Topic: The Three Stooges 2000 Movie- How accurate is this?

[Larrys#1]

I finally finished binge watching my new Three Stooges blu-ray set and just finished it with that 2000 biography movie that’s on the last disc. I did find this a rather depressing movie to watch as it portrayed the stooges as having very difficult and sad lives. Having watched this movie my first time, here are a few interesting things noted in the film that I found rather interesting, and I’d appreciate if anyone would provide their two cents on these….

-First, Shemp originally left the stooges because he was terrified and felt threatened by Ted Healy.
-Second, Columbia underpaid the stooges and Moe was insistent about staying with Columbia instead of pushing for bigger and better things (like feature films) with a better salary.
-Third, the film portrays Besser as if he wasn’t accepted by Moe and Larry. Besser didn’t want to accept the slapstick comedy of the stooges and didn’t want to take any hits, and thus, Moe and Larry didn’t feel like Besser was a stooge and didn’t fit in. As such, he was sorta pushed away when Columbia ended their contract when they closed their shorts department.

How accurate do you think these three points are? First, I didn’t think Ted Healy was violently aggressive towards the stooges. Sure, I read that he was a jerk, but I didn’t know he violently threatened them. Second, I didn’t know Columbia was cheating the stooges out of the pay they deserve. And third, I thought Besser quit because his wife got sick. I didn’t think it had anything to do with the fact that Moe and Larry didn’t like him. In fact, I thought they all got along and I know Besser even said in an interview one time about how much he liked working with Moe and Larry.

What are your thoughts?

[Freddie Sanborn]

I’m surprised no one answered this yet. That movie is a work of fiction, repeating old, disproven “facts” about the Stooges and adding a few new misconceptions.

Obviously, Shemp didn’t love working for Healy, but to assume that he was terrified of Ted, and wet his bed over it, is ridiculous. I’m sure that Kearns’ new bio of Shemp will expound on the reasons for the split. It may be as simple as Shemp preferring to work as a single, something that proved successful.

The Stooge’s salary with Columbia was fair and in accordance with other two-reel comedians. They received $20K each, which in 1940 was equivalent to $450K each today. This for a few weeks work. By the mid ‘50’s they were receiving the same amount of money for a few days work. Their real money was made in personal appearances, which Columbia allowed them to do.

Joe B took as much abuse as Curly or Shemp, a fact that can be proved by simply looking at his films. After the Columbia contract ended, the Stooges were ready to tour, but Joe’s wife Ernie was sick and Joe didn’t want to leave her. Curly Joe DiRita joined the act, fit in perfectly (in Moe’s opinion), and Besser went on to a lucrative career on TV.

[Larrys#1]

Thanks. I figured this movie was messed up with its facts, especially when they showed Curly suffering a stroke during filming of the WRONG scene on "Half Wits Holiday." It happened during the pie fight scene, not at that first scene. Hence why he was missing entirely in that scene.

I've always wondered about Besser refusing to take slapsticks. It was evident in the first short "Hoofs and Goofs" where Moe didn't slap Besser once. But as time went on, he started taking more hits from Moe. I feel like it was something Besser was uncomfortable with at first, but later grew to accept it.

I actually didn't appreciate the film's portrayal of Moe. They made him seem like a jerk who put the stooges first over his family and friends. In my years reading about the stooges' life, I've never gotten that impression of Moe.

[NoahYoung]

The Stooge’s salary with Columbia was fair and in accordance with other two-reel comedians. They received $20K each, which in 1940 was equivalent to $450K each today. This for a few weeks work. By the mid ‘50’s they were receiving the same amount of money for a few days work. Their real money was made in personal appearances, which Columbia allowed them to do.

$20k for each Stooge per year, or $20k per short, divided by the 3 of them?

I read recently (don't ask me where) that Columbia always told Moe that shorts were on the way out any time he asked for more money, and didn't let him know how much money the shorts were actually making.

Those biopics, especially when made for TV, usually suck, like BUD AND LOU from 1978. STAN AND OLLIE was an exception since the performances were spot on, although they stretched the truth a bit.

