. This is a really interesting song; it’s a ballad, but it still has a heavier tone to it. Lyrically, it compares the breakup of a relationship to Jessie James’s assassin. Might seem like an odd comparison at first, but it makes sense when you listen to the song; the narrator feels like a traitor, much as Ford himself was labeled. The tone is captured quite clearly in the music, Davey’s weeping guitar solo being a highlight. And Elton’s voice, of course is fantastic, really nailing the falsettos in the choruses. In general, I feel this is the period where Elton’s voice was at its peak; his voice sounds so smooth and clear on this and the previous two albums, which is quite impressive to think about considering Caribou Ranch is located in the Rocky Mountains at a high altitude, which makes singing incredibly difficult. Listening to these three albums, it sounds almost as though the experience helped Elton’s voice become stronger in a way.

Starting off side 2 is “Street Kids”, probably the most guitar-based song on the album. This time Caleb gets the big guitar solo; he and Roger especially do a great job of giving this song an extra punch, very Rolling Stones-like. Once again, a very catchy song with an especially awesome fade out at the end, the kind that never gets tiring despite the song being over 6 minutes. This is one of the tracks I like to cite when proving Elton does indeed deserve to be categorized as a rock-and-roll artist.

“Hard Luck Story” might seem like an odd song lyrically, being about a husband constantly complaining about his job and suddenly deciding to leave his wife as a result. Well, there’s a reason for that: it was originally written for Kiki Dee and meant to be from the wife’s perspective. When Elton recorded, it was rewritten to be from the husband’s perspective. The confusing lyrical change aside, this is another cool guitar-heavy song, with Elton again getting to show off a bit more with his piano playing near the end.

Next up is “Feed Me”, a song about drug addiction. Given its subject matter, I’d like to take this moment to say that there is absolutely no evidence of Elton himself taking drugs pre-CARIBOU; I’m not entirely sure when that started, but it’s generally accepted that it was at least after GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD. He almost certainly was taking them by the time of ROCK OF THE WESTIES. Regardless of who “Feed Me” actually was about, it’s still a very powerful song that really captures the sadness and loneliness it’s going for. Of all the songs on this album, this is where the band really find themselves as backing vocalists; their sorrowful voices during the chorus contribute to the emotional atmosphere. Such a great song; the electric piano sets the tone, and after the final chorus, the guitars make the atmosphere even heavier. It’s hard to explain, but it’s like the guitars are helping build it to a definitive climax near the end, and I find it to be a really cool effect, with Ray’s wind chimes part at the end calming things down, before transitioning into the epic closing song...

“Billy Bones and the White Bird”. I LOVE this song! This song follows what’s known as the “Bo Diddley Beat”, something readily apparent in Roger Pope’s drumming. Elton and Kiki Dee are in perfect harmony throughout. Yes, most of the singing just amounts to Elton and Kiki singing “check it out”, but you know what, that’s enough for me, because it allows the whole band to just focus on the rock angle, and rock out they do. The guitars are awesome, there’s a really cool keyboard solo; heck, even Ray’s tambourine can be made out pretty well. It all feels like it’s building to something, and the “Check It Outs” are like Elton and Kiki taking charge. Some may find it repetitive, but I adore it, and I’d even go so far as to say it’s my favorite closing track on an Elton John album.

As I hinted at previously, I think ROCK OF THE WESTIES is Elton’s most underrated album. It may not be his absolute best, and from a lyrical perspective, it doesn’t quite have as much of a cinematic quality as the other classic Elton albums (“Bullet” and “Feed Me” being major exceptions), but it does what it set out to accomplish: it’s a band playing rock and roll and having fun. And I have fun listening to it; in my eyes, this still ranks up there with the best.

Just one B-side this time, and it’s actually a cover. The B-side to “Island Girl” was the Kiki Dee composition “Sugar on the Floor”. It’s not good; there’s a decent Etta James cover of it, but it is not strong enough to support Elton’s incredibly bare arrangement here. What makes it even worse is that guitars are briefly thrown in, but they make what’s already kind of a boring song just sound flat out silly. Definitely B-side material.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on April 26, 2022, 02:29:01 AM
Another hit in the park for Elton John. It's ironic that Elton John wanted to rush out an album, usually I thought musicians wanted more time to record and prepare the release.

"Medley: Yell Help / Wednesday Night / Ugly" is so good, and might be my favorite song on the album. The Yell Help section has a guitar riff that sounds like it takes inspiration from southern rock/roots rock. The backing vocals are an extra addition to make the song even better. "Ugly" has what sounds like an attempt to do a heavy synthesizer riff, I didn't know you could make them go that quickly! "Dan Dare (Pilot Of The Future)" is a serviceable catchy song. The guitar solo is a bit unique with that effect being used throughout. "Island Girl" is very cheesy, not just the music but the lyrics. That can be fine in some cases, but here it's not to my taste. "Grow Some Funk of Your Own": When I saw the title, I assumed it was going to be a funk song, but that is not the case. We do get a good rocker, though. I also like the addition of the vibraphone, that's an instrument I usually enjoy to hear, though I associate it more with jazz music. "I Feel Like A Bullet (In The Gun Of Robert Ford)" is the ballad of the album, and a good way to end the A side after the more upbeat tracks. Nice change of pace.

"Street Kids" starts off the B side with a bang! Absolutely great rocker, oh my goodness. This might be his heaviest song so far. Also another song with great keyboards and backing vocals. "Hard Luck Story" is not so heavy, but it is also upbeat. I liked the backing vocals on the songs previously, but this might be where they are most prominent, actually taking center stage. "Feed Me" musically is more lowkey, having an AOR feel to it, that would become more mainstream staring the late 1970s. "Billy Bones And The White Bird" is one of those songs where it sounds like it's building up to a heavier climax, only to not deliver, as a result it will be one I like more on subsequent listens than the first time.

"Sugar on the Floor" is the weakest track from this period. The title makes it sound we might get at least some silly fun, but it's not up to par. I don't know what sugar on the floor is supposed to feel like.

An overall strong album that gives us some really good rock songs like the opening medley track and "Street Kids".
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on April 27, 2022, 09:28:26 PM
Haven’t had as much music time as I’d like recently between work, family,  baseball and writing my own reviews, but I did listen to the first two tracks on my drive to work this morning. That opening medley was pretty awesome and I loved the way all three parts harmonized together at the end.  I thought that was so creative.  The second track was pretty rocking as well, I loved the way they quote the guitar lick from “Saturday Night’s Alright for Fighting” in the song.  Should have time to give this whole album a listen tomorrow, but so far, it sounds promising.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on April 28, 2022, 03:47:39 AM
I’ve been addicted to Yell Help the past few days, listening to it over and over again. Catchiest guitar riff for me so far in an Elton John song.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on April 28, 2022, 08:18:27 AM
Haven’t had as much music time as I’d like recently between work, family,  baseball and writing my own reviews, but I did listen to the first two tracks on my drive to work this morning. That opening medley was pretty awesome and I loved the way all three parts harmonized together at the end.  I thought that was so creative.  The second track was pretty rocking as well, I loved the way they quote the guitar lick from “Saturday Night’s Alright for Fighting” in the song.  Should have time to give this whole album a listen tomorrow, but so far, it sounds promising.

I’m in a similar situation, but I’m planning on catching up on Led Zeppelin this weekend. Good catch on the “Saturday Night’s Alright” callback in the middle. I’ve noticed that too but didn’t think to mention it.

I’ve been addicted to Yell Help the past few days, listening to it over and over again. Catchiest guitar riff for me so far in an Elton John song.


Really glad you both like this album so far. I agree, the opening medley is really awesome, and I often find it stuck in my head, especially that “Yell Help/Wednesday Night” mashup at the end. In general, this is an album I often find myself recommending to first time Elton John fans. A really solid set of tracks that’s helped by its focus on the rock angle specifically.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on April 28, 2022, 07:50:41 PM
Fantastic album, I just listened to it two times in a row.  Funny you say “Dan Dare” reminds you of Queen because I was thinking more the opening medley.  Only in the sense it’s a medley, as Queen did that on QUEEN II and SHEER HEART ATTACK.  But yeah, a really creative song and I think I like the psychedelic “Wednesday Night” part the best. 

I did dig “Island Girl.”  Yeah, not as rocking as others on the album and maybe I can understand it not being the best representation for a single, but it is a fun, catchy, and endearingly cheesy tune.  It put a smile on my face.

“Grow Some Funk On Your Own” is simply a fantastic rocker, while “I Feel Like A Bullet (In the Gun of Robben Ford) is a slice of pop perfection the way “Rocket Man” is.  Nice contrast between two very strong tracks that add character to the album.

“Street Kids,” is another strong rocker.  The guitar and piano interplay has a Lynyrd Skynyrd like feel to it yet the rhythm section is much more driving.  Love this song, excellent.

“Hard Luck Story” made the least impression because I’m at a loss of much to say, but I remember at least enjoying it on some level.  “Feed Me” is a great Elton confessional song that gives the album some depth.  To throw in a drug story in the Elton camp, it was actually Bernie Taupin who turned Alice Cooper onto cocaine - right after Alice quit alcohol for a while.  The habit almost killed Alice and this was just made public in the past ten years.  Elton was also hanging with John Lennon during his “lost weekend” so God knows the excess Elton saw.  “Bill Bones and the White Bird” I found to be a satisfying closer with a strong fade out.

Overall a really good album and definitely one of my favorites so far.  I have no idea why this is rated so low compared to his other albums of the era.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on May 03, 2022, 10:46:05 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/81/Elton_John_-_Here_and_There.jpg)

We briefly go back in time for this next album, Elton’s second live album, HERE AND THERE. The title comes from the fact that the album is made up of two different shows, both from 1974. Side 1 is “Here”, from a charity show at the Royal Festival Hall in London; side 2 is “There” from the Thanksgiving Show at Madison Square Garden in New York City. Both shows were special and would have seemed fitting for a live album; The Royal Festival Hall show was a charity show that was dedicated to reviving old Elton songs that hadn’t been played in some time, while the New York show was famous for having some guy named John Lennon making an appearance. Looking at the original album, it doesn’t entirely capture this. To its credit, 3 of the 5 songs on side 1 do, but the New York Show makes the gigantic mistake of not including the Lennon portion of the show. This is the perfect time to note that this was essentially released for the purpose of completing Elton’s contract with DJM. In 1973, he had founded his own record company, The Rocket Record Company, and following this release, his albums would be released in the UK through Rocket. 17-11-70 felt like it had artistic ambition; HERE AND THERE is essentially a contractual obligation.

That’s not to say what’s on HERE AND THERE isn’t good. On the contrary, I think what’s on here is really good, and it demonstrates the full Elton John Band in full form with Ray Cooper included. However, it’s definitely the 1990s remastered CD that is really worth checking out, as it includes more songs and paints an overall better picture of what made each show so special. Since these are live versions of many songs we’ve discussed before, I’m not going to do a full track-by-track here, but instead, talk about the specific highlights.

The Royal Festival Hall show opens with a solo version of “Skyline Pigeon”, the song that Elton fondly remembers as the first song he and Bernie wrote that they felt was really good. Considering the theme of nostalgia, it’s fitting that they chose a song from EMPTY SKY to open with. “Border Song” follows, and is also nostalgic in the sense that it’s just Elton, Dee, and Nigel performing, just like in the Troubadour days. Both great performances, and “Border Song” shows that the undeniable chemistry they had just as a trio had not lessened in any way despite no longer performing as one regularly.

The version of “Love Song” here is pretty cool. Usually when performing this song live, it was either done as a piano only piece or an acoustic-centric piece in which Elton left the piano, went to the front of the stage and played acoustic guitar(!) This performance is unique, though. For one thing, Elton brought out Lesley Duncan to perform the song with him; Duncan was known for having stage fright, so it was rare for her to make live performances. Additionally, the performance feels very in line with the Elton John style of the time; Davey is playing electric guitar and doing some really great interplay with Elton (this time on piano) throughout, and both Elton and Lesley give strong, passionate vocal performances throughout; it’s like they knew this would be the only such arrangement and were dedicated to giving the song the respect it deserved.

“Bad Side of the Moon” is amazing! I’ve talked highly of this song before. The single version is a cool, orchestral-heavy piece and the live version from 17-11-70 takes it in a different, heavier direction. This version sounds like something that should be on classic rock stations. I love the way it starts; It starts with this beautiful electric guitar part from Davey, supported by some light taps from Nigel and Ray Cooper playing the bells. It builds up to include Elton and Dee, then...boom! They launch into it with a real drive and keep that momentum moving until they repeat that beautiful opening in the middle, and finally go out with some of Davey’s best live guitar work. It’s such a fantastic arrangement; they took a good song, perfected it, and...never played it again. Yep, as of this writing, this is the last known performance of this song by Elton. I assume they felt it didn’t really go down that well with the audience and decided it wasn’t really worth revisiting...and, man, that is really a shame, because I love this version so much and would have enjoyed getting to hear more performances of it in this style. It’s the classic Elton John live staple that sadly never was.

“Honky Cat” does go down well with the audience, as you’d expect. What makes this so interesting is Ray Cooper’s duck call solo. Yes, you read that right. Ray Cooper is so talented that he can turn a duck call into an instrument...and you know what, of all the songs to pick, this does make the most sense, given its uptempo, already slightly silly nature. I enjoy it; I can understand some people finding it annoying, but man...it’s just so fascinating to listen to that. Also cool to hear Davey playing a bit of “Camptown Races” at the end.

On to the Madison Square Garden show. This one is full of more of the hits fans would recognize, starting with the classic opener, “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding”. What’s especially interesting about this performance is the fact that it’s just the core lineup without any sort of keyboardist. The synth opening is actually just a playback of the original album recording. This also means that it lacks the flute-like synths during the piano solo in “Love Lies Bleeding”, which does feel kind of odd, but you do notice more of Elton as a result. It’s a really great rendition of the song.

“Grey Seal” really turns into a full-on rock song here, with the ending fadeout of the album becoming a chance for a guitar and bass-driven jam. It’s funny remembering that this was once a slow, orchestral piece that was almost destined to be forgotten, and now suddenly it becomes this real powerful number in a large stadium.

A new addition to the group is introduced for “You’re So Static”: the Muscle Shoals Horns, who help bring the horn-driven atmosphere of CARIBOU to the Madison Square Garden stage. “You’re So Static” kicks things off well, and then history is made.

Elton had appeared on a couple tracks on John Lennon’s WALLS AND BRIDGES, including the single “Whatever Gets You thru the Night”. In turn, Lennon had guested on Elton’s version of “Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds” and the two formed a strong friendship. Elton bet Lennon that “Whatever Gets You thru the Night” would be a number 1 single, saying that Lennon would have to join him on stage if it did hit number 1. Lennon, having not had a solo number 1 hit and not thinking this would be it, agreed...and, of course, he lost. As promised, Lennon came on stage and performed three songs with the Elton John Band: “Whatever Gets You thru the Night”, “Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds”, and, in a surprising twist, Paul’s number, “I Saw Her Standing There”. The results are as great as you’d expect. The Muscles Shoals Horns’ saxophone player, in particular, does an excellent job on “Whatever Gets You thru the Night”. The guitars especially stand out on “I Saw Her Standing There”. But what probably stands out the most for me, is just hearing John Lennon performing “Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds” live. Remember, this was a song that he had never played live before and, sadly, would never get to play again. It’s just so wonderful finally getting to hear him have a chance at it; there’s something truly special about the little solo section he gets to sing in the middle as well as the final performance of the chorus where you can also make out his voice well. It’s a really solid three songs that, unfortunately, would turn out to be his last live. But man, what a performance, and we’re lucky that it has been preserved in such good quality.

The closing two songs are “Your Song” and “The Bitch is Back”. “Your Song” gets special treatment as Elton changes the lyrics to reflect his love for New York, and I can imagine people being in the audience really appreciating it; it certainly sounds like they did based on the audience reaction. “The Bitch is Back” closes things off with some classic rock. As you’ll notice, the key is changed, which actually reduces the party atmosphere and gives it more of a hard edge, which I kind of prefer.

So yeah, HERE AND THERE is still a good live album, although unlike the original 17-11-70, most of the highlights do come from the remastered version in the 1990s. The “There” side has more hits for the casual fans with the addition of Lennon, while “Here” has some of the best performances of some of his lesser-known songs (although I will admit the version of “Burn Down the Mission” here really lacks the extra punch of the 17-11-70 version). Well worth checking out.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on May 05, 2022, 09:38:35 PM
      If contractually, Elton had only one album left on his contract, I can understand this being a single.  However, a shame this wasn’t released as or close to the expanded reissue (the version I listened to) because this is quite good.  I do like the concept of the two shows and the way they are sequenced.  The first album, until the end, feels more like deep cuts at the beginning and it grows more into the hits. 

      A very useful album for a guy like me.  I’ve been listening to a lot of Elton lately and it’s a lot to absorb at once, so this consolidation of an era should get a lot of play from me and make those older albums easier to digest once I’m used to this live one.  One of the curses of getting older is an inability to absorb new music as quickly as I used to.  Yet, I still have music from my teen years, even if I hadn’t heard it in decades, memorized.  It started at thirty for me, I hate it.

      I thought the duet version of “Love Song” was fantastic here.  “Take Me To the Pilot” has more bite live and “Daniel” seemed a tad more driving here too.  The John Lennon stuff is of course a lot of fun and the band is really cooking on “Whatever Gets You Through the Night.”
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on May 09, 2022, 12:03:10 AM
Elton John was great live during this period, his piano playing having a slightly different feel than the studio albums, feeling more fantastical when live. His vocals are also almost perfect live, I haven't heard any of the later concerts after this, so I'm not sure if he was able to keep this up.

I noticed the duck call in "Honky Cat" and wondered what was going on, it was very goofy sounding. Such a strange decision to use that live as an instrument. I did like the slap bass playing near the end of the song. “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding” was probably my favorite performance on here, giving me that otherworldly feeling when hearing Elton John play on the piano. The long instrumental section is a good pick for a live audience. "Bennie and the Jets" had a the audience cheering along, and this time it was for real! That was a song I was wanting to hear live eventually for that reason.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on May 13, 2022, 02:36:27 PM
Coming this weekend:

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on May 14, 2022, 11:03:26 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/ab/Elton_John_-_Blue_Moves.jpg)

We move on to Elton’s second double album, BLUE MOVES. Unlike GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD, which is considered an undeniable classic, BLUE MOVES has much more mixed opinions. Some consider it one of the greatest albums he’s ever made, including Elton himself. Some consider it repetitive and overly moody; the album was made at a bad time in Elton and Bernie’s personal lives, with Elton struggling with overwork and Bernie dealing with his failing first marriage, and that’s reflected in a lot of the songs here. And then, of course, there are those who think this should have been cut down to a single album.

I used to be in this last category, but upon repeated listens, I’ve been finding it kind of has a WHITE ALBUM quality to it, where, though there are definitely some songs I’d have no problem cutting, there actually are more good songs than I used to give it credit for. I’ve never disliked the album; in fact, it actually contains a song that I consider to be one of the greatest songs Elton has ever recorded. But there is something about the sequencing, especially the second half, that does make the “blue” atmosphere a bit too much to handle, even though individually a lot of these songs are good.

