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A personal grievance....

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Offline Shemp_Diesel

Here's where I tell Major League Baseball to go fuck itself and refuse to tune in, if the nitwits even try to piece together some sort of truncated season this year. I have officially lost all hope in what I used to call "the greatest game in the world."

 ::) >:(
Talbot's body is the perfect home for the Monster's brain, which I will add to and subtract from in my experiments.


Offline metaldams

I don’t know if I can ever tune out completely, but I understand your sentiment.  My interest in baseball, by my standards, has lessened these past few seasons.  I’ve been completely bored this off-season and this might turn into 1994 all over again.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline HomokHarcos

Watching and following sports used to be my main passion, but ever since COVID started and there were all these postponements, rule and format changes, and no attendance games I lost most of my interest. Starting a night job didn’t help either.

I don’t get why there are so many lockouts and strikes. The NHL cancelled a full season in 2004-2005 and most of the 2012-2013 season and the NBA had the lockout that stopped a lot of the 2011-2012 season. Now the MLB is in a lockout and cancelling games. The owners and players make so much money that they should never have to worry about money.


Offline Paul Pain

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Don't you know a minimum salary over 10 times what the average American makes isn't enough?  Never mind the ones making more money in a year than we will in a lifetime?  THEY NEED MORE MONEY.

Seriously, I understand the complaint about the minor league, but entropy does reign in this universe.  There's no free lunch, and the owners can't conjure money to pay those guys more out of nothing.  If the players genuinely cared about the game, they'd be willing to drop from $12,000,000 to $10,000,000 on the condition that that $2,000,000 goes to the minor leaguers.

Problem is that 99% of the players are just greedy b@$+@rds who blow money on booze, women, drugs, houses, cars, etc. the moment it's in their fingers.  The owners are just as bad and aren't willing to cut their own annual team salary from $20,000,000 to $19,000,000.  Same is true in all corporate environments.  It's the cancer of human greed that destroys any economy, whether it's run by capitalists, socialist, autocrats, or oligarchs.  The end result is the same: the top lives in excessive opulence, and the bottom is in squalor, and the situation could easily be rectified by humility from even just a fraction of the top.

End of rant. [rockon]
#1 fire kibitzer


Offline metaldams

The players and owners have a right to earn as much as they can and the fact they bring in more revenue than say, a guy who works customer service at a local community bank such as myself, means they should make more money.  Fair enough.

However, when it gets to the point where you’re diluting and delaying the product you’re presenting to the paying customer, perhaps both sides need to figure out how to resolve this with some compromise.  Whatever short term gains either side receives may bite them in the ass in the long run if the game itself gets delayed.  A good percentage of the fans aren’t going to put up with it and considering baseball already has less cultural relevance than any time I can remember in my lifetime, both sides may want to act quickly or this can turn into a long term disaster.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Shemp_Diesel

Well, all I can say is that after the last work stoppage, it took Cal Ripken's streak--and to a much greater degree--steroids and the artificial home run chase to bring fans back.

Who knows what it will take this time, because surely there will be a firestorm from this latest fiasco....
Talbot's body is the perfect home for the Monster's brain, which I will add to and subtract from in my experiments.


Offline metaldams

I think work stoppage or no work stoppage, baseball is in an extremely different place than it was in the 90’s.  The NFL and NBA by far have overtaken the game and there are less young kids into it than when we were young.  I don’t want to say final nail in the coffin, but what’s happening now can bring baseball closer and closer to soccer in the U.S.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Freddie Sanborn

Like a lot of people, I followed baseball because it was always there. Like a pair of comfortable old shoes. Now that it’s gone, I doubt I’ll miss it. And soccer is great, especially watching in a bar with like-minded fans.
“If it’s not comedy, I fall asleep.” Harpo Marx


Offline NoahYoung

Don't get me started -- I'm fed up, too. I vowed in 1994 never to buy a ticket to a baseball game again, and I haven't. I've been to one game since, but I was given the tickets by my boss. That was the first game at Shea Stadium (Game 3) of the 2000 World Series. Of course, that was the one game the Yankees lost -- I'm a Yankee fan. Worst seats possible -- I would have been better off watching on TV.  Left field upper deck, as far left a possible, maybe 5 or 6 rows from the top seats. We took the ferry from downtown Manhattan, so they got no revenue for parking from me. Yes, I had hot dogs and beer, but I'm not sure how much MLB gets from that revenue.

I get YES on cable for Yankee games, but it's part of a package. I just asked my wife if we are paying any extra to get YES, and she wasn't sure. I'm strongly considering a less expensive package that doesn't include YES. As fans, we need to make a statement. 

Can you change the topic's title? I skipped over this before -- I didn't know it was about baseball.