I first saw the Stooges biopic roughly 5 years after it first aired. I do remember the scene where "Joe Besser" gets pissed when hit or something and walks off the set. On the A&C TV show he engaged in some slapstick with Lou Costello, although I don't remember any eye-pokes or slaps.

Perhaps the Stooges should have snatched up Bobby Barber instead!  Now he really endured some physical abuse on-screen (and was the butt of A&C's practical jokes off-screen to boot!)

[Larrys#1]

It's really hard to say who is better- Besser or DeRita. I appreciated Besser for trying to bring his own style of comedy to the team (which did not fit, IMHO), but I also didn't appreciate him trying to change things. He not only refused to take hits/slapsticks but also pushed Moe and Larry to groom their hairs nicely, which is why you see them with their hairs slicked back in a few shorts. DeRita accepted the stooges and took the slapsticks, but at the same time, really didn't bring his own flavor of comedy to the team. He pretty much just got the job done at a bare minimum, and I guess that was ok for Moe and Larry since they were older at the time and already agreed to tone things down anyway.

Shemp was the only one that had his own style of comedy that fit well will BOTH his solo career and the stooges.

[NoahYoung]

It's really hard to say who is better- Besser or DeRita.

DeRita was terrible. DeRita was terrible. DeRita was terrible. I think my opinion is clear.
Besser was mildy funny in the A&C Show, but his schtick wore thin for me. He didn't belong in the 3 Stooges. They should have gotten Bobby Barber instead.

[Freddie Sanborn]

Here’s a video montage of Besser taking his lumps. And slaps. https://youtu.be/Mc1tgVM_N08?si=xVH93n1SpU_NeOGR

[QuinceHead]

I've always wondered about Besser refusing to take slapsticks. It was evident in the first short "Hoofs and Goofs" where Moe didn't slap Besser once. But as time went on, he started taking more hits from Moe. I feel like it was something Besser was uncomfortable with at first, but later grew to accept it.

Joe Besser was initially leery of taking slaps and eye pokes when he joined the Stooges; I seem to remember a quote from him saying he thought one side of Larry’s face looked callused from all the slaps and smacks he’d taken from Moe over the decades!

However, as he worked more with Moe and Larry, Besser saw first-hand how Moe was able to deliver pain-free slaps and eye pokes, so he became more relaxed about his no-hitting policy.  If you watch some of the later Joe shorts, there are a few — and one in particular (one of the flying saucer shorts, I think) — where Joe really takes a barrage of physical abuse from Moe and he handles it gamely.

For duty and humanity,
JohnH aka QuinceHead

[Larrys#1]

DeRita was terrible. DeRita was terrible. DeRita was terrible. I think my opinion is clear.
Besser was mildy funny in the A&C Show, but his schtick wore thin for me. He didn't belong in the 3 Stooges. They should have gotten Bobby Barber instead.

I could be wrong, but sometimes I feel he was hired solely because he was willing to shave his head and look like Curly. So they were like, "Hey everyone, look! Curly's back!"

I've always wondered how Lou Costello would have been if he had worked with the stooges. I always thought he was a really funny guy that had a very similar talent to Curly. For example, look at the Oyster Stew gag that Curly was able to brilliantly pull off in "Dutiful But Dumb." I thought Moe failed to replicate that bit in "Shivering Sherlocks" but Costello does it brilliantly as well in his own way in "Here Come the Co-Eds."

But either way, this just goes to show that there are other funny guys out there that could've filled Curly's shoes. So why DeRita? Ugh!

[NoahYoung]

But either way, this just goes to show that there are other funny guys out there that could've filled Curly's shoes. So why DeRita? Ugh!

Right, but unfortunately Lou passed away in 1959, and I don't think he would have joined them anyway, since he was hell-bent on establishing a solo career, including some dramatic roles he did on TV.

Lou was more than just a funny guy -- he and Abbott were huge in the first half of the 40s, and literally saved Universal Studios from bankruptcy. At one point, I believe they were the highest paid actors in Hollywood.

When Moe tried to do the routine, I think it was just supposed to be an homage, and that people knew he was doing it as such. It was out-of-character for Moe.

I read somewhere that Moe felt that Lou stole alot from Curly. That's neither here nor there, and other than them both being short and stocky, to me there's not much similarity, despite them both doing the oyster stew gag, which was also done by Billy Bevan for Mack Sennet in WANDERING WILLIES in 1926. And who knows if that was actually the first time it made it to the screen.