It starts with “Your Starter For”, an instrumental written not by Elton, but by Caleb Quaye. Although additional writing credits had started appearing on ROCK OF THE WESTIES, it becomes more common here, with Caleb, Davey and James Newton Howard all receiving co-writing credits on multiple songs. It’s a cool song; the riff is catchy and the musicianship around it is strong, with some cool synth work and marimba playing supporting Caleb’s main guitar riff. Oddly enough, Elton is credited for playing piano here, but he’s either so far back in the mix that I can’t hear him or he’s not on it at all; the album also credits Elton and Bernie for writing the other two instrumentals, so they’re not exactly that accurate.

“Your Starter For” transitions into “Tonight”, the first of many sad ballads. This has a really awesome orchestral intro written by James Newton Howard and probably the most classical influenced piece on an Elton album since...well, ELTON JOHN. But unlike something like “Sixty Years On”, there feels like there’s a proper balance and interplay between the orchestra and Elton’s piano. The actual song itself is great too, keeping the focus on Elton, who’s in great vocal form throughout.

The next track is “One Horse Town”, which I consider to be one of the greatest tracks Elton has ever recorded. The moment I heard it, I just fell in love with it. It starts with a Newton Howard-influenced prelude, this time him playing keyboards, and I believe this is also the source for his co-writing credit on the song. Slowly some strings join the mix before...boom! The rest of the band hits you with this epic, guitar-heavy introduction that continues building and building. It’s supported by what I consider Paul Buckmaster’s best arrangement on an Elton song. It’s funny, writing about “Tonight” and the ELTON JOHN connection made me realize just how different Buckmaster’s style was by this time. Buckmaster gives this already epic song some appropriately epic orchestrations. I love the way they play off of the guitar during the solo and how they match it between verses. Elton’s voice is fantastic, the guitar solo is great, and there’s an amazing, “Wednesday Night”-style bridge section that features a really cool combination of synths, guitars and vocal harmonies; “they’ll pick all night” is one of my favorite Elton vocals. It’s such an awesome song, very much in the same epic way as “Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding”.

We return to ballad territory with “Chameleon”, which is actually an older song that Elton intended for The Beach Boys to record, but they apparently rejected it. Beach Boy Bruce Johnston, who had also arranged the backing vocals for “Don’t Let the Sun Go Down on Me”, also came in to arrange the backing vocals for this one, and you can kind of hear a Beach Boys-influence here. Even Elton’s higher register vocals sound kind of unique here compared to most tracks. Not much to say here otherwise; it’s a good song with unique vocals that moves at a good pace.

What doesn’t move at such a good pace is the next song: “Boogie Pilgrim”. I don’t like this song. With a name like that you’d think it would be this upbeat, dance song, but there’s nothing remotely danceable about it. It’s this ridiculously slow number that goes on way too long. I don’t like the horn arrangement, the chorus is repetitive...nothing about this track works for me, it just feels way too much like it’s chasing trends that it can’t catch.

“Cage the Songbird” is definitely an improvement over “Boogie Pilgrim”, but feels a bit underwhelming. Co-written with Davey Johnstone, this actually originated during the ROCK OF THE WESTIES sessions; in fact, it was actually written during the same writing session as “Grow Some Funk of Your Own”. It’s a quiet acoustic number, a type of number I usually tend to really like. It’s fine, but for some reason it just doesn’t impress me as much as I feel it should; it might be the length, as this song is surprisingly short. I suppose it’s kind of like “Goodbye” in a way, in that it ends just when it feels like it’s really getting started. Again, I want to stress that I don’t dislike it, I do like the instrumentation here...it just doesn’t grab my attention the way I feel it should.

“Crazy Water” is another song I feel sounds too much like it’s trying to chase trends, although unlike “Boogie Pilgrim”, I don’t necessarily dislike it. It sounds a bit like “Writing” mixed with “Hard Luck Story”, but if they were way overproduced and with a backing vocal arrangement that’s not really that good. A lot of people really like this one and it’s shown up from time to time at concerts as a result, but...I don’t know, it just doesn’t scream “classic” to me.

The last song of side 2, thankfully, is a huge improvement. “Shoulder Holster” is interesting because it actually doesn’t have (non-bass) guitars on it at all. Instead, the rhythm is driven by Elton, Roger, Kenny, and the Brecker Brothers on horns. And unlike “Boogie Pilgrim”, the horn riff here is actually really fun and catchy. The harmonies are especially great here, too. I absolutely love the ending fadeout with Elton singing “you can never tell if the law’s about” in multiple different pitches. Such a fun song and easily the best song on side 2.

Side 3 opens with probably the most well-known song from the album, “Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word”. “Sorry” is a unique song in the Elton catalogue, as it’s a rare case of Elton writing the melody before the lyrics with Bernie; in fact, some sources state that most of the lyrics are Elton’s, which I can believe. That’s not meant to be derogatory in any way; the lyrics kind of have a simplistic quality to them that feels fitting for the theme. The vibraphone and accordion add to the atmosphere and James Newton Howard even throws in another nice string arrangement. A solid song overall, though considering its light tone and sad theme, it’s kind of surprising that it became a hit. At least “Someone Saved My Life Tonight” built up to something hopeful in the end; this is just consistently sad until the end, which isn’t a criticism. I just find it shocking that it became as big of a hit as it did.

Next is the album’s second and longest instrumental, “Out of the Blue”. This jazzy instrumental really shows off the great musicianship that this incarnation of the Elton John Band had. Lots of great interplay here between the guitars, drums, bass and Ray’s vibraphone. And, unlike “Your Starter For”, Elton is clearly playing piano on this track, as evidenced by the second half of the song which puts him more in the spotlight until that amazing pause where the vibraphone takes center stage. Really awesome song, definitely worth checking out.

We return to the sad tone with the next track, “Between Seventeen and Twenty”, which is a collaboration between Elton, Bernie, Davey and Caleb. This is also probably the most direct reference to Bernie’s marriage on the album. The title refers to the ages his wife and him were when they met and laments what went wrong in their marriage. This is one I used to not like mostly due to the repetitive sequencing it starts, but it has actually grown on me, mostly due to Elton’s voice, the backing vocals and James’s organ playing. Much like “Chameleon”, there’s just something about the higher register vocals here that are really unique and memorable. Bruce Johnston also directed the backing vocals here, so I have to wonder if he may have had some influence on Elton’s performance here as well.

That’s followed by “The Wide Eyed and the Laughing”, the only collaboration credited to Elton, Bernie, Caleb, Davey and James Newton Howard. There was one point where I considered this the worst song Elton had ever recorded. Looking back, I think there are a few that are worse, and this one does get points for ambition...but I still think it’s a terrible song. It’s a sitar-heavy song. Sitar-heavy songs are usually good at creating worldly effects and, to be fair, I feel like that’s what they were trying to go for here. But the sitar and Elton’s vocals just sound so out of tune with each other that it’s hard to listen to, and making it even worse are these awful synthesizer sounds from James which have the same, awkward flying saucer effect as in “First Episode at Hienton”. It almost sounds like they’re completely separate songs that were mashed up together in a bad way. The only tolerable parts are the few moments where it’s just the sitar playing.

Next up is “Someone’s Final Song”, a good song that, like “Between Seventeen and Twenty”, suffers from bad sequencing, being another sad ballad in a long line of sad ballads. This is a piano-focused song that once again has some of the most unique, high pitched vocals Elton has ever done...so it should come as no surprise that, once again, Bruce Johnston was involved. I especially love the backing vocal part that’s brought to center stage in the middle. It kind of has a later Beatles-like quality, giving me “Because” vibes specifically.

If you guys are wondering why “Where’s the Shoorah?” has so many views on streaming compared to most of the other tracks, here’s the reason: this song was sampled in the recent hit, “Cold Heart”. And to this day, I still have no idea what made them choose it because I actually really dislike this song. This song is BORING! It’s so slow, the chorus sings “Shoorah” in such an awkward way, I don’t like the depressing way the harmonium sounds on it...I just can’t find anything to like about it. I’m not even sure what a “Shoorah” is. I’ve tried looking it up and have found multiple answers. Apparently it has some sort of religious meaning. It still doesn’t make it a good song, but I will at least give Bernie credit for trying to tell something with such a deep meaning...it’s just not arranged well.

The monotonous sequencing finally ends with the next track, “If There’s a God in Heaven (What’s He Waiting a For?)”. Despite what the title may have you believing, this one’s actually fairly uptempo and contains much more instrumentation than the tracks immediately preceding it. It’s a welcome change of pace; the guitar has kind of a summer, beach vibe during the solo. My favorite part of it, though, is Buckmaster’s string orchestrations. I love the way they’re arranged. They’re performed in an epic way similar to “One Horse Town”, especially the sections after each chorus. They sound so cool and I also think it’s among Buckmaster’s best work with Elton, despite the fact that it’s actually quite light compared to most of his arrangements.

Next is “Idol”, another rare Elton-Bernie collaboration where the music came first. This is another jazz-influenced track, this time featuring Elton, Roger and Kenny as a trio with some support from the Brecker Brothers. It’s a type of song you would hear a lounge singer perform; I could totally imagine Frank Sinatra singing this song. This is another one that’s grown on me over the years.

“Theme From a Non-Existent TV Series” is the third and last instrumental on the album. The title is weird because it doesn’t sound anything like a TV theme; “Your Starter For” sounds more like a TV theme, and “Out of the Blue” actually was the closing theme for the British car show TOP GEAR for many years. It’s still a cool song, though. Very futuristic with its focus on synthesizers. It’s quick and fun, a nice way to lighten the mood.

And it all ends with “Bite Your Lip (Get Up and Dance!)”, an upbeat song that actually lacks a sad theme. I really like this song; unlike “Boogie Pilgrim”, this feels like a legitimate dance song with a hard rock edge to it. Some fans have criticized the second half where the choir keeps singing “Bite Your Lip” over and over again, but it actually works for me. I’ve been critical of songs in the past like “My Father’s Gun” and “All the Nasties” for doing stuff like this, but “Bite Your Lip” is a very dynamic song that keeps the energy moving at a good pace. The band is jamming out and having fun, and I find that I have fun listening to it. I love listening to Elton’s piano during the jam; it’s so full of life and makes for a nice contrast to all of the piano-focused slower songs that obviously couldn’t have that. Also, it builds up to an amazing ending where Roger just pounds away around the drum kit and leaves things with a bang. I love it; I think it’s a great closer.

BLUE MOVES marked the end of Elton’s reign at the top of the charts. Here in the U.S., it stalled at...gasp! Number 3! A great chart position, obviously, but not compared to the impossibly high standard Elton had set by this point. It’s not like I can’t entirely see why it stalled like this; it’s not really a commercial album and the sad theme can be kind of overwhelming, especially in the second half. Much like THE WHITE ALBUM, there are three tracks on here that I’d prefer to not hear again, but that doesn’t take away from the fact that there are still some really good tracks on here, both downbeat and upbeat. And you have to give him credit for doing something so brave and experimental at a point where that was very risky. So, yeah, it has problems, but the good stuff really is worth checking out and definitely among his classic tracks.

Alright, two more tracks to discuss from this period: the single-only “Don’t Go Breaking My Heart”/“Snow Queen”. The A-side...I don’t even have to really introduce it. Everybody knows this duet. The other singer, Kiki Dee, is someone who has popped up on occasion in the Elton story; she was one of the early acts signed to Elton’s label, Rocket Records, and appeared on some of his albums like GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD and ROCK OF THE WESTIES as a backing vocalist. She had one big hit by herself here in the U.S., “I’ve Got the Music in Me”, which is actually a really good song that I highly recommend checking out. “Don’t Go Breaking My Heart” is a homage to the classic Motown duet acts like Marvin Gaye and Tammi Terrell. Yeah, it’s silly, but I love it. It’s as catchy as you can get, and Kiki really did have a great voice too. The B-side, “Snow Queen”, also features Kiki and is more in line with the songs featured on BLUE MOVES. Elton experiments more with his lower range on this one, a hint at what was soon to come. Again, they sing well together on it and it certainly could have replaced one of the weaker BLUE MOVES tracks like “The Wide Eyed and Laughing”. It’s not a great song, though; it does feel like it overstays its welcome a bit near the end, but for what it is, it works fine.

And that concludes the classic 1970-1976 Elton John period. I’m up for continuing past this, as there are a lot of tracks I think are underrated and would enjoy sharing, so let me know if you guys are still up for it.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on May 15, 2022, 10:29:54 AM
If you think there’s enough quality music past this point and are willing to do so many albums, I’ll go along for the ride.  I know less of Elton’s music after this, yet I have a feeling I’m going to hear a few tracks and realise I’ve heard that song before.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on May 15, 2022, 07:20:54 PM
OK, BLUE MOVES.  Disappointingly, I say probably the worst Elton album since EMPTY SKY.  Disappointing because side one is so amazing that when I started listening to this, I thought I was hearing some underrated masterpiece.  When the album finished, I went back and listened to “Tonight” again just to make sure the song is as awesome a second listen and indeed it was.  This has got to be one of the best Elton songs ever.  The instrumental build up, the orchestration, Elton’s vocals - man was I moved.  Followed by “One Horse Town” which is easily the best rocker on the album.  Some driving eighth note bass throughout along with great guitar playing.  Love it.  “Chameleon,” while not as good as what proceeded, is indeed a good song and I can see it in mind for early 70’s style Beach Boys.  I can also see why it was rejected - 1976 was the year they became a nostalgia act.  But yeah, side one is brilliant.  Some 1976 Led Zeppelin syndrome in the sense the opening is far superior to the rest of the album.

After side one, “Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word” is another emotion packed ballad I love and to a lesser extent, “Someone Else’s Final Song” is also good.  I give “Bite Your Lip (Get Up and Dance)” credit for being a much needed uptempo song, but as the song progresses into its drawn out finale, it reminded me of disco.  A few other parts on the album had a slight disco feel, I wonder if that’s what’s meant by chasing trends.  But most of this?  Just very mid tempo, professionally played corporate rock that lacks any kind of personality.  Compare to GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD, where each song has its own distinct quirk or style or personality.  Here?  Just some stand out tracks thrown in with a lot of inoffensive music that fails to make an impression.

As an aside, I thought “Cage the Songbird” had a bit of a CSN feel to it.  Looked on Wikipedia and sure enough, Graham Nash does backing vocals!  There you go.

After a few more listens, who knows?  Maybe this will grow on me.  Maybe this is the kind of album you have to be a seasoned Elton listener to get.  What I do know is I love “Tonight,” “One Horse Town” and “Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word,” so at least I’ve gained a few new Elton favorites on my list.

Really curious to see where he goes from here.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on May 16, 2022, 02:49:35 PM
OK, BLUE MOVES.  Disappointingly, I say probably the worst Elton album since EMPTY SKY.  Disappointing because side one is so amazing that when I started listening to this, I thought I was hearing some underrated masterpiece.  When the album finished, I went back and listened to “Tonight” again just to make sure the song is as awesome a second listen and indeed it was.  This has got to be one of the best Elton songs ever.  The instrumental build up, the orchestration, Elton’s vocals - man was I moved.  Followed by “One Horse Town” which is easily the best rocker on the album.  Some driving eighth note bass throughout along with great guitar playing.  Love it.  “Chameleon,” while not as good as what proceeded, is indeed a good song and I can see it in mind for early 70’s style Beach Boys.  I can also see why it was rejected - 1976 was the year they became a nostalgia act.  But yeah, side one is brilliant.  Some 1976 Led Zeppelin syndrome in the sense the opening is far superior to the rest of the album.

After side one, “Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word” is another emotion packed ballad I love and to a lesser extent, “Someone Else’s Final Song” is also good.  I give “Bite Your Lip (Get Up and Dance)” credit for being a much needed uptempo song, but as the song progresses into its drawn out finale, it reminded me of disco.  A few other parts on the album had a slight disco feel, I wonder if that’s what’s meant by chasing trends.  But most of this?  Just very mid tempo, professionally played corporate rock that lacks any kind of personality.  Compare to GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD, where each song has its own distinct quirk or style or personality.  Here?  Just some stand out tracks thrown in with a lot of inoffensive music that fails to make an impression.

As an aside, I thought “Cage the Songbird” had a bit of a CSN feel to it.  Looked on Wikipedia and sure enough, Graham Nash does backing vocals!  There you go.

After a few more listens, who knows?  Maybe this will grow on me.  Maybe this is the kind of album you have to be a seasoned Elton listener to get.  What I do know is I love “Tonight,” “One Horse Town” and “Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word,” so at least I’ve gained a few new Elton favorites on my list.

Really curious to see where he goes from here.

Your opinion on this is quite similar to what mine was the very first time I heard this (although “Bite Your Lip” and “Shoulder Holster” always stuck out to me from the beginning). You’re right regarding side 1; even detractors of this album have been known to admit that side 1 is among the best album sides Elton has ever done. This is one that I think does take some time to get used to, although you’ll see no arguments from me regarding YELLOW BRICK ROAD being the superior double album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on May 23, 2022, 03:31:58 AM
I thought this was another very strong album, even past the first side, which seems to be getting most of the praise. Sure, it could have been a single LP, but I did like what I heard throughout.

"Your Starter For" and "Tonight" sounds like film scores, to me, and almost sound like they could be background music. "One Horse Town" is also a song I really liked, one of my favorites on the album. Good all the way through. I see you didn't like "Boogie Pilgrim", I liked the blues influenced song. "Crazy Water" was pretty good, too, I thought. "Shoulder Holster" sounds like a funk song from that time period. The fact that these songs all sound quite different from each other is another point towards Elton John, who had a lot of variety.

I was pleasantly surprised to hear Elton John perform jazz fusion! I loved "Out of the Blue" with the guitar and piano. Awesome, and I'm really glad I heard this album now for that song. It reminds me of when Stevie Wonder had a fusion track on Songs in the Key of Life. I also like "Idol" because of the jazz lounge influence. That's one of my favorite types of piano playing (which is why I was also a big fan of Black Sabbath's "Air Dance"). "Theme from A Non Existent TV Series" sounds more like video game music to me, like on a 16 bit console. Another instrumental song, another song I enjoyed. "Bite Your Lip (Get Up And Dance!)" is a fun song, like you'd hear at a party. Gives me an excited and good feeling.

The albums starting from around Tumbleweed Connection have all been very good, in my opinion. I'm certainly open to continuing.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on May 31, 2022, 03:53:00 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/9d/Elton_John_-_A_Single_Man.jpg)

Well, most fans agree 1970-1976 is the classic era for Elton John, but what about after that? Well, Elton was definitely no longer the same size star that he was during that period, but he still was capable of producing Top 40 hits (he had one Top 40 hit every year up through 1999) and, in my opinion, still produced a good amount of quality albums. There are a few brief lulls, but even most of the weaker albums have at least one or even a few good songs to check out.

We last left Elton in 1976 with his double album BLUE MOVES. As I mentioned in that thread, Elton was suffering from overwork and retired before a tour to support it could happen. And he kept his word for a while. Elton spent much of 1977 focused on his duties as Watford Football Club chairman, only doing an occasional live show. As for recordings, in this period they amounted to a mediocre charity single called “The Goaldiggers Song” and an incomplete album with Spinners/Stylistics producer Thom Bell (out of which came the incredibly underrated “Three Way Love Affair” and “Country Love Song”). By 1978, Elton found himself ready to record a full album again. Circumstances would be very different, though.