When I was a kid, we got around 100 games free on WPIX Channel 11. Add in a few games on NBC "Game of the Week" or ABC "Monday Night Baseball", and that was more than enough.
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline NoahYoung

Now that they've settled,  it is a moot point.
 [pie]
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline Shemp_Diesel

Maybe some fans will flock back--I'm sure a lot will--but myself, I really have no interest in the new season or the new date for opening day & having the DH in the National League just pisses me off. If I need a sports fix, I'll just stick with pro wrestling and the NBA for now....
Talbot's body is the perfect home for the Monster's brain, which I will add to and subtract from in my experiments.


Offline NoahYoung

Well, since they will be playing all 162, I have simmered down. But I still won't buy a ticket to a game. Knowing the cable company, if you try to get rid of something to lower your bill, they raise the price on one of the other services you're getting. That's why I still have an IP phone though I never use it.

Yes, they have some new rules. The DH in the NL was inevitable. It was only a matter of time. With inter-league play for almost a quarter of a century, the NL has been using the DH a lot anyway. And then there's the post-season.

I'm glad in a year or 2 there might be a limit on the defensive shift. I'm not a fan of the shift, but shame on the batters for not trying to hit it through the hole, or lay down a bunt. That's what Phil Rizzuto would have done.  :) I'm not sure how they can enforce it, though. It will open up a can of worms. At the end of the day, bringing the infield in, or the outfield in with less than 2 outs and a runner on third in the bottom of the 9th, is a sorta/kinda defensive "shift". I guess they will say the 3rd baseman and SS have to play to the left of 2nd base, and the 1st baseman and 2nd basemen have to play to the right. Are they allowed to back up onto the grass? See, it gets tricky. In any case, they won't be eliminating it -- just limiting it to x number of times per game -- sort of like the video replay challenge.

When I was playing on a local softball team about 10 years ago, I was up at bat, and the previous 2 times I hit a single right up the middle. So the catcher yells to the SS and 2nd baseman to cheat a little toward the middle. So I opened up my stance, and hit a hard grounder through the hole for a base hit.
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline Paul Pain

  • Moronika's resident meteorologist
  • Bunionhead
  • ******
  • The heartthrob of millions!
With universal DH, I see no reason why the league should not do like the NHL and NBA do and have geographically based divisions with the plays in an East/West format.

Northeast Division:
NY Mets
NY Yankees
Boston
Philadelphia
Toronto

Southeast Division:
Tampa
Miami
Atlanta
Baltimore
Washington

Midwest Division:
Cleveland
Cincinnati
Pittsburgh
Detroit
Chicago White Sox/Cubs

Central Division:
Chicago White Sox/Cubs
Minnesota
Milwaukee
St. Louis
Kansas City

Southwest Division:
Houston
Texas
Colorado
Arizona
San Diego

Pacific Division:
LA Dodgers
LA Angels
San Francisco
Oakland
Seattle
#1 fire kibitzer


Offline NoahYoung

For a while in the 80s, when they still had just East and West, they had a balanced schedule where you played each team in the league roughly the same amount of times. Now the East teams hardly play the West and Central teams. As a Yankee fan, I get tired of so many games against Toronto and Tampa Bay, etc. I wanna see them play Chicago and Kansas city, etc, a bit more.

I would go back to the balanced schedule and eliminate the divisions all together. To me, inter-league play has lost it's luster. Just pick the best teams in each league for post-season, and the AL/NL doesn't happen until the World Series. So I believe 12 teams will now make the post-season. I have no idea what the format will be.  I did read that all record-ties at the end of the season will be determined mathematically and there will be no tie-breaker games. It' getting way too confusing and too easy to make the playoffs.
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline metaldams

For a while in the 80s, when they still had just East and West, they had a balanced schedule where you played each team in the league roughly the same amount of times. Now the East teams hardly play the West and Central teams. As a Yankee fan, I get tired of so many games against Toronto and Tampa Bay, etc. I wanna see them play Chicago and Kansas city, etc, a bit more.

I would go back to the balanced schedule and eliminate the divisions all together. To me, inter-league play has lost it's luster. Just pick the best teams in each league for post-season, and the AL/NL doesn't happen until the World Series. So I believe 12 teams will now make the post-season. I have no idea what the format will be.  I did read that all record-ties at the end of the season will be determined mathematically and there will be no tie-breaker games. It' getting way too confusing and too easy to make the playoffs.

Agreed with everything you said.  I am not an Interleague play fan at all, but it’s also a cash cow so they won’t get rid of it, especially Yankees vs. Mets.  The whole 12 team playoff thing - again it’s money.  More teams, more interested fans, more games, yet it ruins the integrity of the game for me.  I too enjoyed the pre wildcard 1969 - 1993 era and there are even fans who wish to make no playoffs at all, just a World Series.  Hey, I get it.

