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John Ince... And His Brother

Guest · 9 · 1973

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Pilsner Panther

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"Today In Stooge History" takes note of the birthday of John Ince, who played Clayhammer (or as Curly calls him, "Sledgehammer") in "Termites of 1938." According to his credits on IMDB, he came from a theatrical family, and he seemed to enjoy playing bit parts like that, in dozens of films. His brother Thomas was a lot more famous in his prime, which didn't last very long:

http://www.themediadrome.com/content/articles/film_articles/thomas_ince_affair.htm

Given that it involves Charlie Chaplin, William Randolph Hearst, Marion Davies, and Louella Parsons, this is one of the most fascinating unsolved murder cases in Hollywood history. Definitely a good read, if nothing else— and you can draw your own conclusions as to what really happened. Since everyone who was on board that yacht is long dead, we'll probably never know.

 ???


Offline Dunrobin

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That's a fascinating story, Pils.  I'd never heard of that particular "Hollywood mystery" before. 

Quote
D.W. Griffith always said: "All you have to do to make Hearst turn white as a ghost is mention Ince's name. There's plenty wrong there, but Hearst is too big."
The rich and powerful have been able to get away with just about anything.  :-\


Pilsner Panther

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That's a fascinating story, Pils.  I'd never heard of that particular "Hollywood mystery" before. 

Quote
D.W. Griffith always said: "All you have to do to make Hearst turn white as a ghost is mention Ince's name. There's plenty wrong there, but Hearst is too big."
The rich and powerful have been able to get away with just about anything.  :-\

Why, that's ridiculous! How could you say such a thing?

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/tedkennedychappaquiddick.htm

 ;)


Offline FineBari3

NO WAY!!!!!! I just watched that short TODAY!

Wow, I can't believe I never heard that Tom Ince's bro was in that short!!!!

Yup.....Hearst did it!
Mar-Jean Zamperini
"Moe is their leader." -Homer Simpson


Pilsner Panther

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NO WAY!!!!!! I just watched that short TODAY!

Wow, I can't believe I never heard that Tom Ince's bro was in that short!!!!

Yup.....Hearst did it!


You never know what you'll learn here! I favor the stray bullet theory, myself; someone was fooling around with a gun, it went off, and the bullet hit Ince. Hearst was a major s.o.b., but people who knew him said that he was personally gentle and it wasn't in his nature to commit a murder; if you were part of his inner circle he could be very nice, and his favorite activities were throwing lavish parties and going on big picnics with 20 or 30 of his friends. It would have been more likely that he'd have hired a gunman to have Ince hit if he wanted him out of the picture for whatever reason, and not when Hearst himself was anywhere in the vicinity. Either that, or he could have pulled strings with the government to have the guy sent out of the country, like he did with Orson Welles after "Citizen Kane" came out.

Of course, Charlie Chaplin was a notorious womanizer, which might have been motivation enough for Hearst to want him dead, if he was really hitting on Marion Davies. But that doesn't quite add up, either— since like Errol Flynn later on, Charlie liked 'em young and tender... that is, under 20. Besides, would this immensely famous man (the most recognized face in the world at the time) have been stupid enough to risk it all by angering The Chief, when he could have had literally any other woman he wanted, but just not Marion Davies?

If it was an accident, it's highly ironic that Ince had missed the boat, and he raced to catch it at its next port of call. That's sort of like what happened to a friend of mine who was killed on 9/11. She was a flight attendant on the second plane that hit the towers, and the only reason she was on that plane was because she'd traded shifts with a co-worker who wanted the day off (they're always doing that; my ex was flight attendant, so I know the lifestyle very well).

The moral of both stories is that sometimes you're simply in the wrong place at the wrong time, and there's not a thing you can do about it.

 :(
« Last Edit: August 30, 2005, 11:34:52 PM by Pilsner Panther »


Jimmie Adams

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My favorite Hearst story is that Hearst would refer to Marion Davies clitoris as "ROSEBUD" , even among the guests at San Simian.  Orson Wells found this out and named the mysterious thing in CITIZEN KANE as ROSEBUD because he was made aware of Heart's spies efforts to infiltrate the set and cause sabotage.  When Hearst's spies reported back to Hearst that the Kane/Hearst character keeps refering to a ROSEBUD, Hearst literally had a stroke.  Hearst even tried to set up Wells with some underage girls in a hotel room with the press and the cops in the next room.

I tend to believe this, because why would anybody name a sled ROSEBUD?  It wasn't made of rosewood, it didn't sail down a hill like a rosebud.  Wells knew what he was doing.  


Pilsner Panther

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Jimmie, "San Simian" is a typo, but I like the image it conjures up!

 ;D

http://www.hearstcastle.com/

I've come across that story about what "Rosebud" is supposed to represent, but I forget where. I'll have to poke around on the web and see if I can find any references to it. As to why the sled would have that name, maunfacturers back then (19th and early 20th centuries) used to pick all sorts of colorful names for their products, so "Rosebud" for a sled is perfectly plausible. The names didn't necessarily have anything to do with the product.

After "Kane" was released, Hearst used his influence with the U.S. Government to get Welles shipped out of the country on the pretext that he'd be making a "goodwill tour" of South America.

Things have changed since then— nowadays, the mass media barons don't tell the government what to do, it's just the reverse!
« Last Edit: September 19, 2005, 12:47:37 AM by Pilsner Panther »


Jimmie Adams

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I wrote "San Simian" on purpose.  Hearst was one of the biggest factors that destroyed Roscoe Arbuckle, just for the sake of making a couple extra million. 


ROSEBUD !

« Last Edit: September 19, 2005, 02:37:24 AM by Jimmie Adams »


Offline FineBari3

I wrote "San Simian" on purpose.  Hearst was one of the biggest factors that destroyed Roscoe Arbuckle, just for the sake of making a couple extra million. 


ROSEBUD !



I was wondering if you meant to mispell that!

Have any of you knuckleheads seen 'RKO 281', the HBO movie made a couple of years ago about Wells' getting 'Citizen Kane' made. If you dont know the story of how this fantastic film came about, this is a really good movie to watch.

I'm sure some poetic license has been taken, but it shows what a prick Hearst could be. BTW, the actor that plays Hearst, James Cromwell, is brilliant!
Mar-Jean Zamperini
"Moe is their leader." -Homer Simpson