A SINGLE MAN is probably the most fitting name for an Elton John album, as it perfectly describes the circumstances of the album. It’s the first full album since EMPTY SKY where Gus Dudgeon wasn’t producing, even though they used his studio. Instead, Elton’s long time live sound engineer Clive Franks shared production duties with Elton. The only members of the Elton John Band to appear on this album are Ray Cooper and Davey Johnstone, and Davey only appears on one track. Probably the most notable change, though, was a new lyricist, Gary Osborne. As metaldams probably knows, Bernie (and for that matter, Davey and Dee Murray) was working with Alice Cooper on his 1978 album, FROM THE INSIDE, and so Elton took the opportunity to try a different approach to songwriting. Generally, the Elton-Bernie approach was that the lyrics would come first and Elton would write a melody around them, and while they did try a few approaches the other way (especially on BLUE MOVES), with Osborne, it would be the rule rather than the exception. Elton would come up with melodies and even some lyrics himself, and Osborne would finish them off and tighten them.

Much like BLUE MOVES, reception on A SINGLE MAN is pretty split, some considering it one of his most underrated albums, some among his weakest. I’m more in the latter category here, which isn’t to say it’s a bad album overall, but I don’t think it’s up to the standard of most Elton John albums. OK, let’s dive into the tracks.

The album fittingly opens with the very first John-Osborne collaboration, “Shine On Through”. And, to its credit, it actually is a very promising opener. Mostly a piano-focused ballad with a subtle Buckmaster arrangement and no guitars, it does capture that kind of lonely atmosphere that the title and cover hint at, which undoubtedly could also be seen as a negative. Still, in that sense, it actually does make it one of the more interesting tracks on the album.

The next track, “Return to Paradise”, is not. To their credit, they do try throwing a lot at it, with a Spanish-inspired arrangement, lots of marimba, trumpet and acoustic guitar. But man, that melody is just so bland that nothing can bring it to life. What’s especially ironic is that the ending actually does kind of work; the last lines with just Elton and then the band returning...for some reason, it actually does leave a larger impression than the rest of the song. But, yeah, overall, this one is not one I’m really a fan of.

“I Don’t Care” is a big improvement. More upbeat, this one has some elements of disco in it. I don’t mind disco; there certainly are bad disco tracks out there, but like any genre, it can work if arranged right. “Bite Your Lip” fell in this category, and I think this one falls in that category too, because it’s not full-blown disco so much as a combo of rock with disco. The lyrics are simple, but the instrumentation behind it is so strong that it’s able to overcome it, and it has one of the more memorable bass parts on this album.

“Big Dipper”...I really don’t like this one. Lyrically, it’s probably one of the most blatant and racy songs Elton ever wrote, so it was probably very controversial at the time. Honestly, I don’t really care about the lyrics here; I just flat out think the melody and the arrangement are bad. It has these really awful brass parts that, combined with the background singers make this sound like a drunk part song, not exactly my kind of thing. The irony is that I actually do kind of think the first part with the backing vocals works, but then they throw in those awful horns and just sour the experience so much.

“It Ain’t Gonna Be Easy”...WAY too long. It’s a shame, because the orchestral arrangement does kind of call to mind “If There’s a God in Heaven”, and I think at about 3 or even 4 minutes, this could have been a highlight. But the melody and theme are not strong enough to support the ridiculous runtime; it doesn’t have the emotional weight of “Tonight” or the fascinating imagery of “Madman Across the Water”. It’s just another, regular song that should have been the same length as the others.

“Part Time Love” was the hit here in the U.S., managing to reach number 21. The lyrics on this one are pretty weak and predictable...but much like “I Don’t Care”, the melody and the arrangement are so good that they overcome that and it actually is a pretty catchy number. The backing vocals are great, the guitars are great, and the production feels just right. I can see why this one was a minor hit. I enjoy it.

I also like the next track, “Georgia”, a ballad with Elton on harmonium. Unlike “Where’s the Shoorah”, there’s not an overly-dark atmosphere; it actually reminds me a bit of “Salvation”, something that’s downbeat but still full of life due to the choir (well, not technically a choir since it was the Rocket Records staff and Watford Football Club, but...still, they’re better than expected). Another highlight is the pedal steel guitar part, played by B.J. Cole, the same guy who played it on “Tiny Dancer”.

“Shooting Star” is OK; it’s a lot like “Idol” in that it kind of sounds like the type of song a lounge singer would sing, but “Idol” feels a bit more atmospheric and dark, which works in its favor. This one’s shorter and a bit too full for it to truly work. Not bad, but not super special in my eyes.

Next is “Madness”. I love the fast piano part that starts the song, and the band is tight and keeps the song moving at a good pace. And while the lyrics still aren’t fantastic, it does feel like they are trying to say something relevant, and, much like “Ticking”, it’s probably more relevant today than it was back then, to the point it can be uncomfortable. Still, unlike the other lyrical themes throughout, it does feel like it is telling something unique and that gives it an edge. Again, I do like “Ticking”, but just find it a bit hard to sit through. This is kind of the same way, though its more full production and lack of a focus on one specific person makes it a lot easier to just turn off the lyrical theme and enjoy the music.

“Reverie” is a short instrumental with Elton on piano and Buckmaster on synthesizer. Not much to say, as it’s quite short and not super memorable. Fine enough, but kind of filler.

The last track is also an instrumental, “Song for Guy”. “Guy” in this case was Guy Burchett, a messenger boy for Rocket Records who was killed in a motorcycle accident the day Elton wrote this song. Elton didn’t write it specifically for him, but upon learning of his death named it for him in tribute. It’s a very nice instrumental that has an otherworldly feeling; lots of synthesizer backing the piano, and Ray’s wind chimes also contribute to the atmosphere. This is a fairly well known song in the Elton catalogue everywhere except here in the U.S. It was released as a single here, but flopped. A shame, because it is a very nice song, my favorite song on the album.

So, yeah, a pretty big step down for Elton and unfortunately the next album is an even bigger step down. But Osborne’s lyrics do improve as time goes along and Elton will branch out a bit more, including some reunions with certain past collaborators. As it stands, I see A SINGLE MAN as a low point in Elton’s career, not the lowest, but still a low point. But, again, there are people who really like this album and you do have to admire the dedication that went into it. After all, not only did Elton co-produce, but he also plays almost every keyboard on it, including the synthesizers on “Song for Guy”! There definitely is ambition here, it just doesn’t play out the way I feel he intended it to.

Alright, let’s talk about a few singles/B-sides, as I think the album could have benefited from most of them. First up is the single-only combo, “Ego”/“Flinstone Boy”. The A-side was a lyric written during BLUE MOVES that Elton finally decided to record and intended as a comeback single. I think this song is amazing, better than anything on the album. The production is solid, with slightly more focus on synthesizers yet also still keeping Elton’s piano high in the mix. My favorite part is actually near the end when Elton briefly does some call-and-response style vocals; a nice change of pace in a song that’s all about changing the pace. A very underrated song that deserved a better reception than it got. The B-side, “Flinstone Boy”, is an Elton-only composition, and you can tell. Very repetitive lyrics, but Elton has a certain charisma in the way he sings it that it actually is kind of enjoyable, though not nearly as much as the A-side.

The “Part Time Love” B-side was another Taupin lyric, “I Cry at Night”, and this one definitely would have fit in on BLUE MOVES. It’s very dark and bare in arrangement. I don’t dislike it; the harmonies are nice, but it also covers the same lyrical ground as many BLUE MOVES songs and just doesn’t have the same staying power as something like “Tonight” or “Someone’s Final Song”.

And finally, we have the “Song For Guy” B-side, “Lovesick”, once again another Taupin lyric. Overall, it’s a pretty solid song. It’s upbeat, its got a catchy piano riff, and just the right balance between the orchestra and all the other instruments. Not over-produced in the slightest, this is something that very easily could have livened up the main album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on June 05, 2022, 12:30:55 PM
I actually might agree the non album single track, “Ego,” might be better than the rest of the album, though there are a few songs that come close.  “Ego” has some fantastic piano playing, a good atmosphere and is quite rocking - I dig it.

Album wise, I think the last four songs on the album, played together, work best.  “Madness,” like “Ego” is another fantastic rocker with some angry and impassioned Elton vocals.  “Shooting Star” is another real excellent track, Elton’s vocals remind me of David Bowie a little here and I really love the (what sounds like) upright bass in the background.  The closing, mostly instrumental “Song For Guy” is also an excellent piece…and you know what?  I like “It Ain’t Gonna Be Easy.”  Great guitar work throughout.

As for the rest, it’s varied.  I like the opening track, “Shine On Through” a lot - Elton alone with piano works for me.  The single “Part Time Lover” is quite catchy.  As for the rest, it’s just OK.  “Return to Paradise” sounds too loungy for me - though some of the instruments sound good in headphones.  As for “I Don’t Care” and “Georgia,”.whenever I hear the hi-hat going and the female backing vocals go in, you know it’s disco time.  Well, that, or the Peter Criss solo album, which also came out in 1978.  Very much of the time, very little of worth came from 1978 (checks birth certificate, runs away).  [pie]

As for the epic “Big Dipper,” a true lost opportunity.  They needed to get Robert Plant in the studio to edit in some random “squeeze my lemon” lines.  Yes, “Big Dipper,” if nothing else, is a standout, though for all the wrong reasons. 

If this is Elton’s weaker period, at least we’re getting some standout cuts still, so that’s a good sign. 

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on June 07, 2022, 01:32:15 AM
Definitely not as strong as the Elton John Band period, though there are some songs I like on here. It's interesting to see how the music industry has changed since the 1970s, two years was seen as a long gap between albums! In later decades that would be almost nothing.

"I Don't Care" is a good upbeat song, and to literally use to song's title, I don't care if it's disco. Still a fun song. "Big Dipper" was a strong I liked quite a bit, precisely because of the backing instruments. It reminds me of 1920s hot jazz, and the type of song I actually probably would think of playing at a party. I agree about "It Ain't Gonna Be Easy". It's a nice song, but probably didn't need to be that long. I think Elton John was going for an epic here.

:Shooting Star" sounds like AOR territory, with the soothing music and the saxophone. "Madness" might be my favorite song this album, probably the best piano playing on the album, and I like that there is a guitar solo. "Song for Guy": I usually like instrumental songs, this may not be my favorite so far of his, but I think it works fine as it is. It sounds sort of heavenly.

"Ego" is a song that deserved to be on A Single Man. I was thinking it sounded like it was from earlier, and sure enough the lyrics were written earlier during Blue Moves. I was a big fan of "Flintstone Boy". I didn't notice how repetitive it was, because that wasn't really too much of a detriment for me.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: hiramhorwitz on June 09, 2022, 10:10:40 AM
A Single Man is the album that convinced me that Elton’s glory days of consistently creating rich, memorable music and solid albums were a thing of the past.  Yes, it has a couple of decent tunes on it, but the depth of the music is a far cry from that of the period extending from the black album through Captain Fantastic, at least in my opinion.  Rock of the Westies demonstrated that Elton was still creative, trying new things and producing catchy music with a different edge, but ultimately missing the mark of his previous classic albums.  Nothing wrong with Here and There, but nothing overly special or new about it either.  Blues Moves showed some promise, with a couple of standout songs keeping me believing there was hope that Elton was regaining some of his lost ground.  But A Single Man put those hopes to rest, suggesting that all of Elton’s future albums would be a cut below those of the 1970-1975 studio albums.  And I believe that time has proven that to be the case.  Not to say that Elton hasn’t produced multiple winning songs over the intervening years – just that the consistency and frequency of the later songs pale in comparison to those of the 1970-1975 period.
 
Regarding the associated singles that were released as 45s at the time, Ego and Flintstone Boy do have something alluring about them.  But I still place them a notch below the majority of Elton’s 1970-1975 songs.

I remember the uneasy feeling in my stomach upon first listening to A Single Man.  I was a senior in college at the time, and immediately realized that one more of the reliable delights from my high school years had gone by the wayside. 
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on June 14, 2022, 06:18:21 PM
Aiming to get the next review out later this week, but right now my mind is firmly back in MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER territory thanks to the new 50th anniversary box set. Those first 6 tracks are still so fantastic and I’ve even gained more of an appreciation for “Goodbye” when viewing it as a coda instead of a definitive closer. Honestly, if they had included “Honey Roll” and “Can I Put You On” instead of “Rotten Peaches” and “All The Nasties”, this would probably be my favorite Elton John album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on June 14, 2022, 10:24:43 PM
Aiming to get the next review out later this week, but right now my mind is firmly back in MADMAN ACROSS THE WATER territory thanks to the new 50th anniversary box set. Those first 6 tracks are still so fantastic and I’ve even gained more of an appreciation for “Goodbye” when viewing it as a coda instead of a definitive closer. Honestly, if they had included “Honey Roll” and “Can I Put You On” instead of “Rotten Peaches” and “All The Nasties”, this would probably be my favorite Elton John album.

Looks like it’s a 3CD set.  Cool.  It seems like every demo and alternate version is getting a release while the iron is hot for everyone these days.  I have those first 5 Metallica album box sets, which would probably take close to a week to go through - no exaggeration. 
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on June 19, 2022, 12:40:03 AM
Alright, we move on to the next Elton John album, 21 AT 33. Fun fact, the name of this album is based off of the claim that it was Elton’s 21st album...

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a9/Album_Victim_of_Love.jpg)

(Sigh). OK, fine, I’ll talk about it. But, really, I don’t think it should actually count as an Elton John album, and I’ll explain why in a minute.

Yes, this is VICTIM OF LOVE, the album almost universally considered Elton’s worst. Released in 1979, this was Elton’s attempt to catch on to the disco craze. Yeah, he’d tried some attempts in the past, but to an extent, they all had some sort of disco-rock combination; here, we have flat out disco, and by no means good disco. The album was produced by Pete Bellotte, who was a successful disco producer, having produced some of Donna Summer’s records, and he apparently knew Elton at some point back in the Bluesology days. At face value, this doesn’t seem like it should be that bad; a guy who had success in this field and knew Elton should have made this seem promising. The problem is Elton himself wasn’t really involved in it.

I’ve seen multiple people argue that this shouldn’t really count as an Elton John album, and I agree with that viewpoint. Elton had nothing to do with the production, didn’t write any of the songs...he doesn’t even play piano on it. No other Elton John album is like this; the closest I can think of is THE THOM BELL SESSIONS, and outside of the fact that that isn’t a complete album, at least Elton contributed to the writing of a couple songs. Here, though...nothing. All he did was add some vocals, they slapped his name on it, and...boom! New Elton John record! Alright, let’s get this over with.

First up is “Johnny B. Goode”. A disco version of “Johnny B. Goode”. Yes, it sounds like a terrible idea and, yes, it’s just as terrible in execution. It’s way too slow, lasting over 8 minutes, and Elton wastes a good deal of that time just repeating “Go, Johnny Go!” over and over again in the same, monotonous way. Elton’s vocals are really off, I don’t like the saxophone solo...everything about this song is just a colossal failure! I’m not even that huge a fan of the original version (for me, the BACK TO THE FUTURE version is the definitive one), but they just screwed this one up so bad. I still find it so hard to believe that this exists; it does so many things wrong it just feels like it can’t possibly be real!

OK, so after that train wreck of an opener, we get the next track, “Warm Love in a Cold World”. I’m going to preface this by saying that I don’t think any other track on this album is as bad as that first one, but most of them are still bad, including this one. What’s especially odd about this one is the chorus at times is reminiscent of the BELL SESSIONS track, “Three Way Love Affair”. It’s strange because Elton wasn’t involved in the writing of either track, so I have no idea how they sound as similar as they do. That’s not a compliment to “Warm Love in a Cold World”. “Three Way Love Affair” is a fantastic track, but it also has very natural production. “Warm Love in a Cold World” is as technical as it gets, with very cold production, standard drumming...it just lacks any sort of emotion to it. Another bad song.

Next is “Born Bad”. And, wow, is this song boring! At least “Warm Love in a Cold World” reminds me of a song that I like. “Born Bad” is just bland and forgettable; a big issue with this album in general is that the songs tend to sound very similar and very rarely branch away from that.

The fourth track, “Thunder In the Night”, does branch away a little bit, and to its credit, I do actually like that synth riff near the beginning that recurs through the song. But it’s still not a good song. The lyrics are terrible and the instrumentation is very formulaic, as it is on the other tracks.

“Spotlight”...what can I say? It’s just as lifeless as the tracks that preceded it. Elton does sound a bit more engaged here vocally, but it’s still not enough to save this from being another forgettable, formulaic travesty.

Elton’s vocals on “Street Boogie” are actually better as well...but once again, it’s just another formulaic song with bland instrumentation and cold production. I know I’m kind of repeating myself here, but with an album like this, you can’t really say much more about it. It’s such a repetitive album.

It all ends with the title track, which is easily the best song on the album. It’s still not really a good song, but I don’t hate it, which is more than I can say for any of the other songs on the album. Strangely, this has the opposite problem of the two tracks that immediately preceded it. I think Elton’s vocal performance here is actually one of the weaker ones on the album, but the chorus is actually kind of catchy and it feels like they’re trying to capture a dark atmosphere as each chorus begins, not just follow every disco trend. I could actually see this being a disco hit...but, still, it doesn’t really take advantage of Elton John’s talents specifically and could very well have been given to any other artist with no effect on the finished product.

So, yeah, VICTIM OF LOVE is indeed a very bad album, the type of disco that I can understand people hating. Forgettable songs, very standard musicianship (no member of the Elton John Band appears on this record) and the overall repetition of the track styles pretty much defines this record, the exact opposite of what Elton John did so well. Bellotte clearly had skills as a producer; I can see this more technical style working for more mainstream artists of the time...just not Elton. Definitely his worst album if we count it as an Elton album...which, again, I really don’t.

Well, to ends things on a somewhat more positive note, let’s talk about the one B-side from this era, “Strangers”. I say positive because this was actually an outtake from the SINGLE MAN sessions, so unlike the album tracks, it actually is an Elton John song and, as such, it’s superior to anything on VICTIM OF LOVE. It’s still not a great song, but there is an undeniable charm to the chorus, and the production is quite natural and even feels a bit more smooth compared to some of the songs on A SINGLE MAN. A nice song, something I needed after listening to this disaster again. Luckily things do improve again from here and we’ll soon be getting into what I consider to be some of his more underrated albums.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on June 20, 2022, 12:34:46 AM
This sounds a lot like the disco/AOR type of music that was popular in the late 1970s/early 1980s. I actually can enjoy music like this in small doses, I don't exactly love it, and it doesn't come close to the previous Elton John albums. The main reason, as you pointed out in your review, is that all of the songs are basically in the same style. Previous releases had great variety, here it's basically all one in the same style. That makes the songs all blend together. I think if I heard all these songs in individual listens instead of together I might enjoy them more. "Johnny B. Goode" was the most memorable because I knew the original song and wanted to hear the cover, but yeah... no way that should have been over 8 minutes long.

If I could give praise to something on this album, it would be the bass. I really liked the slap technique being used throughout, and hearing the solos were the highlights of this album. The same could be said about disco in general.