I am thrilled about doing away with shifts starting in 2023.  I read since 2010, there’s an average of 40,000 more plays a year with shifts!  I understand shifting has always been a part of the game, modern analytics have made it overused where a hitter is expected to hit the other way every at bat versus in certain situations.  I’m looking forward to seeing third basemen play third base again and ground ball singles up the middle.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline HomokHarcos

12 teams does sound like too many teams. I know the other major sports leagues have more playoff teams, but their regular seasons are shorter.


Offline NoahYoung

I am thrilled about doing away with shifts starting in 2023.
Well, they still have to vote on it, and it will be limited, not eliminated, as I understand it. For example, just 3 (I don't know the number) defensive shifts per game. What happens in extra innings? To tell u the truth, I don't even know some of the current rules implemented in the last few years. There is some sort of limit to the number of trips to the mound. (It was always the 2nd trip in an inning required a pitching change.) And for replay challenges. They are thinking of going to robo-umps for ball/strike calls. Yuck. Why even have players then? I do like the rule about relief pitchers having to face 3 batters or til the end of the inning.

Back to 9 inning double headers, and no man on second starting each extra inning, for 2022. I never liked those rules, but obviously it was for the pandemic.

A lot of old-timers (.e.g. Goose Gossage, Tommy John) say they don't watch baseball anymore since it is unrecognizable.
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline NoahYoung

12 teams does sound like too many teams. I know the other major sports leagues have more playoff teams, but their regular seasons are shorter.

Yea, it might as well be softball. In our town's league, every team made the playoffs! Next in MLB, every player in the league will get a trophy, too.

I think, but am not sure, that they are eliminating the one-game sudden death round. You can't follow a marathon by a sprint, then move on to a semi-sprint.
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline NoahYoung

Well, they decided to go back to runner on second in extra innings. They said it is because spring training was so short. They did say that next year they go to a more balanced schedule, so we get to see more games against teams in the 2 other divisions.

I don't like this electronic gizmo to call pitches, though. What's next? Coordinates on the field, and you tell the fielder where to run to catch fly balls?


Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline Shemp_Diesel

This problem has been going on in MLB for years now & I believed I ranted about this during last year's postseason: the lack of great starting pitching these days or maybe the quick, trigger fingers most managers seem to have & relievers getting warmed up in the 3rd or 4th inning of games--I tried watching a few games already this year & the shit just turns me off.

Its an epidemic on the game now & the hot button topic of today was Kershaw getting pulled after pitching 7 perfect innings last night. I left a comment on Youtube saying could you imagine some of the greats of the past like Koufax, Gibson, Randy Johnson or Pedro getting yanked after going that deep into a game with history on the line.

Something definitely needs to be done to address this issue, more than anything else in baseball, imo....
Talbot's body is the perfect home for the Monster's brain, which I will add to and subtract from in my experiments.


Offline metaldams

Reggie Jackson made a tweet yesterday complaining about the Kershaw thing - and I agree with him.

7 perfect innings, 80 pitches, 7 run lead and they yank him?  I then read, as a contrast, in July 1974 Nolan Ryan had a game where he threw 235 pitches against the Red Sox.  He made his next start on three days rest and won.  He pitched another nineteen years.  I think it’s the way they’re bringing these guys up, surely man is capable of going more than 100 pitches.

All I know is the Kershaw situation yesterday is a glaring example of what’s wrong with the modern game.  I complain about the Red Sox not having deep starting pitching depth but the more I think about it, it’s not needed the way the game currently is and it sucks.  I remember when people complained ten to fifteen years ago only going seven innings made an ace.  I’d kill for those seven inning pitchers compared to what we have now.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline NoahYoung

I hadn't heard about Kershaw. Did he tow the company line and say he didn't mind or was he pissed publicly?
They say "wins" don't matter for a pitcher, statistically speaking, but the last time I checked, the object of the game is to win. Doesn't matter if it is 2-1 or 19-3.

For all the analytics people out there, this is what I have to say to you: Analyze this!

I'm going back 10+ years, but the Yankees babied Jaba Chamberlain -- they had "Jaba rules", and now he's just a footnote in Yankees history.

I'm trying to watch the Yankee game right now and I'm bored to tears. They aren't hitting. I don't need sabremetrics to tell me that. Why do we need more than batting average, HR, RBI, slugging, and OBP? Your job at the plate is to get on base, preferably with a hit, and drive in runners, or at least move them over. The latter is the only thing that doesn't turn up in traditional stats unless it's a sacrifice, in which case you are not charged with an AB.

Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline Shemp_Diesel

In the clip I watched on YouTube, Kershaw basically took the high road and said his manager made the right move by yanking him from the game...
Talbot's body is the perfect home for the Monster's brain, which I will add to and subtract from in my experiments.


Offline NoahYoung

And then went home and threw darts at his picture...
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz


Offline NoahYoung

AL East Standings:

Yankees: 1st
BoSox: 4th (3 GB)
Life is good!
 [bump]
Burt Lancaster was too short!
- The Birdman of Alcatraz