At least DeRita didn't try to imitate Curly. He really didn't do anything in those movies. He was simply there so no one would call them The Two Stooges.

Back to Lou Costello, AFRICA SCREAMS could be considered as A&C MEET TWO STOOGES!
But Shemp had already worked with them in the early 40s, and of course Besser would join the first season cast of The A&C Show on TV.

[Larrys#1]

Right, but unfortunately Lou passed away in 1959, and I don't think he would have joined them anyway, since he was hell-bent on establishing a solo career, including some dramatic roles he did on TV.

Damn, that's unfortunate. And that's not too long after their last film "Dance With Me, Henry." I guess Curly and Shemp weren't the only ones that were struck with bad luck. The only difference is, A&C decided to retire shortly before Costello died. The stooges, on the other hand, decided to go on for too long, which is why it's always been an endless search for a third stooge. Moe and Larry were just very fortunate to maintain good health and be able to continue for as long as they did.

That said, I think Moe and Larry should have retired after Shemp's death. They've had over 20 years as stooges and by the end, they were just wasting time reusing footage anyway. It was disgraceful how much stock footage was reused towards the end of the Shemp era. If they had nothing fresh to present anymore (besides a talking horse, lol), why bother continuing?

[Freddie Sanborn]

I could be wrong, but sometimes I feel he was hired solely because he was willing to shave his head and look like Curly. So they were like, "Hey everyone, look! Curly's back!"

But either way, this just goes to show that there are other funny guys out there that could've filled Curly's shoes. So why DeRita? Ugh!

I’m sure it has been posted on this forum before, but DiRita’s brilliant doing the “Stand-In” skit with the Stooges on the Steve Allen Show. All those years in burlesque really paid off in front of live audiences. Unfortunately, this never translated to scripted film work. But fortunately for the Stooges, the money made from feature films paled in comparison to their personal appearances, where Joe D was presumably more in his element. And most importantly, Moe thought that DiRita was a good fit for the Stooges, so who are we to argue?

[NoahYoung]

Damn, that's unfortunate. And that's not too long after their last film "Dance With Me, Henry." I guess Curly and Shemp weren't the only ones that were struck with bad luck. The only difference is, A&C decided to retire shortly before Costello died.

The split up shortly after HENRY, so 1956/57. Lou died in 1959. Lou contined to work, as did Bud.

That said, I think Moe and Larry should have retired after Shemp's death. They've had over 20 years as stooges and by the end, they were just wasting time reusing footage anyway. It was disgraceful how much stock footage was reused towards the end of the Shemp era. If they had nothing fresh to present anymore (besides a talking horse, lol), why bother continuing?

To pay bills, taxes, keep a roof over their heads, send their kids/grandkids to college, etc. Can't do that without enough clams. Larry wound up in a Hollywood rest home despite all that. Moe didn't turn 65 until 1962, Larry not until 1967.

[NoahYoung]

I’m sure it has been posted on this forum before, but DiRita’s brilliant doing the “Stand-In” skit with the Stooges on the Steve Allen Show. All those years in burlesque really paid off in front of live audiences. Unfortunately, this never translated to scripted film work. But fortunately for the Stooges, the money made from feature films paled in comparison to their personal appearances, where Joe D was presumably more in his element. And most importantly, Moe thought that DiRita was a good fit for the Stooges, so who are we to argue?

If I were a fan, and the only way to see them in a live appearance was withDeRita, I'd rather have that then not seeing them in person at all. Those features with DeRita must have made money, so they continued to make them. Same as the L&H Fox features.

Actually, come to think of it, those live color sketches made to precede THE NEW 3 STOOGES cartoons weren't bad, and MUCH better than those lousy feature films they made.

[metaldams]

2000 was actually the year I rediscovered The Three Stooges after a break in my teen years.  That biopic I definitely watched at the time, but it was during the phase I was feverishly looking on this new Internet thing and researching things about the boys.  I was hardly in a position to guess what was true or not.  I just remember the long time fans being less than thrilled when it came out.

I don’t think I’ve watched it since.