Spotify had "Strangers" on the A Single Man release, it definitely is better than any of the songs on Victim of Love.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on June 20, 2022, 07:40:46 AM
      K-Tel presents Elton John.  My God, what a cynical album.  I read Elton literally did all his vocals in a one day, eight hour session.  When Rod Stewart, The Rolling Stones and KISS did their disco thing, at least they incorporated elements of themselves into it and made albums that had a bit of variety.  This?  Straight disco.  It is true that all the songs bleed together and that’s the point.  It’s all 126 beats per minute with the same repetitive beat.  This was meant to played for a bunch of coked up dancing hedonists at Studio 54.  That is the spirit of this album.  This is a you had to be there album.

      I will say the cover of “Johnny B. Goode” works as a novelty.  Partially because it’s the first song on the album and the repetitiveness had yet to have worn out it’s welcome.  Seriously, by “Street Boogie” I was getting a little stir crazy there.  Like it better than the Judas Priest version, if not the original.  I will also add the bass was done by a very young Marcus Miller.  He went on to play for Miles Davis and also has a solo career jazz bass players worship.  Back in the nineties, my bass instructor worshipped the guy.

      But yeah, overall, a cheap and lazy way for Elton to try to score a hit.  Hearing “Strangers,” a good Elton track after this was like a breath of fresh air and I’m looking forward to hearing 21 AT 33.*. Elton playing piano and writing songs - what he’s put in this Earth to do.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on June 22, 2022, 12:52:27 PM


Looks like Elton John and Tony Iommi shared a stage.  I watched this event in 1992 but not much of it since then.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on June 23, 2022, 10:48:02 PM
21 AT 33 review coming probably either tomorrow night or Saturday, but before then, here’s a little preview of what’s to come:

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on June 25, 2022, 10:53:23 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/dc/Album_21_at_33.jpg)

We now enter the ‘80s with this next album, 21 AT 33. As I hinted at in my previous review, the title of this album was meant to reflect that it was Elton John’s 21st album that he’d made, and it was released when he was 33 years old. Seems like a lot of albums we went through, right? Well...not exactly. In reality, 21 AT 33 is Elton’s 14th studio album (15 if you include ZIPPO). I’ve seen multiple different explanations for this unusual count over the years, which often include the live albums and FRIENDS, some compilations, and in certain scenarios, counting the two double albums as two albums each. But, hey, does the title really matter that much? Let’s discuss the album itself.

21 AT 33 finds Elton involved in the music again. As with A SINGLE MAN, he co-produced the album with Clive Franks and co-wrote some of the songs with Gary Osborne. The keyword being “some”, as this album features no less than 4 collaborators, including a certain Bernie Taupin. Yes, even though it’s not a full reunion, Bernie did contribute some of the lyrics to this album. Also bringing some nostalgic vibes are the return of Dee Murray and Nigel Olsson on a couple of songs. At the same time, though, Elton was trying to catch up with the times somewhat, especially after VICTIM OF LOVE, which was already dated by the time of its release.

It starts with “Chasing the Crown”, a collaboration with Bernie, fittingly enough. If the guitar tone on this sounds like Toto, well, that’s because Toto’s lead guitarist, Steve Lukather, plays on this as well as many other tracks on the album (he actually appeared on “Warm Love in a Cold World” from the previous album too, but my ears were hurting so much from that that it was much harder to notice). There’s a lot of energy in this track; I especially like the bass playing. It’s not a super catchy song, but it’s enjoyable enough.

Next up is “Little Jeannie”, a John-Osborne collaboration. People seem to forget how popular this song was, possibly because Elton has rarely performed it live outside of the 1980 tour and the ONE NIGHT ONLY shows in 2000. But this was actually Elton’s second highest charting (solo) single of the ‘80s here in the U.S., peaking at number 3, which was higher than the more remembered singles like “I’m Still Standing”. It’s a pretty unusual sounding song in the Elton catalog too; maybe it’s because of the saxophone, but this has always sounded to me like a song Billy Joel would sing. It’s really good; I like the use of Elton’s lower vocal range, the saxophone and electric piano combination is really cool, and I especially love that fadeout at the end with the backing singers. It’s so catchy, and having Dee Murray there gives it a real authenticity that makes it even more charming.

The third track is another (less successful) single, “Sartorial Eloquence”, also known as “Don’t You Wanna Play This Game No More?” here in the U.S. This is one I remember not being a fan of the first time I heard it; the chorus is just a constant repeat of the U.S. title phrase over and over again. That being said, I think it’s produced pretty well; there’s a dramatic build up in the verses that I like, and there’s a certain charisma Elton and the backing singers have that does actually make me enjoy it. It’s kind of hard to explain, but it’s kind of like in FLINSTONE BOY, where the repetition is made up for by the performance. I like this one a lot more now.

“Two Rooms at the End of the World” refers to Elton and Bernie’s unusual writing partnership, in that they don’t usually tend to write in the same room at the same time. Generally, Bernie hands Elton the lyrics and Elton goes off and sets them to music. A nice idea for a song...not a good result. I think this song’s really bland, which is strange because every time I listen to it, I feel like I should like it; it’s upbeat and it has a good lineup. But it doesn’t have any particularly good hooks in it, and at over 5 minutes, it overstays its welcome pretty quickly. Nothing really stands out in the instrumentation outside of little bits of Elton’s piano playing near the end, and even then it’s not that much in the forefront. Not a fan of this one.

Side 2’s opener is “White Lady White Powder”, which may be one of the strangest songs in the Elton catalog. It’s a song about drug addiction, which isn’t necessarily a new topic for Elton. But unlike “Feed Me” where it was clearly matched with a lonely and desperate atmosphere matching the lyrical theme, Elton instead matches it with this very cheerful melody. And it’s super catchy too; it has the Eagles on backing vocals and it’s just really fun to hear them singing back and forth with Elton, not to mention the classic rhythm section of Dee and Nigel is also backing here with a strong emphasis on Elton’s acoustic piano. People have criticized it for its lyrics, and I get it, but I actually really like this song. I guess it’s kind of a guilty pleasure for me; obviously I know it’s about a bad thing, but the way it’s produced, sang and played is just so fun to listen to.

The next track is “Dear God”, which I consider one of the weaker tracks on the album. In its defense, the backing vocal arrangement is really good...and, sure enough, it is again arranged by Bruce Johnston. Man, that guy really knows what he’s doing with vocal arrangements. Outside of that, though, it’s just kind of a bland, mid-tempo song that doesn’t really stick with me.

That’s followed by “Never Gonna Fall in Love Again”, a collaboration with Tom Robinson (who also co-wrote “Sartorial Eloquence”). I like this song; it has a very memorable chorus, and I like the focus on the electric piano and acoustic guitar, which captures the sad atmosphere of it. Not a lot else to say; it’s a good ballad.

“Take Me Back” is a country song, but it’s far removed from the days of TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION. No real imagery; just kind of a standard country arrangement with some fiddle thrown in. Very forgettable.

Thankfully, the album ends on a high note with “Give Me the Love”. This song was co-written with Judie Tzuke, a singer signed to Rocket Records. I really like it; it’s got a kind of soul/funk feel to it that’s just so nice to hear given Elton’s clear love for those genres in past tributes like “Philadelphia Freedom”. They also went all out on the production, including horns and strings. The vocals are great, the chorus is super catchy, and it moves at a good pace. Great closer.

So, yeah, still not a great album overall, but 21 AT 33 clearly shows Elton going in the right direction. Obviously it’s better than VICTIM OF LOVE, and I also think it’s better than A SINGLE MAN (I feel that the better tracks from this album, like LITTLE JEANNIE and WHITE LADY WHITE POWDER are superior to the better tracks on A SINGLE MAN). I still do consider it in the lower tier of Elton John albums, but that’s not to say it’s a bad album. There still are a lot of tracks I do like; if anything, it’s slightly more disappointing because of the fact that they included weaker tracks like “Two Rooms at the End of the World” or “Take Me Back” over other tracks that were recorded during this period.

21 AT 33 was actually meant to be a double album, and enough tracks were recorded for that purpose. For whatever reason, the final product didn’t end up that way, but the remaining tracks turned up either on the next album or as B-sides throughout the next few years. I’m going to cover them with the corresponding albums they appear as B-sides to, but even with that taken into account, I still have quite a few more tracks to cover, so I’ll try to be quick.

First up is the “Little Jeannie” B-side, “Conquer the Sun”, which was actually a SINGLE MAN holdover. And, yeah, A SINGLE MAN could have definitely benefited from its inclusion. Very beautiful ballad with fantastic vocals from Elton and a very fitting, weeping guitar solo. A real hidden gem in the Elton catalog; if there’s one B-side from this year to check out, it’s this one.

“Sartorial Eloquence” had two B-sides. The first was “Cartier”, which is kind of just this short, almost commercial type song; Elton actually wrote most of the lyrics to it. The second was “White Man Danger”, which is kind of similar to “Two Rooms at the End of the World”, but with much better instrumentation. The guitar stands out more and there’s a cool organ part in the middle. Not crazy about the lyrics, though, which are pretty bad, and I can see why it was left off of the album.

Then there’s the “Dear God” single, which actually came with three B-sides! First is “Tactics”, a synth-driven instrumental. Not much to say other than that I like it; the synths are cool and it has a pretty memorable theme. “Steal Away Child” is a very pleasant, electric piano-centric ballad. I think this should have been included on the album in place of “Dear God”, as it has a really nice simplicity to it that the album could have benefited from. “Love So Cold” is probably most interesting for the fact that it starts with Elton doing a Ricky Ricardo impression! I actually like this one too; some great guitar work and I really like the backing vocals on it as well.

And, finally, we have what might be one of the most fascinating collaborations Elton has ever done, “Les Aveux”/“Donner Pour Donner”, a single-only release he recorded with singer France Gall...in French. The A-side is a French adaptation of an unreleased John-Robinson collaboration, “Reach Out to Me”. It’s a nice ballad; Gall had a very good voice and they really put a lot into the production on it, even including a string section. The B-side is a rarity in that Elton sings some Bernie lyrics for a song he didn’t write the music to. I think people tend to prefer it to the A-side, which is understandable as it feels like it has its own completely unique identity, whereas the A-side does kind of feel like it’s aiming to get radio play. Regardless, I still like both songs.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on June 26, 2022, 12:45:53 AM
If you include Friends, all the studio albums - counting the two doubles as two albums, the two live albums and the two greatest hits albums - you get 21 albums.

I’ve heard interviews with KISS and Alice Cooper in the early eighties refer to how many albums they have, and they use the same formula.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on June 28, 2022, 11:18:12 PM
      21 AT 33 (I’m working on my album 0 AT 43, be patient), is the best Elton album since ROCK OF THE WESTIES.  Much, much, much better than VICTIM OF LOVE!  Actually, I would say side one is especially good and really has a great mix of rockers and ballads.  The opening track, “Chasing the Crown” is my favorite on the album and probably one of my favorite Elton songs going by first listen.  A killer track, with a great vocal, bass and guitars throughout.  Absolutely love it.  After that comes the two hit ballads which are both fine songs.  I dig the less commercially successful “Sartorial Eloquence” a tad more but both enjoyable.  “Two Rooms at the End of the World” is another great rocker to end side one.  Sequencing and mood is so important and I think Elton did a fine job on this first side.

      Side two starts out with another rocker in ‘White Lady White Powder.”  Looks like all the rockers are co-written with Bernie and this one has some drug laced subject matter.  Play this with “Snowblind.”  The gospel tinged “Dear God” and “Never Gonna Fall in Love Again” are beautiful tunes but after that, I think another rocker would have sufficed instead of the country tinged ‘Take Me Back,” easily the weakest on the album.  “Give Me the Love” is a fairly solid closer.

     A good album overall.  I really like the mix and production and again, really loved “Chasing the Crown.”  If I’d make an Elton playlist, that would be included.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 01, 2022, 10:39:24 PM
      21 AT 33 (I’m working on my album 0 AT 43, be patient), is the best Elton album since ROCK OF THE WESTIES.

“Zero The Hero” better be on this. [pie]

Glad you liked this, and interesting choice with “Chasing the Crown”. It does feel like a lot was put into it and it makes for a good opener as a result.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 01, 2022, 10:44:30 PM
A preview of what’s to come with the next album, THE FOX. This album actually had a corresponding VHS/laserdisc called VISIONS. It was Elton’s one attempt at a video album, released about a year after the album it was associated with. I especially love this first video I’m linking to and overall, it’s a pretty interesting collection of videos if you get a chance to check it out.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on July 01, 2022, 11:28:47 PM
A return to form after Victim of Love. That albums seemed like such an outlier, and now we are back to to good Elton John music.

"Chasing the Crown" is already much better than anything that appeared on Victim of Love. Toto is a band I like the hits of but haven't explored much more of. Really good opening track, and I'm glad you mentioned who was on guitar because I liked it in the song. "Little Jeanie" actually reminds of his earlier song "Daniel", aside from the saxophone. It's a nice change of pace after the first track. I also liked the backing vocal group. I wasn't as big of a fan of "Sartorial Eloquence". I agree with metaldams on "Two Room at the End of the World". It was a pretty solid rocker, I especially like the instrumental sections with the piano solos.

I like the music in "White Lady White Powder" but can understand the criticism towards the lyrics. I don' think I've heard the term white lady used to refer to cocaine before. "Dear God" sounds like a cheesy gospel song. On my first listen it sounds like it's supposed to be straight. "Never Gonna Fall in Love with You Again" is a better ballad.  I loved the saxophone solo, gives me some AOR vibes and I mean that in a good way. "Take Me Back" is also my least favorite track on the album. I liked the more upbeat "Give Me the Love" that ended the album. I like that Elton John can go from rocking tunes to ballads to this.

I wouldn't say it's up to the standards of his mid 1970s albums, but it was definitely better than Victim of Love.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on July 02, 2022, 06:50:12 PM
The singles have a more low key feeling to them than the album singles. I liked “Conquer the Sun”. Im surprised it took this long to get a release if it was recorded for the A Single Man sessions. “Cartier” is a beautiful piece. “White Man Danger” I think could have been included on the album. I think it’s funny that there was a song with white man and also a song with white lady in the title.

“Tactics” being instrumental and synth based sounds like a perfect song to go along with a video montage or slideshow. “Love Do Cold” is my favorite of these bunch of tracks, there’s a section with the guitar that reminds me of “Here Comes the Sun” by The Beatles.

It was nice to hear Elton song in French. I admittedly don’t understand the lyrics, but the vocals meshed well together, especially in “Donner Pour Donner”.

There were enough tracks here for a whole separate release, if they wanted to they could have released another album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 03, 2022, 10:44:17 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/af/The_fox_%28Elton_John_album%29_coverart.jpg)

After HERE AND THERE completed his DJM contract in 1976, all of Elton’s albums and singles were released on his own record label, Rocket...in the U.K. Elton’s label history in the United States was a different story. Initially signed to MCA’s subsidiary, Uni Records, his records became so successful that they were released through the parent company. Although a successful collaboration for the most part, Elton became dissatisfied with them after the “Song for Guy” single flopped in the U.S., and after 21 AT 33 was released, he moved over to the newly established Geffen Records, the same company that had signed John Lennon just before his death. Elton still had enough leftover tracks from the 21 AT 33 sessions for a full album, and some did end up on the new album, but David Geffen wanted some new songs, so Elton returned to the studio, this time with a new producer.

Chris Thomas may be a familiar name, as he has worked with a large number of acts over the years including Pink Floyd and the Beatles. This wasn’t the first time he and Elton worked together; they were apparently both students at the Royal Academy of Music around the same time, and Elton had previously been a member of a Thomas-produced band in the late 1960s called the Bread and Beer Band. Thomas is often criticized by Elton fans for his production work being overly technical, and I think that reputation is very much undeserved...for the most part. Towards the end of their collaboration, I can see some of their complaints, but in my opinion, he did a lot of good work for Elton in the 1980s, steering him in a much clearer direction. THE FOX was the start of this, and...it’s a great album.

It starts with a John-Osborne collaboration, the fantastic “Breaking Down Barriers”. I’m going to be bold with this next statement: not only is this my favorite Elton song of the ‘80s, but it’s one of my favorite Elton favorite songs period, which gives Thomas a point in my book. I love everything about this song. Based around a melody he created on the spot during a TV interview in 1980, Elton added this really fast, ascending piano part that recurs throughout the song, and it sounds so amazing, some of the most impressive piano playing I’ve heard from Elton. The song revolves around the piano specifically, so it actually feels just like something out of the ‘70s, supported by the fact that Elton sings in falsetto for a little bit, something that had been lacking for quite some time. I also like how the guitar is kind of low in the mix for the majority of it. That’s not meant to be a criticism of the guitar playing; on the contrary, I think Richie Zito does a great job. The reason I like that the mix underplays it is because it makes the few moments where the guitar is high in the mix, like the solo in the middle or near the end, actually sound a lot cooler as a result. It’s a very atmospheric effect that’s even cooler in the video I linked to, where the guitar solo plays along to the barriers starting to be torn down. The rhythm section is fantastic; Dee and Nigel are back once again, and Dee does this really cool descending bass part near the end that contrasts with Elton’s ascending piano part quite nicely. Wonderful opening.

The second track is a 21 AT 33 holdover, “Heart in the Right Place”, which you can tell based off of the guitar tones, which scream Lukather. I also really like this track; it’s a blues-inspired song, but updated to sound like an ‘80s song. There’s a stronger emphasis on keyboards as it goes along, to the point where there are these synthetic vocal effects building up as Elton keeps singing “Heart’s in the right place!” I could see people make the argument that this is a bit too technical and out of Elton’s comfort zone, but I actually enjoy it. Elton’s always been about taking risks, and he does sound really invested in it. It’s also helped, of course, by that fantastic Lukather guitar work throughout and some really awesome drumming.

Next is “Just Like Belgium”, the first John-Taupin collaboration on the album. Once again, it’s another good song. Obviously European-inspired in both lyrics and musical style, this song manages to succeed at capturing a fun party style in the way that “Big Dipper” attempted but failed to do. The saxophone actually sounds good, there’s another strong emphasis on Elton’s piano, and Elton gives a really strong vocal performance, making great use out of his lower vocal range. This is one of those songs that really sounds like it was specifically tailored for that, his voice sounds so clear and smooth on it.

“Nobody Wins” is also a very European-inspired track...in fact, it was originally written by a French artist named Jean-Paul Dreau as a song called “J’Veux d’la Tendresse”, which Elton heard on the radio and was so moved by, he asked Osborne to translate it to English for him to record. Rather than do a literal translation, Osborne decided to apply Elton’s troubled family life as a child to the lyrics, thus making it one of the most personal songs Elton has sung as well as some of Osborne’s best lyrics. This is a very technically-produced track, with lots of keyboard programming, but much like “Heart in the Right Place”, I’m willing to defend it for the atmosphere it creates. It makes it sound like he is in this very lonely, distant place far removed from the rest of the world, which makes sense because the lyrics refer to a broken situation he’s trying to get out of. Don’t get me wrong, there are definitely cases where this style of production/programming doesn’t work, as we’ll see eventually, but I think in this context it actually makes sense and is used in a way that it properly supports the lyrical theme. Also worth noting that Elton recorded the original French version as well, using the same backing track.

The next John-Taupin track is “Fascist Faces”, my least favorite track on the album, though, much like my least favorite tracks on his best albums, I don’t necessarily dislike it. I just don’t think the melody is really that interesting or memorable, but the guitar work on it is still pretty cool and at least it gives us another rock track right before we go to major ballad territory with the side 2 opener.

Opening side 2 is the epic ballad combination, “Carla/Etude-Fanfare-Chloe”, separate tracks that were recorded during the 21 AT 33 sessions. The first part, “Carla/Etude”, brings us back to “Tonight” territory, with Elton being supported by the London Symphony Orchestra. Named after Clive Franks’s wife, Carla, it’s obviously a classically influenced piece from the very beginning, and James Newton Howard matches that appropriately; he makes great use of the flute especially throughout this track, and once again, much like “Tonight”, they feel like they’re properly playing off of what Elton is doing on his piano, rather than just completely overtaking the music. “Fanfare” is a synthesizer-driven instrumental piece meant to act as a bridge between “Carla/Etude” and “Chloe”. It’s kind of cool, and I like how it actually incorporates aspects of the melody to “Chloe” in it. As for “Chloe” itself...a really fantastic ballad; I love the chorus to this track, it makes great use of the orchestrations, the guitar solo is fantastic. Overall, it’s a very well-produced track with some really emotional vocals from Elton and the backing singers, which of course begs the question of why did it and “Carla/Etude” get cut from 21 AT 33 in the first place but, hey, it least it ended up finding its way on to an album eventually.

After that emotional powerhouse, it was very smart of them to sequence the upbeat “Heels of the Wind” as the next track. And, once again, it’s another really good song. The vocals are fantastic, it’s got a great hook, the guitar solo is really fun...all the right ingredients for a great, upbeat song. Not a lot else to say; it’s another underrated, really fun track in the same way as “Just Like Belgium”.

Next is “Elton’s Song”, the last 21 AT 33 holdover and also the last John-Tom Robinson collaboration to appear on an Elton album. And, wow, what a way to go out. Lyrically, it’s the tale of a gay boy with an unrequited crush on his straight friend, and Elton keeps the arrangement simple, mostly piano-based with some synthesizer thrown in to replicate an orchestra. It’s the kind of tune that can really put you in a sad mood, but that’s what it’s supposed to do. Another really good, underrated song.

The closing track is the title track, a rare Bernie-written song that was actually written at the request of Elton, Elton having already decided on the title of the album before the track was written. It’s a nice, low-tempo closer to offset the deep sadness of the track that preceded it (following that with an uptempo song definitely would not have worked). There’s some nice harmonica work on it and Elton gives another good vocal performance. A good song to end the album with.

Commercially, THE FOX is one of Elton’s least successful albums. None of the singles were really hits (somehow, “Chloe” only managed to get to number 34) and it apparently hasn’t even been ranked Gold by the RIAA, one of the few Elton albums from the ‘70s/‘80s to not achieve at least that. It’s a shame because I really like this album. I’ve mentioned before that I consider the three albums immediately preceding this to be in the lower tier of Elton albums, but this is far from it. In fact, there are a few albums that I actually put among the ranks of the classic era albums, and this is one of them. The songwriting is great and the production is varied and experimental. This is actually the album I was initially expecting BLUE MOVES to be the first time I heard it. Wonderful album, one I highly recommend.

Alright, just a few B-sides this time. First is the “Nobody Wins” B-side, “Fools In Fashion”. I really like this song too; it has a nice electric piano focus, it’s catchy and the vocals are great once again. I can kind of see why it was cut as the addition of harmonica throughout probably made it seem too similar to the title track, but it’s still a really good song regardless.

The “Just Like Belgium” B-side was “Can’t Get Over Getting Over Losing You”, not to be confused with “I Can’t Go On Living Without You”, a late 1960s Elton track. “Can’t Get Over Getting Over Losing You” is a track cut from 21 AT 33, and, yes, I’m aware the title is ridiculously repetitive. But it actually is kind of a fun song; I really like the bridge, the musicianship is solid, and the vocals are really good. It’s a country song and I think it definitely should have replaced “Take Me Back” on the previous album.

Finally, we have the B-side to “Chloe”, another 21 AT 33 era track called “Tortured”. It’s fine, the chorus is decent, but it doesn’t really stand out much in my opinion.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 03, 2022, 10:48:24 AM
The singles have a more low key feeling to them than the album singles. I liked “Conquer the Sun”. Im surprised it took this long to get a release if it was recorded for the A Single Man sessions. “Cartier” is a beautiful piece. “White Man Danger” I think could have been included on the album. I think it’s funny that there was a song with white man and also a song with white lady in the title.

“Tactics” being instrumental and synth based sounds like a perfect song to go along with a video montage or slideshow. “Love Do Cold” is my favorite of these bunch of tracks, there’s a section with the guitar that reminds me of “Here Comes the Sun” by The Beatles.

It was nice to hear Elton song in French. I admittedly don’t understand the lyrics, but the vocals meshed well together, especially in “Donner Pour Donner”.

There were enough tracks here for a whole separate release, if they wanted to they could have released another album.

Believe it or not, this is actually not the last SINGLE MAN track to be released. Elton got a lot out of mileage out of both the 21 AT 33 and SINGLE MAN sessions when it came to B-sides in the ‘80s. The “Love So Cold”/“Here comes the Sun” connection is an interesting observation. I never thought of that before, but you’re right, the guitar part is similar at times.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on July 09, 2022, 08:50:00 PM
This album was fantastic and matches up to his 1970s peak. Not a single bad track in my opinion, I enjoyed this all. We have songs that feel more like the 1970s, and some that are more 1980s feeling.

"Breaking Down Barriers" gets the album starting off perfectly. You explained how great the song is, I don't know if I could defend it any better. "Heart in the Right Place" is a solid 1980s style track. I'm surprised it was a holdover, it sounds like it in with the music around the time this album came out. "Just Like Belgium" and "Nobody Wins" are my least favorite tracks on the album, but they are not bad songs. The lyrics in "Just Like Belgium" were kind of cheesy, though. I was a actually a big fan of "Fascist Faces", it was catchy, and had an excellent piano solo.

But, my favorite track overall on the album was "Carla/Etude - Fanfare". It starts off with a symphonic atmosphere, that would work well for a background score of a movie. Very beautiful piano playing. The next section was more synthesizer based, and reminded me more of what a band like The Alan Parsons Project would do. Then we have the Chloe section, that is a pretty good lounge rock song. "Heels of the Wind" is another good, upbeat song to follow it. I like the backing vocals that accompany Elton on the track. "Elton's Song" and "The Fox" are two more serious songs to end the album. A way to showcase Elton's vocals and piano playing.

An actually really good album, it seems to have been overlooked by the public. I also liked the B sides that came out during this time. "Fools in Fashion" is a good AOR song that has a smoother feeling. "Can't Get Over Getting Over Losing You" is better country track than Take Me Back. "Tortured" starts off mellow enough, then the guitars kick in. There were a lot of tracks recorded during those 21 at 33 sessions.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on July 09, 2022, 09:13:03 PM
My God, I completely missed Sam’s review on this one.  [pie]  Going to have to listen soon.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 09, 2022, 11:16:09 PM
My God, I completely missed Sam’s review on this one.  [pie]  Going to have to listen soon.

Yeah, I kind of suspected that might happen when I realized it was the last post of the previous page. I was planning on bumping the thread in a few days if it didn’t get a response.

This album was fantastic and matches up to his 1970s peak. Not a single bad track in my opinion, I enjoyed this all. We have songs that feel more like the 1970s, and some that are more 1980s feeling.

"Breaking Down Barriers" gets the album starting off perfectly. You explained how great the song is, I don't know if I could defend it any better. "Heart in the Right Place" is a solid 1980s style track. I'm surprised it was a holdover, it sounds like it in with the music around the time this album came out. "Just Like Belgium" and "Nobody Wins" are my least favorite tracks on the album, but they are not bad songs. The lyrics in "Just Like Belgium" were kind of cheesy, though. I was a actually a big fan of "Fascist Faces", it was catchy, and had an excellent piano solo.

But, my favorite track overall on the album was "Carla/Etude - Fanfare". It starts off with a symphonic atmosphere, that would work well for a background score of a movie. Very beautiful piano playing. The next section was more synthesizer based, and reminded me more of what a band like The Alan Parsons Project would do. Then we have the Chloe section, that is a pretty good lounge rock song. "Heels of the Wind" is another good, upbeat song to follow it. I like the backing vocals that accompany Elton on the track. "Elton's Song" and "The Fox" are two more serious songs to end the album. A way to showcase Elton's vocals and piano playing.

An actually really good album, it seems to have been overlooked by the public. I also liked the B sides that came out during this time. "Fools in Fashion" is a good AOR song that has a smoother feeling. "Can't Get Over Getting Over Losing You" is better country track than Take Me Back. "Tortured" starts off mellow enough, then the guitars kick in. There were a lot of tracks recorded during those 21 at 33 sessions.

Glad you liked this one HomokHarcos; it really is a very overlooked album. I agree, the backing vocals on “Heels of the Wind” are really good, and “Carla/Etude” definitely feels like something out of a big movie score (Newton Howard was finding his calling.  [pie])
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on July 10, 2022, 12:39:20 PM
I didn’t listen to THE FOX as pure music yet and will comment on some of the songs once I do in the next few days, but I did watch the VISIONS video on YouTube.  You can find it on a playlist.  This is overall good music and the early 80’s Elton is much stronger than I was expecting.

The video itself is that old school, real early MTV vibe and I liked it a lot.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on July 13, 2022, 05:49:23 AM
Now I listened to THE FOX without the videos and this probably is one of Elton’s stronger albums, which again I was not expecting at this point in his career.  Production wise I think the combination of the bass, piano and synths lends a real beefy sound and I think the songs are really strong overall.

Yes, I agree “Breaking Down Barriers” is another very strong album opener and that piano lick was certainly highlighted in the video.  Very catchy chorus, upbeat and a driving, beefy rhythm section (and I just read Dee Murray plays on a lot of these tracks, cool).  Shocked “Heart in the Right Place” was a leftover from the last album as it is another very strong track.  Great one two punch to open the album.

“Elton’s Song” may as well be Elton’s coming out song (especially if you watch the video) and for 1981, most pop stars didn’t do that - (example, George Michael had a big controversy 25 years later).  Today it would be easier to do, but a brave statement for the time and musically excellent.

“Carla/Etude-Fanfare-Chloe” is structured a bit like “Love Lies Bleeding/Funeral for a Friend” with the big progressive rock intro followed by the pop song.  Not saying it’s as good as the earlier effort, which is almost impossible to do, but a strong effort nonetheless.

The closing title track is another standout and really, I enjoyed every song on here.  I’m pleasantly surprised with this early 80’s run so far and though I know it’s two albums away, TOO LOW FOR ZERO is supposed to be a comeback.  Comeback from what I don’t know because these past couple of efforts are damn strong.  Looking forward to what’s directly ahead.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 13, 2022, 03:09:10 PM
Really glad you both enjoyed this, since I like this album so much and think it deserves way more attention. Metaldams, you’re correct, most people call TOO LOW FOR ZERO the comeback, but in my eyes it truly started here.

Also, I just realized today is Wednesday, July 13th. You know what that means:

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on July 13, 2022, 06:03:34 PM
Really glad you both enjoyed this, since I like this album so much and think it deserves way more attention. Metaldams, you’re correct, most people call TOO LOW FOR ZERO the comeback, but in my eyes it truly started here.

Also, I just realized today is Wednesday, July 13th. You know what that means:

Still my favorite Elton john song so far.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on July 25, 2022, 12:28:52 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/33/Blue_Eyes_-_Elton_John_alt._cover.jpg)

We move on to JUMP UP! Of all of Elton’s albums, JUMP UP! is probably the one I see the most split opinions on, some considering it among his best of the ‘80s and some considering it one of his worst. Even Bernie Taupin himself has apparently stated he considers it one of their worst albums, which is an odd statement to say considering that, much like the previous two albums, he only contributes lyrics to a select number of songs on the album instead of the whole thing. It also has a song that many fans consider Elton’s worst, but we’re getting ahead of ourselves. What’s the story of this one?

Well, much like the previous album, production duties were handled by Chris Thomas. It’s also the first album since 1976’s BLUE MOVES to feature a consistent band lineup throughout the entire album. Dee Murray is on bass guitar and backing vocals. That makes sense, as does Richie Zito on guitar and James Newton Howard on keyboards, having been part of the 1980 tour band. The only new addition is Jeff Porcaro on drums. Porcaro was a member of Toto and worked with multiple big acts as a session musician, including Steely Dan (yes, I’ve been reading ahead for that). It’s kind of like an interesting “What if?” Elton John Band lineup, one that never toured for reasons that we’ll get more into with the next album review.

Much like the previous album, this one opens with a John-Osborne track, “Dear John”. Though not nearly as compelling musically as “Breaking Down Barriers”, it nevertheless still manages to be a fun, upbeat opener, spotlighting some great harmonies from Elton and capturing the atmosphere that the cover and title promise.

The next track is the John-Taupin song, “Spiteful Child”. This one has an insanely catchy chorus, and I also really like the outro, especially when the guitars diverge into a different key before returning to the main key. Much like the first track, not an amazing song by any means, but still enjoyable.

The same applies to the third track, “Ball and Chain”. Once again, another fairly catchy chorus, though not nearly as much as “Spiteful Child”, and it is also nicely sequenced in that it doesn’t spotlight synthesizers as much as the previous two tracks, instead focusing more on a guest appearance by Pete Townshend on acoustic guitar. It’s another enjoyable track, but much like the previous two, it just doesn’t have the same impact as the tracks on THE FOX did. The tracks there felt like they had a lot of passion and heart put into them. These first tracks sound a bit more commercial, which I don’t mean in a bad way, especially since they are still catchy, but they do sound a bit more like products of their times as a result.

“Legal Boys” introduces us to an important future Elton collaborator, Tim Rice. Over a decade before their massive hit with THE LION KING soundtrack, Rice sent Elton the lyrics for this song. At this time, of course, Rice was more known for his Broadway work with Andrew Lloyd Webber, and unsurprisingly, this track does kind of have a Broadway feel to it. It’s really cool; as was par for the course by this time, Newton Howard provides the string arrangement, and it totally fits, as well as his natural use of synthesizers for dramatic effect. Porcaro also contributes to that grand quality; he does a really good job building up his drumming in the verses, which really does sound like the type of effect you’d hear in a Broadway orchestra.

Next is the John-Taupin track, “I Am Your Robot”, a song that many Elton fans consider his worst, or at the very least one of his worst songs. My take? It’s not a good song, but I do think that’s a bit harsh. Yes, the lyrics suck, and I do hate the way he sings “man” during the choruses; something about it is kind of annoying. But it still feels like there is something there in terms of a melody; I get the feeling listening to it that Elton really did have fun writing it and just wanted to share something he enjoyed with his fans. Dee’s bass playing is pretty good too. Musically, it does rely on synthesizers a bit too much, but to be fair, with a song with this title and theme, you’d expect that. So, yeah, I don’t really like it, but I can’t bring myself to necessarily hate it, as I feel there really was an effort to try to make it enjoyable.

“Blue Eyes” is one of the singles from the album, as well as one of the most known John-Osborne collaborations. It’s a very Sinatra-esque track; even Elton’s vocal has shades of Sinatra in it, with much more emphasis on his lower register than the other tracks on this album. It’s arranged very well too; great use of Fender Rhodes to capture that calm atmosphere, as well as a light string arrangement. Very good track.

Then we have another single, “Empty Garden (Hey Hey Johnny)”. This is a tribute to Elton and Bernie’s late friend, John Lennon, and uses the very clever analogy of Lennon being a gardener. It feels like a very genuine tribute, and not just due to the fact that the authors were friends with Lennon. Even from a musical/lyrical standpoint, it feels very authentic. The synthesizers sound a lot like a harpsichord, which calls to mind “In My Life”, and even the “can’t you come out to play?” lyric is just like the lyric in “Dear Prudence”. And, of course, it also helps that the musicians are all great; the drumming is powerful, the bass playing is great, and Elton’s vocal performance is incredibly emotional. You can feel the pain in his voice, it really works. This is my favorite song on the album.

Next is “Princess”. This one’s grown on me, as I used to consider it filler, but the more I listen to it, the more I like it. It actually reminds me quite a bit of the track, “Lonnie and Josie”, a YELLOW BRICK ROAD era track that Elton gave to Kiki Dee. The synthesizers near the end do feel a little excessive for a ballad of this type, but otherwise, the production on it is quite good, with the backing vocals being a highlight.

The next track is “Where Have All The Good Times Gone?” I really like this song; it’s kind of a throwback to the Motown songs of the ’60s, as evidenced by the mentioning of the Four Tops in the chorus. The string arrangement gives it some authenticity as well. Not a lot else to say; I just think it’s really catchy, and there’s great musicianship all around on it.

The album closes with “All Quiet on the Western Front”. When Bernie made his comments on JUMP UP!, I have to wonder if he remembered that this track was on here. In his comments, he mentioned “Empty Garden” as a standout, but dismissed the rest of it, which I think is unfair to the album in general, but it’s especially puzzling with this one. It’s a great track; as you can guess, the lyrics are inspired by the book of the same name and the music has kind of a Christmas feel to it. Very atmospheric, but what I especially love is the coda at the end. I can’t explain it, I just really love the musicianship on it; it has a very grand feeling to it, the right choice for a closer.

So that’s JUMP UP! It’s not quite as good as the album that immediately preceded it or the one that immediately followed it. Even though I liked most of the tracks, the first three are a bit more formulaic, and while “Legal Boys” has a unique style I like, the next album also has a song with that style that I prefer. But, to its credit, it is still a good album overall and the second half in particular is consistently strong, with two deserving hit singles and some underrated gems in the last two tracks. There are some instances where I think the synthesizers are a bit overdone and don’t fit, the first Elton album that I think truly has this problem, but even then, there still are a lot of tracks where it does work like “Empty Garden” and “All Quiet on the Western Front”. Another good album during what I consider Elton’s first comeback period.

Just a couple B-sides this time. First is the “Blue Eyes” B-side, “Hey Papa Legba”, which is (shocker) another 21 AT 33 holdover. It does go on a bit long, but I like it; the horns are catchy and Elton’s piano playing on it is cool too.

And then we have the “Empty Garden” B-side, “Take Me Down to the Ocean”, yet again a 21 AT 33 holdover. I also really like this one; kind of Beach Boys influenced in a way, and the backing vocals especially near the end sound that way. The synth riff is really catchy, the vocals are great...heck, even though it’s not from the sessions, I could very well see this fitting perfectly with the other songs on JUMP UP!, a good replacement for “I Am Your Robot”. There is one other B-side that was released around this time, but I’m going to wait until the next album to talk about it, as I think it tends to be more associated with that album anyway.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on July 26, 2022, 05:26:02 PM
Yes, I can see why some of the songs on here aren't as well liked, but I would still give this album a plus overall.

"Dear John" is a opener I like. It starts off the album with a catchy, tune. I like the piano solo in the song. I feel mostly the same way about "Spiteful Child", a fun catchy song with a good, brief, instrumental section. The acoustic guitar in "Ball & Chain" was pretty good, I actually wish it would have been just an acoustic song with Elton John doing vocals so the guitar could be in the forefront.

"Legal Boys" has a more emotional pack to it, I agree about feeling fit for a Broadway production or a film score. I could see it being played during a particularly dramatic moment. The strings give the song a little extra punch to it. I viewed "I Am Your Robot" as a fun novelty tune. I like the guitar in the chorus. I definitely don't think this song was meant to be taken seriously, so I will judge it by how much I enjoyed it. "Blue Eyes" and "Empty Garden (Hey Hey Johnny)" are more mellow tracks that emphasize Elton's vocals. I like how they can showcase different uses of his voice, as Umbrella Sam stated the vocals in "Blue Eyes" are lower pitched, giving it a Sinatra feel (the blue eyes title also reminds me of him).

I thought "Princess" sounded like filler too when I heard it. It's not too offensive, I just didn't find it very memorable of a track. "Where Have All The Good Times Gone" is a good way to follow up the previous tracks. After a few, more serious track, I liked hearing this more danceable track. The strings in the song were giving me disco vibes, which I'm not saying as a negative remark. "All Quiet on the Western Front", I could guess what the lyrics were about from the title of the track. This also sounds like a song that I would imagine in a film, like a montage after the movie ends showing actual pictures of the dead soldiers. I like the organ near the end of the song, it gives off a haunting vibe of what war could bring.

Not an album that I would call one of my favorites, as none of these tracks would make my list of top Elton tracks. Not anything I find terrible either, and that's including "I Am Your Robot".
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on August 01, 2022, 09:42:07 PM
“I AM Your Robot” Elton needs to release a career spanning compilation with this as the opening track followed by “Big Dipper.”  The compilation can be called WTF.  I have to admit I was laughing, but for all the wrong reasons.  Stranger still because the first few bars of the song were kind of heavy but then got weird fast.

Basically a ten song album where I like seven of the songs.  Throw “Princess” and “Where Have All the Good Times Gone” as the other two I don’t like.  Seriously, for the latter, The Kinks already took that title and Van Halen even covered the song in 1982.  But what was worse than that was Elton was treading disco come chorus time.  Ugh!

But the rest is very cool.  Fantastic opening track in “Dear John” whose chorus is in my head as I’m typing this - always a good sign.  “Spiteful Child” is another very cool track and I really love the brief instrumental interlude, it gave me some Billy Idol “White Wedding” vibes.  “Ball and Chain” has this fun, danceable acoustic vibe that is so catchy and “Blue Eyes,” in addition to being a sigh of relief after the previous track, has a cool, smoky vibe to it,

Just in general, there are times in this album where Elton sounds like Freddie Mercury.  It’s like when the 80’s came, their voices got closer to each other.  A good album but a step down from THE FOX.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on August 01, 2022, 11:18:37 PM
Just in general, there are times in this album where Elton sounds like Freddie Mercury.  It’s like when the 80’s came, their voices got closer to each other.  A good album but a step down from THE FOX.

Interesting comment. I agree, I’ve long supported the thought that Elton and Freddie’s voices were a lot closer than most people give them credit for. It’s ironic you mention this now, though, as we’ll very soon be approaching the time where that will no longer be the case.

I suppose for “Where Have All The Good Times Gone?”, I should have mentioned that there is an alternate version that ended up as a B-side. You may like that one better, as it’s more hard rocking and de-emphasizes the disco elements to the track. I forgot Van Halen had a track with that title, but from my understanding it was a pretty popular track for them, so I can understand the obvious comparisons.

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on August 05, 2022, 11:22:15 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cd/Too_low_for_zero.JPG)

Next is TOO LOW FOR ZERO, arguably Elton’s most lasting album of the ‘80s. No, it wasn’t his highest charting album of this decade or even the most successful commercially, but it did have multiple big hits that still remain popular today. Many fans consider it his best work of the ‘80s. My thoughts? I think THE FOX and at least one or two other albums are better, but it’s still very good and I think the people who do say that have a good argument.

One good point for that argument is the band lineup: Dee Murray, Nigel Olsson, and Davey Johnstone. Yes, that’s right. Elton finally reunited the classic lineup in 1982 for the JUMP UP! tour, and kept them on to record this album. Elton did work with some great musicians in the interim, creating some really excellent songs in the process. But there is a certain magic to the original lineup; they always seemed to be in perfect sync with each other, knowing the right place at the right time for each member to come in and contribute. They truly felt like an “Elton John Band”, and that continues here, just with an updated ‘80s twist.

Another point in this album’s favor? Well, in addition to the classic band lineup, how about having exclusively John-Taupin songs again? For the first time since BLUE MOVES, Bernie is the main lyrical collaborator. So already, we have most of the elements of the classic Elton John era for this album. But what’s just as interesting is the fact that there is no additional keyboardist. Elton plays every keyboard and synthesizer on this album. In fact, Elton actually wrote a lot of these songs on synthesizers instead of piano, which is a very good approach, as instead of being forced in as an afterthought as they were on some of the JUMP UP! tracks, the synthesizers here feel like a very natural part of the songs considering that’s what they were built around. But once again, we’re getting ahead of ourselves. Let’s do the track-by-track.

The opening song is “Cold as Christmas (in the Middle of the Year)”. If the Elton John Band isn’t enough, the guests on this track read like a “who’s who” list of classic Elton collaborators: Ray Cooper on percussion, Kiki Dee on backing vocals, Skaila Kanga (the harpist on “Your Song”) on harp, this really is a true nostalgia trip. Despite what the title may have you thinking, it’s not actually a Christmas song, more using that as a metaphor for a broken relationship. Very melancholy, but in a good way. As with the other great Elton songs of this type, he sings it so convincingly, you can believe he has experience with this, even though they’re not his lyrics.

The second track is “I’m Still Standing”, one of Elton’s most popular songs of the decade. Yes, it’s overplayed, but that doesn’t take away from the fact that it’s a very catchy song and, lyrically, does capture Elton very well. Through all the troubles he had over the years, he still continued to stand, and still managed to find commercial success for a longer time than a lot of the acts from his era did. The guitar and bass work are fantastic, and I just love hearing that backing vocal combination again. I think I mentioned this before, but I consider the vocal combination of Dee, Davey and Nigel just as important to the classic Elton sound as Elton himself; they just go together so well and have a unique sound that’s never entirely been recaptured.

Next is the title track, which is my least favorite track on the album. As I mentioned, most of these songs were written on synthesizers and are often based around that. However, most of the songs also balance it properly with the right amount of guitars, bass and drums, similar to how the classic albums do so with Elton’s piano. The synthesizers dominate this track, though, which doesn’t necessarily make it bad; some of the effects are cool, but relying on that alone dates the song more than anything else. “Nobody Wins” was heavily programmed too, but it also told this lyrically heartbreaking story that it felt like it was supporting properly. “Too Low For Zero” feels like it’s trying to recapture that, and while the lyrics are definitely sad and relatable, the synthesizers kind of unfocused, especially near the end when they go psychedelic with random different synth sounds. It’s an interesting curiosity especially when you remember the synthesizers are all performed by Elton, but I do think it’s a bit too technical for its own good, and the almost 6 minute running time doesn’t help.

Thankfully, the next track is “Religion”, a guitar-heavy track. There’s really not a whole lot for me to say about it; I just find this track really catchy. It shows off once again just how great of a guitarist Davey is while at the same time being backed by the dependable rhythm section of Dee and Nigel, and Elton and Davey do some really great interplay during the solo section. One effect that’s always stood out to me about this song is that whenever Dee, Davey, and Nigel sing the word “stereo”, it kind of does sound like they’re actually singing it through a radio. It contributes to the kind of “summer” vibe the track musically has to it. Great track; I really like it.

Closing out side 1 is “I Guess That’s Why They Call It the Blues”, another popular song deserving of its status. Elton’s piano playing is great, the band once again sounds really tight and there’s even a harmonica solo from the great Stevie Wonder. It actually kind of feels like something that could have been on one of his ‘70s albums, as it focuses more on piano than synthesizers, the only major difference being Elton’s lower register vocals. Such a beautiful song and a great side closer.

Side 2 opens with “Crystal”, a song that definitely couldn’t have been on a ‘70s Elton John album, as it is much more synth based. But it’s still a good song. Unlike “Too Low For Zero”, and more in line with most of the other tracks, the synthesizers feel much more balanced out with the rest of the band. Some great bass work from Dee on this one, especially in the last minute or so, and it’s nice hearing Elton try the occasional synth solo, which again is something you don’t hear often. It’s a good song with kind of a haunting atmosphere; it even opens with kind of a similar effect to the opening of “Funeral For a Friend”.

Track 7 is “Kiss the Bride”, a single that didn’t take off as well commercially as “I’m Still Standing” or “Blues”, which is a shame because it is also a really good, radio friendly number. Great synth and guitar combination; once again, Davey pulls off another great guitar solo, and I love how all the backing vocals bring everything back together when the solo ends back into the chorus. I still can’t understand why it didn’t take off, because it is really catchy.

Next is “Whipping Boy”, probably the most guitar-heavy track on the album. This one’s conflicting, because musically and productionwise, it’s really solid; the guitar riff is catchy and the drums are particularly heavy. But the lyrics are pretty creepy; knowing Bernie, he probably wrote it as some kind of weird joke, although the theme also reminds me of a certain later song he unfortunately wrote. Just ignore the lyrics and this one’s fun to listen to.

Track 9 is my favorite track on the album, “Saint”. I love everything about this song. I love how it starts with this trumpet style synthesizer sound, how it starts off somewhat quiet, and then in the first chorus, the drums come in and it plays almost like a stadium rocker. The chorus is beautiful; once again, some really fantastic bass work from Dee and the synthesizer really feels like it’s in tune with the rest of the song. It feels like this is a song meant to be played on a synthesizer. The closing guitar solo fadeout is also very emotional. Fantastic track.

Closing out the track is the also fantastic, “One More Arrow”. It’s kind of similar to “Legal Boys” in that it has this Broadway style arrangement, but this one has the advantage of having Dee, Davey and Nigel backing it. Seriously, those backing vocals during the final chorus are so effective emotionally; I know I’ve said this before, but I just love getting to hear that classic backing vocal combination again. Elton’s vocals are performed in falsetto, one of the last major times he does so and the arrangement starts off sparse only to become much heavier in the final chorus, even including a James Newton Howard orchestral arrangement, and it’s very effective. A very good song to close out the album with.

And that’s TOO LOW FOR ZERO. Yes, I wish the lyrics to “Whipping Boy” were different and I’m not crazy about the title track (I don’t necessarily think it’s bad, though). But otherwise, this is a really well put together album and having the classic lineup gives it a real authenticity. If I had never heard an ‘80s Elton album before, this is what I would honestly expect it to sound like. More synth based, but more in a way that it’s just replacing Elton’s piano and the rest of the band is working around it in the same way they would around Elton’s piano on the classic era albums. I really do think the fact that Elton not only played all of the synthesizers but also wrote the songs on them really helps as well. It doesn’t feel like they’re being used for the sake of using them; these feel like songs that were specifically built around these new devices and therefore need to be played on them. Chris Thomas does a great job with the production, and it all feels like a true team effort, just like the old days. Definitely worth checking out.

As for B-sides, there are a few, though keeping in line with the theme of Elton B-sides in the early 1980s, most of them do not come from these sessions. First is “Earn While You Learn”, a holdover from A SINGLE MAN which was released as the B-side to the UK single for “I’m Still Standing”. It’s an instrumental, and I think it was very fitting of them to release it around this time. Similar to TOO LOW FOR ZERO itself, the song features Elton experimenting with various keyboard sounds. It’s a pretty cool experience, even if it does get a bit repetitive at times.

Next is the UK B-side to “Kiss the Bride”, another SINGLE MAN holdover called “Dreamboat”. The version of this track that’s on the TOO LOW FOR ZERO remastered CD and on streaming services is actually not the version originally released on vinyl, but instead it is an extended version. It’s a decent song; the chorus is fun and the backing vocals are especially spirited, but it does get pretty repetitive in the extended version. Obviously the shorter version lacks that repetition, but I actually think it fades a bit too early, because despite the extended version’s ridiculous runtime, it does feature a very excellent Paul Buckmaster arrangement that you can’t really appreciate on the original vinyl because of how early it fades.

Next is “Choc Ice Goes Mental”, the UK B-side to “I Guess That’s Why They Call It the Blues”, and this actually was recorded during the TOO LOW FOR ZERO sessions. It’s a pub style instrumental that sounds like it was recorded in someone’s basement. If you like that type of thing, maybe you’ll enjoy this. I don’t.

And finally, we have the U.S. B-side to “Blues”, “The Retreat”, which is a 21 AT 33 holdover. And this is another track where I find myself asking, “how did this not make the original album?!” Much like “All Quiet in the Western Front”, it lyrically describes life during war. The chorus is super memorable and the musical accompaniment is great, including some organ accompaniment from Toto’s David Paich. The only thing I’m not crazy about is the “flying saucer” style ending, but that’s a very minor complaint compared to how memorable the rest of this song is, and I think its creators would agree, as it’s shown up on multiple compilations throughout the years, including the TOO LOW FOR ZERO remastered CD, the TO BE CONTINUED box set from 1990, and even the recent JEWEL BOX box set.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on August 12, 2022, 01:46:55 AM
An album with good tracks on it, I am surprised to be hearing some songs I still recognize and like, even if we're getting further away from his "golden age" there are still some tracks definitely worth listening to. The two songs I was most familiar with were "I'm Still Standing"  and "I Guess That's Why They Call It the Blues". Both songs I hear a lot at my work, and because of that I assumed it was from the earlier period. My views on them are a little different. I liked "I'm Still Standing" right away, it's just so catchy and fun that it's easy to like. "I Guess That's Why They Call it the Blues" is a song that didn't make much of an impression on me at first, but I have enjoyed more as I listen to it now. Fitting with the blues theme, I could totally get it being played at a bar.

"Cold as Christmas (In the Middle of the Year)" is an interesting way to open the album. Usually his opening tracks are rocking and upbeat songs, but this one starts off with a more somber, serious track. I liked this song, though. "One More Arrow" bookends the album with another more downbeat track. As for the more upbeat tracks? I really liked "Religion", "Whipping Boy" and "Kiss the Bride". "Whipping Boy" was a good rocking tune, I didn't really know what the lyrics were about, so they didn't bother me. "Too Low for Zero" and "Crystal" were the most dated feeling tracks on the album. They scream 80s with those synthesizers. I was a bigger fan of "Crystal" as I felt it made better use of the synths.


What I had the most fun was listening to the B sides, those are definitely my favorite releases from this period. I didn't listen to the B sides from Jump Up! last time, but I got around to it this time. "Hey Papa Legba" was really fun, I liked the horns in it as you mentioned. "Take Me to the Ocean" did remind me of The Beach Boys too, it almost sounds like it could be a tribute, especially in the chorus and with the ocean lyrics. I was a really big fan of "Earn While You Learn". It took me by surprise, and it might be one of my favorite Elton songs believe it or not. A song I definitely didn't get sick of. "Chock Ice Mental" I even liked. It reminds me of a 1890s bar setting, the audio quality even gives off that vibe.

I enjoyed the album, and really had a blast with the B sides!
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on August 17, 2022, 07:05:52 AM
First off, what I’m about to say I’m surprised this is the first time I’m going to say.  My previous Elton experience is some familiarity with a few classic era albums and I know the hits of that era.  After the classic era, my familiarity drops off but I figure there’s gotta be some song I’ve heard but didn’t realize it was Elton.  Well, it finally happened as I definitely know “I Guess That’s Why They Call It the Blues.”  Great song with some cool Davey Johnstone guitar playing and is there a more distinct harmonica guy than Stevie Wonder?  Obvious it’s him.

My overall impression is this is a very enjoyable album and there is not one track I disliked.  The vast majority of it, I would say tracks 2 - 8, sounded like a consistently enjoyable upbeat pop album with a lot of cool electronic sounds.  I really love the electric guitar and synth playing throughout this album.  After track eight things got a bit moodier on the final two tracks and my theory of Elton and 80’s Queen morphing into each other on occasion rings true here.I can totally picture Freddie singing “One More Arrow.”

I dug Elton’s piano solo on the title track and loved Dee’s bass on “Crystal” very much.  Cool to see the band truly back together and Bernie back full time as well.  So overall, a very enjoyable pop album and I would say perhaps the only thing missing are the occasional dramatic and progressive elements of his classic work, but again, what’s here is fine.  In 1983?  Even the mainstream progressive bands were going pop.

I also have this weird theory about 60’s and 70’s artists,  I always think for the most part, their last good works in the 80’s were around ‘83 or ‘84 and then they drift for a while.  I’m curious if this happens to Elton.  But TOO LOW FOR ZERO, in 1983?  A thumbs up for me.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on August 22, 2022, 12:02:24 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/8c/Breaking_hearts.JPG)

The relationship between TOO LOW FOR ZERO and BREAKING HEARTS is kind of similar to that of Black Sabbath with HEAVEN AND HELL and MOB RULES. Sensing a successful formula with TOO LOW FOR ZERO, Elton basically went ahead and did it again. Dee, Davey and Nigel joined Elton once again at the AIR studios in Montserrat with Chris Thomas again acting as producer. One noticeable personnel change was the recording engineer. On the previous album it was Bill Price. For this album, Renate Blauel, who was a tape operator on the previous album, got the job; before the release of BREAKING HEARTS, she would end up becoming Elton John’s wife!

Besides that change, this album pretty much followed the same process as TOO LOW FOR ZERO. All Bernie lyrics, songs written on synthesizers, all synthesizers on the final album played by Elton. And yet, somehow this one doesn’t seem to get as much love as TOO LOW FOR ZERO, even though it did have some hits, including another track that would survive the ‘80s and still end up on Elton’s setlist even for the farewell tour. From a lyrical perspective, I can kind understand, as they often seem to cover similar ground, especially failing relationships and breakups. However, I think BREAKING HEARTS is just as good as TOO LOW FOR ZERO.

The first song is “Restless”, a hard rock song in the old tradition of something like “Saturday Night’s Alright (For Fighting)”. Very guitar heavy, and Elton recaptures that kind of gravelly tone he had in songs like “Saturday” and “Grow Some Funk of Your Own”. It’s a good opener.

Next is “Slow Down Georgie (She’s Poison)”. This is a really awesome track. It’s one of those songs that starts off kind of quiet and slow, but then suddenly turns into this really catchy rock number. The chorus is super catchy, and I love the build up into it, especially those wonderful backing vocals. The drumming is great, the bass work is great...this is a song that really feels like a traditional Elton piece off of something like DON’T SHOOT ME I’M THE ONLY PIANO PLAYER.

The third track is “Who Wears These Shoes?”, a top 20 hit here in the U.S., and also my least favorite song on the album. There’s nothing inherently wrong with it; the “Who wears these shoes” lyrical hook is kind of catchy, but the song doesn’t really feel like it builds to anything, it’s always the same rhythm, same key. That kind of thing can work with something that immediately pulls you in, but this one doesn’t; the beginning sounds kind of generic. It’s fine, just nothing super special.

That’s followed by “Breaking Hearts (Ain’t What It Used to Be)”. This is a ballad, an almost lullaby style song with just Elton on piano; the band appears, but only on backing vocals. I think it’s done very well; there are times where the backing vocals are so high it almost sounds like they brought in completely different singers, but they really were just that talented. And Elton’s vocals of course are fantastic as well, occasionally making use of his falsetto, but for the most part keeping it grounded and sounding like he’s in some kind of despair.

Side 1 closes with “Li’l Frigerator”, which is more in line with the first three tracks. I really like the synthesizer sounds during the chorus and the saxophone/guitar-focused instrumental section is effective. Not much more to say than that; it’s another good rock track.

Side 2 opens with “Passengers”. This one is credited to Elton, Bernie, Davey and Phineas Mkhize. The reason for this is that the main synth melody is based off of Mkhize’s song, “Isonto Lezayone”. It’s a good riff too; very catchy and it captures the anti-apartheid theme of the song very well. Even the verses manage to capture the African theme thanks to the light synthesizer sounds. A really unique song in the Elton catalog; definitely worth checking out.

I also really like the next track, “In Neon”. A tale of broken dreams while trying to find success in a Hollywood or Broadway type setting, this is a very beautiful ballad, with lots of acoustic guitar and a heavy amount of keyboards; in addition to synthesizers and piano, Elton also plays Fender Rhodes and harpsichord on this track. The backing vocals are beautiful, the chorus is lovely, and it feels like it captures the full story as written in Bernie’s lyrics. It was released as a single, but bombed, which is a shame, as I think it’s one of the best tracks on the album.

And yet, my favorite track is actually the next one, “Burning Buildings”. It’s another one of those songs that’s constantly changing throughout; the verses start off in a different key, then build up to a really dramatic chorus. There’s even a cool little Spanish-inspired instrumental section near the end before going into one final chorus. It’s such a great ballad; the vocals from everyone involved are fantastic, the drums are really heavy during the choruses, you get to hear more acoustic piano than usual. A really well produced track, highly recommended.

Next is “Did He Shoot Her?” Definitely an odd title and lyric, but it does have a lot of catchy hooks in it. This is a bit more of a synth heavy rock track. It also uses sitar, and quite effectively; the sitar kind of contributes to the technical atmosphere of the production, but it’s not so technical to the point that it’s lifeless. It’s just a fun track in a digital style. I could see some people not liking this one, but I enjoy it.

The last track is also the most known track, “Sad Songs (Say So Much)”. It’s not hard to see why this is the one track that lasted all these years, as it does have a certain energy in it live that keeps the crowd engaged. I saw Elton live again last month and this was the one that really stuck out to me; I could just feel the energy in the stadium, it felt so lively. As far as the studio version goes, it’s really good. Also kind of synth heavy, with a good solid drum beat, this is a tribute to sad songs while ironically being very joyous in its own musical approach. And joyous it is, very much a sing along type of song, and a great way to close out the album.

And finally, there are 2 B-sides, both of them older songs that were not from these sessions. “A Simple Man” is kind of just an average country number, nothing super special. “Lonely Boy”, on the other hand, is amazing. Very synth heavy with some awesome guitar work (probably Steve Lukather) and lots of hooks throughout; the jamming near the end is great, everyone’s in top form.

BREAKING HEARTS was another commercial success for Elton, charting even higher than TOO LOW FOR ZERO did in both the U.S. and the U.K. A successful tour followed showing the classic lineup still had what it took to make a great show. And so, taking all of this into account, Elton....split the band again. Yes, in a pretty familiar repeat of what happened before, Elton retained Davey, but let Dee and Nigel go. Only this time, the split would be a bit more permanent. While this isn’t the last album to feature the classic lineup together, it is the last to feature them together playing their respective instruments. And honestly, it’s a pretty good way to go out. A big focus on rock, along with a really catchy anti-apartheid song, three beautiful ballads and ending with a certified classic, it’s a consistently strong album. I really do consider it and TOO LOW FOR ZERO to be on the same level; the engagement from everyone is still there.

So, we once again say goodbye to Dee and Nigel, where to next? Well, ROCK OF THE WESTIES was the album that followed CAPTAIN FANTASTIC, and I really liked that album, so who knows? Maybe the next album could also be really good. OK, so what’s the next album?

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b7/Ice_on_fire.jpg)

Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on August 28, 2022, 08:12:33 AM
BREAKING HEARTS is another good album, one that for me has a stronger side one than a side two.  Actually, side one is fantastic!  The side is bookended by two great rockers and in between are some fine ballads, pop songs and rock bits.  Really entertaining.  “Restless” sounds like a latter day Stones rocker and man, listen to how meaty sounding that bass is!  Actually, the production on this album as a whole is pretty good.

Side two - well….I do like “In Neon” and “Burning Buildings” a lot.  “Passengers” is almost reggae like at parts and not quite my style and “Did He Shoot Her?” a bit too robotic rhythmically.  “Sad Songs (Say So Much),” a hit single, is a pretty good way to end the album.  It’s a catchy chorus and I can understand why it was deemed hit worthy.

So yeah, overall, classic side one, mixed side two with some good stuff thrown in means overall I like this.  One great thing about this exercise is it got me to explore Elton past the mid 70’s and I’m finding this early 80’s stuff has a lot to recommend, so I will definitely be listening to these albums again at some point.  As far as what I call the curse of 1985 for 60’s and 70’s artists, Darth Vader told me this may be the case with Elton.  Vee shall see.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on August 28, 2022, 11:37:51 PM
BREAKING HEARTS is another good album, one that for me has a stronger side one than a side two.  Actually, side one is fantastic!  The side is bookended by two great rockers and in between are some fine ballads, pop songs and rock bits.  Really entertaining.  “Restless” sounds like a latter day Stones rocker and man, listen to how meaty sounding that bass is!  Actually, the production on this album as a whole is pretty good.

Side two - well….I do like “In Neon” and “Burning Buildings” a lot.  “Passengers” is almost reggae like at parts and not quite my style and “Did He Shoot Her?” a bit too robotic rhythmically.  “Sad Songs (Say So Much),” a hit single, is a pretty good way to end the album.  It’s a catchy chorus and I can understand why it was deemed hit worthy.

So yeah, overall, classic side one, mixed side two with some good stuff thrown in means overall I like this.  One great thing about this exercise is it got me to explore Elton past the mid 70’s and I’m finding this early 80’s stuff has a lot to recommend, so I will definitely be listening to these albums again at some point.  As far as what I call the curse of 1985 for 60’s and 70’s artists, Darth Vader told me this may be the case with Elton.  Vee shall see.

Yeah, your 1985 prediction was quite spot on, but I figured I’d wait until we at least got through BREAKING HEARTS.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on September 03, 2022, 07:08:09 PM
I enjoyed this album over Too Low for Zero, and that was mostly due to how good the beginning of the album was (I agree with Metaldams on this). A very strong opening rock track with “Restless”. I think opening an album with a track like this makes more sense than what they did in Too Low for Zero. “Slow Down Georgie (She’s Poison)” was my favorite track on the album. I loved the acoustic opening and was expecting to to stay like that, but when it changed to a more rocking tune I was fine with that too! Very catchy like Umbrella Sam stated.

I didn't think "Who Wears these Shoes?" was bad, it just had an odd placement on the album. I think it should have been placed later, as we had two upbeat tracks to open the album and we could have used a ballad. Speaking of ballads “Breaking Hearts (Ain’t What It Used to Be)” was a good one at that. Although the band were only on backing vocals, that was my favorite part of the song, it added something to the track to make it even better. “Li’l Frigerator” was a another great hard rock track. I never really thought that was mostly his style, but he made quite a few of songs like this.

After that I find the tracks were mostly forgettable. I agree "Burning Buildings" was a touching track, and maybe the best from this run. I did recognize “Sad Songs (Say So Much)”. It's a song I've heard many times before, and I think it was as good as hits from Too Low for Zero.

My overall verdict? I think I preferred it over Too Low for Zero because of the beginning of the album.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on September 11, 2022, 09:41:16 AM
Yesterday I watched the DVD with a friend of that show Elton did in 2001 in Turkey where he was just singing and playing piano with no band.  It was awesome.  “Burn the Mission Down” was especially good and I even liked “Crocodile Rock” somewhat with a more stripped down arrangement.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on October 02, 2022, 10:21:02 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b7/Ice_on_fire.jpg)

Well, after a pretty good comeback, Elton immediately fell to rock bottom with ICE ON FIRE. In my opinion, ICE ON FIRE is the worst Elton John album. What’s that? I said that VICTIM OF LOVE was the worst Elton John album? Well, technically yes, it is worse considering the lack of variety, but as I’ve stated before, I don’t really consider it an Elton John album. ICE ON FIRE is a real Elton John album; he wrote the songs and plays keyboards, although half the time, the production is so all over the place that it’s hard to tell where he’s playing.

That last part may seem shocking because a quick glance shows that the producer is none other than Gus Dudgeon. Yeah, the man behind TUMBLEWEED CONNECTION, GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD, and CAPTAIN FANTASTIC is also behind this mess. Elton fans criticize Chris Thomas, but at least he had a technical mindset and knew how to work with that. Even if I didn’t like the title track on TOO LOW FOR ZERO, it at least feels like it was a track that was meant to be played on a synthesizer. Dudgeon seems like he just has to throw in synths and drum machines simply for the purpose of filling space. No, it’s not entirely fair to blame all of the album’s problems on Dudgeon considering the quality of songwriting, but...man, he does not help.

The lineups are all over the place on this album. Davey is here, as is keyboardist Fred Mandel, who had played on the BREAKING HEARTS tour and will stick around for the rest of the decade. It’s kind of a “Who’s who?” lineup; George Michael, Roger Taylor and John Deacon of Queen, Pino Palladino; there are great musicians here, but they just feel so lost in the shuffle. It rarely has heart or emotion; it’s a very cold album. Let’s get to the track-by-track.

The opening track is “This Town”. For all the complaining I do with this album, I do have to admit that this is a pretty decent track. Granted, it doesn’t compare to any of the opening tracks from earlier in the decade, but the horn section and backing vocals do give it some much needed life. The bass playing’s actually kind of cool too, the more I think about it I actually do enjoy this song more than I used to. At the same time, though, just listen to that intro. Almost immediately, you can tell that the synthesizers are going to dominate like crazy, and not in the kind of way where they help.

The next track, “Cry to Heaven” has probably been the biggest revelation this listening. When you get down to the song at hand, it’s actually good, and Dudgeon’s production works most of the time. There are still cases where he throws in a random synthesizer sound that doesn’t fit, like during the line “I saw a black cat”, but there are also cases where he does capture this lonely, isolating atmosphere while at the same time not keeping the song too stark. A pleasant surprise to revisit.

Track 3 is “Soul Glove”. The production on this track actually isn’t bad either, but... this song is super generic. It doesn’t help that it’s another dance song which we just had with “This Town”. The styles are already beginning to feel limited, we’re a long way from true rock and roll here. It’s not terrible or anything, but it’s just not an engaging track whatsoever.

And then we have the main reason people remember this album: “Nikita”. This was a huge hit, reaching the top 10 in the U.S. and the UK and still often finds itself included on Greatest Hits packages. I have never liked this track; on GREATEST HITS 1970-2002, this was always the one track I would skip, it just sounds so bland and ugly from a production standpoint. I can understand how it was a hit when you take into account Cold War sensibilities and, therefore, the song being relevant, but it just doesn’t sound good. The drums and percussion don’t sound good, the synthesizers don’t sound natural to the song. George Michael also appears on backing vocals at the end and, man, it really brings the song down even more. Nothing against George Michael, but his high pitched singing at the end is really out of place; they’re trying to do this dramatic ending and they have Michael doing this weird screeching on top of it. So yeah, the production is bad, but even as written, I just don’t like this song. I’ve heard solo renditions of this and it still doesn’t sound good to me. Even when placing the lyrics in their time, it still just feels like such a formulaic ballad. And unfortunately, things get even worse with the next track.

The next track is “Too Young”, which gets my vote for the worst Elton John song. The lyrics are ridiculously creepy, it wastes guest appearances from John Deacon and Roger Taylor thanks to bad synth sounds and way too much percussion, the guitar sounds too distant. It’s a terrible sounding and written track, and I would much rather listen to “I Am Your Robot”. I know I haven’t actually said that much about it, but frankly, I just get sick talking about it. Next!

Side 2 opens with “Wrap Her Up”, which was another single. Once again, Elton is joined by George Michael, though this time it’s more of a duet, and Michael’s high pitched vocals actually work in the context of this song. It’s more upbeat, and the vocals do work well off of Elton’s lower pitched vocals; there’s a reason these two would have a big hit together later on. There are elements to this song that I like; I think the string arrangement is pretty decent and there is a sense of fun between the band here that felt lacking on “Soul Glove”; apparently, this originated as a jam of Roy Orbison’s “Dream Baby” before turning into something else. That being said, it still does scream “overdone pop machine”. The horns actually feel a bit overbearing at times and there’s an occasional sense in loss of direction. The throwing out names at the end thing may seem like a fun novelty to simply check what names you recognize, but it still doesn’t warrant the amount of time dedicated to it. I guess you could argue that it was cut for the single release and therefore works better there, but...I don’t know, to me it’s still not that interesting, but others may like it.

OK, “Satellite”. The intro is way too long and sounds too digital. When we finally get to the actual song, it’s not an improvement. Super generic melody matched with too many digital sounds and some average studio drum work.

Then we have “Tell Me What the Papers Say”, yet again another attempt to do a dance song like “This Town”, only this time with the horns replaced by stiff keyboards attempting to sound like horns. I don’t mean to knock Fred Mandel; he did some good work with Elton as time went along, but on this album in particular, things just kind of feel like they’re being thrown together without any of the emotion of previous albums. Not much else to say; not terrible, but it’s not enjoyable either.

“Candy By the Pound” is fine; at the very least, it sounds like they’re trying to break out of the repetitive mold as this sounds more like a funk song, and the keyboards actually sound pretty good on it as well. The melody still isn’t that memorable, but considering some of the other tracks on here, this song can get a pass for that.

The closing track is “Shoot Down the Moon”. This is a song I feel I should like; it’s got an interesting title and the synth effects have a “Cry to Heaven” feel that creates a dark atmosphere. It’s definitely not as bad as some of these other tracks, but at the same time, it actually comes across as a bit boring and I think the slightly more minimalist style really shows off the problems with Elton’s voice. Oh, did I forget to mention that? Yes, this is the album where Elton’s voice really starts to change. Elton’s change to a permanent lower range is a debatable topic. Honestly, I think he adapted quite well to it and still had a very rich and warm sound, but that was after the vocal surgery. Here, it sounds strained, and you can tell he was starting to develop some sort of problem, one that would become more apparent the next year while on tour. It’s not a bad song, but I never find myself coming back to it.

As for additional tracks, one of them is “Act of War”, a duet with Millie Jackson that was included as a bonus track on early CD editions of ICE ON FIRE. It sucks; don’t listen to it.

And finally we have “The Man Who Never Died”, which was the B-side to “Wrap Her Up” (U.S.) and “Nikita” (UK). This is an instrumental that’s superior to anything on the album, so it should probably come as no surprise that this actually was not written during the ICE ON FIRE sessions. It’s actually a track that Elton wrote in response to John Lennon’s death, but after Taupin wrote “Empty Garden”, it got pushed aside in favor of that track. Dudgeon later revived it by adding synthesizers and drum machines, but they actually do work in the context of the song. It’s like “Cry to Heaven” and “Shoot Down the Moon” in that they build upon the dark atmosphere and yet it somehow seems even more controlled, maybe because it is an instrumental and more attention had to be put on those kinds of details. It has kind of a “Song For Guy” effect, and it pulls it off very well.

And that’s ICE ON FIRE. I will admit, my opinion on it has slightly improved considering I never really gave much attention to “Cry to Heaven” before, but even that’s not enough to improve my opinion drastically. I still consider it the worst Elton John album; most fans argue that the next album, LEATHER JACKETS is worse, and we’ll get to that soon enough, but at the very least, I’ll say for now that there are songs on there that I like from start to finish. Even the better songs on ICE ON FIRE still have problems; it’s so odd how big of a shift in tone there is between BREAKING HEARTS and this, they could almost sound like different artists, even though BREAKING HEARTS was also a synth heavy album. It’s not just the production, though. Heavy reliance on synths and drum machines would continue to be a thing for Elton even into the ‘90s, with varying degrees of success, but the quality of songs were, for the most part, more like Elton. Songs like “Nikita” and “Satellite” feel like they could have been written by just about anyone. They’re super generic and as a result, I don’t think it’s fair to entirely blame Dudgeon for their failures. At the very least, things do get better from here...well for me, I am very curious to hear everyone’s thoughts on LEATHER JACKETS.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on October 08, 2022, 08:32:38 AM
I actually enjoyed ICE ON FIRE a lot more than I thought I would.  No, it’s not anywhere near the classics but it’s an enjoyable 80’s pop album.  I think I’m developing a soft spot in my heart the older I get for this kind of thing - I was six when this was released and for better or worse, that synthetic 80’s sound are my first memories of contemporary music.  Sounds like the kind of thing that would play at the mall when my mother and grandmother were dragging me and my brother around clothes shopping.

The two ballads, “Cry to Heaven” and “Shoot Down the Moon” stand out majorly here.  The (relatively) stripped down feel gives these songs some distinction and I really enjoyed them both.  I didn’t notice anything with Elton’s voice but yes, I heard he had polyps removed around this time, or something like that.  A friend of mine, who I’m actually going to hang out with today, swears the live versions from the 80’s with this voice gave some of the old songs a different character.

The rest of the album was simply highly produced 80’s pop with some Elton style songwriting.  He seems to eschew the progressive elements for straight pop at this point, but again, I find it enjoyable in an 80’s way.  Crazy how starting in the mid 80’s, nobody from Elton’s generation could do a subtle production.  It’s like the new technology and trends effected them the same way.

George Michael having an appearance gave me a smile.  I never owned anything by him, but he was a constant presence when I was a kid nonetheless on MTV and I was bummed when he passed.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on October 08, 2022, 08:37:32 PM
I actually enjoyed ICE ON FIRE a lot more than I thought I would.  No, it’s not anywhere near the classics but it’s an enjoyable 80’s pop album.  I think I’m developing a soft spot in my heart the older I get for this kind of thing - I was six when this was released and for better or worse, that synthetic 80’s sound are my first memories of contemporary music.  Sounds like the kind of thing that would play at the mall when my mother and grandmother were dragging me and my brother around clothes shopping.

The two ballads, “Cry to Heaven” and “Shoot Down the Moon” stand out majorly here.  The (relatively) stripped down feel gives these songs some distinction and I really enjoyed them both.  I didn’t notice anything with Elton’s voice but yes, I heard he had polyps removed around this time, or something like that.  A friend of mine, who I’m actually going to hang out with today, swears the live versions from the 80’s with this voice gave some of the old songs a different character.

The rest of the album was simply highly produced 80’s pop with some Elton style songwriting.  He seems to eschew the progressive elements for straight pop at this point, but again, I find it enjoyable in an 80’s way.  Crazy how starting in the mid 80’s, nobody from Elton’s generation could do a subtle production.  It’s like the new technology and trends effected them the same way.

George Michael having an appearance gave me a smile.  I never owned anything by him, but he was a constant presence when I was a kid nonetheless on MTV and I was bummed when he passed.

Your friend is right. If you listen to the LIVE IN AUSTRALIA album which was recorded right before his vocal surgery, there is a certain brave feeling to his vocal performances. You can tell at times that he’s struggling, but he sings songs like “Your Song” as though they may be his last performances, which they very well could have been, and it is really impressive when he does get the high notes on those songs.

As for ICE ON FIRE, I’m glad you were able to find enjoyment in it, even if I’m not a fan. I can see what you mean about developing a soft spot for that kind of music; even though I was never exactly into early 2000s music when it was popular, I do find myself occasionally feeling nostalgia for some of those early 2000s tracks that I heard on the radio as a kid.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: HomokHarcos on October 12, 2022, 07:09:08 AM
I listened to this album before reading your review, and I seemed to enjoy it more than you did. I used to not like synthpop, but I'm starting to warm up a bit to it. At this point I'm not expecting Elton's albums to match his 1970s peak, so I'm more just enjoying them as music releases, aside from a double punch to the gut at a certain point during this album.

Some of the upbeats tracks I really liked. "This Town" was a good way to start off the album, and I liked hearing some of the other upbeat songs like "Soul Glove". Not just doing fun songs, he also had some ballads I liked, "Cry Me to Heaven" and "Shoot the Moon" like metaldams mentioned, are also good songs.

"Wrap Her Up" was my favorite song on the album, I liked it a lot. It reminded me of new wave, and it is a song I would probably play at a family party. I know I will personally put in on in a setting like that eventually. George Michael's high-pitched vocals really added to this track. One of my favorite Elton songs after his golden age. "Satellite" was enjoyable when it started, but I think it went on for a little too long.

That brings me to the main issue with this album, two tracks you also didn't like: "Nikita" and "Too Young". My thoughts on hearing "Too Young" was also "bland" and "worst Elton song so far", so I laughed when I saw that's how you described also described it! Both songs I found very boring, and they seemed to go on forever with no end in sight. It didn't help that they were sequenced back-to-back either. That alone would dampen my excitement a little if I ever listened through this full album again.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on October 16, 2022, 09:33:58 AM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2c/Leather_jackets.JPG)

Well, we’re finally here. The album that often finds itself near the bottom of Elton John album rankings, the album that Elton John himself has declared his worst album, the album that tanked commercially (it peaked at 91 in the U.S. and had no Top 40 singles). Is it as bad as everyone says it is?

…No. To me, ICE ON FIRE is clearly the worse album. That doesn’t mean it’s devoid of bad moments; there are a couple of songs that are as bad as some of the tracks on ICE ON FIRE, but in general, the album is more of a combination between songs that are just kind of forgettable and songs that I actually enjoy, including one that I think is among his most underrated. But once again, we’re getting ahead of ourselves. What’s the story behind this one?

Kind of a mess, to be honest. Elton has described the recording of this album as a very drug heavy atmosphere and considers that a major reason why it became a so-called “disaster”. I’ve often suspected that ICE ON FIRE was recorded under similar circumstances, but I haven’t seen that confirmed. As a matter of fact, some of the tracks on this album were actually tracks that didn’t make ICE ON FIRE. Once again, Gus Dudgeon is producing and it’s again filled with guest stars; John Deacon and Roger Taylor are back, Cher co-wrote a song, there’s a duet with Cliff Richard. Let’s dive in.

First up is the title track. I always thought this was such an odd title for an album of this period; it made it seem dated even when it was released. As far as the track itself, it’s dominated by synths and electronic percussion, as is expected by this point. It’s not particularly memorable, but it also doesn’t drag in a way that the worse ICE ON FIRE tracks do; this track doesn’t offend me in any way. It’s in one ear and out the other, it’s just OK.

The second track is “Hoop of Fire”. Despite his hatred of the album, Elton himself has singled out this track in both his autobiography and on JEWEL BOX as a standout. I guess I could see why; it’s a bit more dramatic and there is some good piano and guitar work, especially near the end. I wouldn’t go as far as he goes in praising this one, but it does kind of have a charm to it; this one’s kind of grown on me over the years.

Track 3 is the Cher collaboration, “Don’t Trust That Woman”. Cher had previously collaborated with a man named Les Dudek to record this track, but apparently decided to have Elton try it out several years later. I have no idea what made this so appealing, because these lyrics are atrocious. Seriously, I can’t even imagine how these lyrics were considered worthy enough to have a song written around them. But what’s even stranger is that, despite these awful lyrics, the music and production are actually kind of decent. Yeah, there actually is kind of an upbeat, infectious quality to the music here; it’s one of those tracks where the lyrics and melody feel so mismatched that I wish the melody had been applied to something else entirely. This one’s weird.

Track 4 is “Go It Alone”. I like this track; it’s very electronic and a product of its time, sure, but it does have kind of a fun quality to it; I feel like there was a lot of energy put into this. The guitar work is good, the electronic drums work, the opening is kind of cool. It’s by no means a masterpiece, but it’s still enjoyable.

And then we get to my favorite track on the album, the track that I consider among Elton’s best of the ‘80s, the incredibly underrated and beautiful “Gypsy Heart”. When I first heard LEATHER JACKETS, I was stunned to find that a song of this quality had come out of these sessions. In fact, it apparently comes from the ICE ON FIRE sessions! While there are other tracks on LEATHER JACKETS that I like, I also know that they’re products of their time, and I could see people making arguments against them. But I will always continue to defend this one; this sounds like something that could have been on THE FOX. Elton’s piano is much more prominent than usual, the backing vocals at times sound like Davey, Dee and Nigel, the chorus is absolutely beautiful, supported by some fantastic guitar chords from Davey. This is a true Elton John ballad; no over reliance on synths, no distracting high pitched vocals, the melody is distinct and not generic at all; the difference between this and “Nikita” is shocking. It’s insane that it got rejected for ICE ON FIRE as it is much better than any song that made that album. Wonderful song, I absolutely love it.

Track 6 is “Slow Rivers”, the duet with Cliff Richard. Richard isn’t someone I’m too familiar with. I know he had hits, and in fact one song he recorded, “Annabella Umbrella”, was actually demoed by Elton in the ‘60s when he was still an unknown session singer. Richard’s voice works pretty well off of Elton’s in this song, and overall, the song is pretty decent too. The chorus is memorable and it even has a string arrangement. Not much else to say; it’s another song I like.

Next up is “Heartache All Over the World”, the album’s lead single. This is another one of those tracks that often comes up when fans are discussing the topic of “worst Elton John song”. Even Elton himself tends to single this one out when discussing why he doesn’t like the album. My thoughts? I like it, and not just because the music video has a ton of silent movie clips in it (although that is also cool). Yeah, it’s a very synth/electronic dominated track, but I feel like unlike some other tracks from this era, they came in knowing it would be that. There are a lot of differing synth sounds throughout and I think it’s kind of cool to hear them vary them up throughout the song. One part I like in particular is when they sing the line “heart’s on fire”, where the synths start sounding a bit more dark, capturing a sense of hopelessness. And unlike “Wrap Her Up”, I feel like this one’s a lot more contained; in addition to being shorter, you also don’t have the overbearing horns or a gimmick that kind of overstays its welcome. Sure, it’s not top tier Elton, but I find myself in the mood to listen to it every now and then; it’s a fun track.

Track 8 is “Angeline”, which credits Elton, Bernie, and backing vocalist Alan Carvell, who came up with the backing vocal part heard throughout this song. I don’t like this song; the lyrics are awful and the melody feels a bit uninspired. The only thing I kind of like is the rhythm section of John Deacon and Roger Taylor who actually do feel better utilized here than on “Too Young”. At the very least, they sound like they’re trying to make it more lively.

Then we have “Memory of Love”. There was a time where I hated this song; once again, the lyrics are pretty bad, but looking back, the song itself is not as bad as I remembered. This is a John-Osborne collaboration, the very last one to appear on an album. Admittedly, this is a pretty weak way for this collaboration to go out, as I felt it had gradually improved over the years and this feels like a big step down lyrically. But the melody’s listenable and, to be fair, Elton actually does sound pretty engaged in his vocal performance. And it doesn’t drag in the same way that “Nikita” and “Too Young” do. I still wouldn’t go so far as to call it a good song, but I’d still rather listen to it over “Angeline”; it’s kind of started to fall in the title track category where it just kind of moves along without ever really going anywhere. Even with the bad lyrics, I don’t necessarily hate it anymore.

That’s followed by “Paris”. This is another track that’s grown on me, although I never necessarily disliked it. It’s in the same category as “Hoop of Fire”, in that it’s a bit more dramatic production wise and though keyboard heavy, the keyboards feel like they fit in the context of the song, giving off a slightly more European vibe. This is another one I like.

The final track, “I Fall Apart” is probably the track I’m most conflicted on, and a lot of that has to do with Elton’s voice, which is sounding more noticeably strained due to the fact that he has to sing partially in falsetto. It really sounds like he is falling apart, because he was, and it’s just so sad to listen to as a result. On the other hand, though, it kind of has a LIVE IN AUSTRALIA vibe where you have to appreciate that, despite what he’s going through, he clearly is trying to make something out of it. The song is more minimalist in production and at times reminds me a bit of “One More Arrow” without the string section. I feel like there is a lot of heart being put in here, but it can just be a bit too sad to listen to at times, especially when you have an idea of what Elton’s emotional state was at this point.

And that’s LEATHER JACKETS. Yes, production-wise, it’s still a bit of a chaotic mess and some of the lyrics are pretty awful at times, but I feel like they do have a slightly better handle here than on ICE ON FIRE. It doesn’t feel like they’re constantly having to fill up dead space; there are moments on this album where the production and melodies do feel properly matched up and not generic. Yeah, they’re still products of their time, but they don’t ever drag in a way that tracks like “Nikita” or “Too Young” do. And, of course, there’s the fact that “Gypsy Heart” is on here. I adored this track the moment I heard it and still do; even if there are other tracks on here that I like, I wouldn’t go out of my way to defend them as “objectively good” songs, but this one I will. It’s a real hidden gem in the Elton catalogue, one I can’t recommend enough. In my opinion, an improvement over ICE ON FIRE, but I know a lot of Elton fans disagree with me on that, so I’m curious to hear your guys’s opinions.

As for B-sides, the B-side to “Heartache All Over the World” is an instrumental called “Highlander”. A recording of this was used to open shows on the ICE ON FIRE tour and it’s believed it also might have been intended for the 1986 film, HIGHLANDER (the director, Russell Mulcahy, directed many of Elton’s music videos). I like this track; it’s very synth dominated, and I believe all of the synths are performed by Elton himself. It’s got a very mellow, calm atmosphere for the majority of it until it suddenly goes in a different direction near the end, showing off more synth/piano combos. Cool song.

“Slow Rivers”, on the other hand had two B-sides. One of them is “Lord of the Flies”, which is fine despite an annoying intro trying to replicate the sounds of flies, as well as a less than good instrumental section in the middle. Still, there’s elements to it that I like such as the bass playing. On the other hand, the other B-side, “Billy and the Kids”, is a super catchy track. The theater organ-like keyboards are cool, and the horn section has a good groove. This is a track I feel should have been on the album, as there feels like there’s a lot of energy put into it.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: metaldams on October 20, 2022, 06:55:32 PM
The verdict is “Hoop of Fire,” “Go It Alone,” and yes Sam, “Gypsy Heart” are all excellent.  “Heartache All Over the World” is dreadful, the Cliff Richard duet is OK, the title track would be better with a different arrangement (felt like synths subbing for horns), “Don’t Trust That Woman” has kind of a push/pull thing with me where I like some parts but not others, and the rest is in one ear and out the other.

“Gypsy Heart” has that mellow, somber feel that feels like it belongs on side four of EXILE ON MAIN STREET.  Great song.  As far as “Go It Alone,” what an infectious beat that tune has, I dig it.  I agree with Elton’s assessment on both  “Heartache All Over the World” and “Hoop of Fire.”  I mean, the former - he’s a gay man singing about not being able to get a date with a girl.  The closeting a lot of gay celebrities sadly went through in the 80’s was societal pressure bullshit, I was a kid and remember it all too well, plus I know he was married at the time, I remember this from the movie.  So I can understand Elton’s opinion.  “Hoop of Fire,” though.  Yeah, he should be proud of that one.

Cliff Richard, while I don’t know much of his music, I do know pre Beatles, he was, by far, the biggest British rock star.  I would guess Elton listened to him as a kid and was probably thrilled to be working with him.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on December 06, 2022, 09:33:58 PM
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e5/Reg_strikes_back.JPG)

If it wasn’t clear by now, the mid-1980s was not a good time for Elton. In addition to the commercial failure of LEATHER JACKETS, Elton also had to have throat surgery due to nodules on his vocal cords and was dealing with false stories being spread by The Sun. On top of this, he was also still having issues with drugs. Elton could sense a change was needed and did make some changes. He ended up having a big auction where he sold off many of his old costumes and also sued The Sun for libel. While doing all of this, he recorded a new album called REG STRIKES BACK.

REG STRIKES BACK may be one of Elton’s least known records today, but it did do fairly well on the charts, which was definitely a step in the right direction following LEATHER JACKETS. Instead of Gus Dudgeon, Chris Thomas was brought back in for the producer role. Despite this, the REG STRIKES BACK lineup is actually made up of people from the LEATHER JACKETS era: Davey and Fred Mandel, Charlie Morgan on drums, David Paton on bass. So it is still somewhat of a technical sounding album, although it sounds much more professionally recorded than the two immediately preceding it. And also, there’s another aspect working in its favor: the backing vocals. At Chris Thomas’s insistence, Dee Murray and Nigel Olsson were brought back to provide backing vocals alongside Davey, so while it may not sound like a classic era album musically, it does from a backing vocal perspective. Is this enough to make a good album? Let’s dive in.

The first track is “Town of Plenty”. I really like this track; the main keyboard riff is catchy and even though the keyboard is the dominant instrument, you can still make out the guitars clearly enough. Elton is in much better vocal shape than he was a couple years earlier and it shows; there’s no more strain in his voice. It’s permanently deeper, but it seems like he adjusted to this style pretty quickly, and he comes across as really spirited on this song. Really good opener.

Next is one of the album’s singles, “A Word in Spanish”. I don’t like this track; it kind of has a “Nikita” vibe to it, in that it’s a generic sounding attempt to be a hit. In its defense, unlike “Nikita”, it does feel like they’re trying to make it a bit more distinct with their focus on Spanish influenced guitar playing. And also unlike “Nikita”, there’s nothing out of place like a distracting high pitched voice. But it’s still generic and doesn’t feel like it has a ton of emotion put into it; it does feel a bit like they’re just going through the motions on this one.

Track 3 is “Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters Part 2”. Yes, a sequel to the classic track from HONKY CHATEAU. Some people complain about this one being too much of a stylistic change from the original and not really connecting well. While I do prefer the original, I actually do quite enjoy this one too. It’s pretty jazzy, which is supported by a trumpet solo from Freddie Hubbard. The guitar and keyboard work are very spirited, and I like the nod to The Beatles’ “Drive My Car” with “Beep! Beep! Beep! Beep! Yeah!”. I supposed I can kind of understand the dislike given how great the original is, but I choose to view this on its own rather than as a continuation of a classic, and looking at it that way, it works perfectly well for me.

That’s then followed by the album’s lead single, “I Don’t Wanna Go On with You Like That”. This is another one that, like “Little Jeannie”, people seem to have forgotten how big of a hit this was for Elton. Here in the U.S., it was actually his highest charting solo single of the decade, peaking at number 2. Sure, it sounds very much like a product of its time; the drums sound like a drum machine, but it’s still super catchy. This was apparently the type of song that played a lot in dance clubs, and I can see that, as it has a very danceable quality to it. Elton’s keyboard work is really good on this, especially during the fade-out at the end. I like this one too.

Track 5 is a ballad, “Japanese Hands”. These are far from Bernie’s greatest lyrics, but they did still seem to inspire Elton musically in a good way. Mostly synth based with an occasional guitar effect thrown in, it stands out thanks to its surprising simplicity, which is something you don’t usually expect from a synth based song. To me, it works; the mostly laid back musical style is appreciated, especially when compared to the blandness of “A Word in Spanish”.

Then we have “Goodbye Marlon Brando”, which is a surprisingly guitar heavy track. This one pretty much amounts to Elton referencing various things in the music and film industries, which isn’t a bad thing, as long as you have a good beat and catchy music, and this one has both. It’s a fun little rocker. Also worth noting Elton’s reference to ROCKY V, as not only did there end up being a ROCKY V a couple years later, but Elton even recorded a song for it!

Next is “The Camera Never Lies”. Elton does some pretty cool piano work on this, but outside of that, the melody is a bit bland and the rest of the musicians don’t really stand out on this one. At the very least, it is uptempo, so it doesn’t drag, and if anything is mostly in one ear, out the other.

I used to think the same thing about the next track, “Heavy Traffic”, but I find this one’s actually grown on me. In addition to some really solid keyboard work, there also is a bit more of a focus on acoustic guitar throughout that gives it a more atmospheric  feeling. It’s a fun track, even if it’s not super memorable.

Track 9 is “Poor Cow”. It’s between this and “Town of Plenty” for my favorite song on the album. This song is super catchy, from the fast keyboard riff to the spirited drumming to the stellar backing vocals of Dee, Nigel and Davey. It tells a tragic story, but it knows it’s a tragic story; you’re clearly meant to feel sympathy for this character, and Bernie tells it that way. It’s a really interesting song, worth checking out.

The album closes with “Since God Invented Girls”. This is one that might seem a bit odd lyrically for Elton to be singing, but I actually do think that the chorus is pretty catchy, and it has the added benefit of not only Dee, Nigel and Davey, but also Bruce Johnston and Carl Wilson on backing vocals. The verses aren’t anything special, but it’s still a decent closing song.

As far as additional tracks go, the only B-side here was “Rope Around a Fool”, which is fine, but not super memorable. I would like to point out a track called “The Rumour”, a John-Taupin track from this era which was recorded by the late Olivia Newton-John. Elton even co-produced and sang backup on it. It actually is a type of track that feels like it would have been very at home on REG STRIKES BACK, given its uptempo and electronic nature. As long as it’s catchy, though, that’s all that matters, and this is a catchy track. It’s one of those tracks where you can tell there’s a lot of energy put into it and that reflects in the listening experience.

So yeah, that’s REG STRIKES BACK. Basically, the theme here seems to be “uptempo and electronic”, and I suppose I could see people considering that a negative, as that was what a lot of people were doing in the ‘80s and it doesn’t give it a distinct personality of its own. But I actually like most of the songs on the record and, given the context of Elton’s personal situation at the time, I think this was just the album he needed at this point in his life; a chance to just do fun music again, even if they aren’t necessarily masterpieces. And heck, he even got a really big hit out of it, so that’s another positive. One thing that does kind of bother me is the title. Yes, it was meant to be a “comeback”, but using the name “Reg” would seem to imply he’s going back to the old days before he legally changed his name, and that’s really not the case here. I actually think the next album should have been called REG STRIKES BACK, for reasons I’ll go into more once we get to that. As for the actual REG STRIKES BACK, I think it’s a good album; not great, and not flawless, but it’s definitely a step in the right direction and for that alone, I feel it does deserve a bit more love than it gets.

And with that, we say farewell to Dee Murray, as this was his final performance on an Elton recording before his death in 1992. He was a man who helped define the Elton sound, always brightening it up whether it was through his bass work or backing vocals. A very talented man who left us way too soon.
Title: Re: Elton John Album Discussion Thread
Post by: Umbrella Sam on March 04, 2023, 08:28:51 AM
We’re finally getting at least part of the Royal Festival Hall 1972 show released. So glad Elton is continuing with the Classic Era archival releases.