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The Battle of the Century (1927) - Laurel and Hardy

metaldams · 63 · 19836

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Offline CurlyFan1934

Hi CurlyFan1934!

Frankly, I'm surprised that nobody connected with the Sons Of The Desert have had this done, as it's my understanding the 16mm option is far more doable rights wise.  The only possibility I can readily think of is the asking price may be too high, but who knows?

In any event, I'm sorry to hear about your disappointment, along with anyone other attendees who may have had high hopes of viewing the complete Reel 2.  At this stage, there should be no good reason this shouldn't be accessible to Sons of The Desert meetings, yet sadly, this seems to be the case!  Furthermore, based on what I've read regarding ownership of the Film itself vs who has the Home Video release rights, I'm even less optimistic this will see DVD / Blu-ray / Digital Download release any time soon, if ever, such is the sad state of getting never before released versions of Hal Roach Films to Home Video today!  Just check out Dave Lord Heath's Another Nice Forum page under my heading for The Battle Of The Century quagmire, and you'll get a better idea of the extremely frustrating ridiculousness of the situation!  It's no wonder Richard W. Bann doesn't deal with this crap anymore!  After everything he had to deal with in getting LAUREL & HARDY: THE ESSENTIAL COLLECTION titles released in the U.S, I think he simply decided he had enough, at least that's the impression I got!  Believe me, I would LOVE to be WRONG about all of this!

Sorry to unload like this, but this is my current take regarding the above.  Your views might differ.

Kind Regards,

Tony

To my understanding, I think other Sons of the Desert tents have been able to view The Battle of the Century, namely the Hollywood Party tent in California. They had a "Battle of the Century" night where they celebrated. It's strange that the Night Owls tent can't access the print as they could. But then again the asking price may have been high and maybe California could've been able to pay for it, while the good ol' Night Owls tent couldn't? I don't know. It's confusing me.

Isn't there still a Hal Roach Studios somewhere out there? Like, isn't there a Hal Roach Studios that sells DVDs? Because if there was, this whole legal rights thing would be put to a end because Hal Roach Studios would probably have to be the sole owner of the film itself because after all they did make it. Unless Hal Roach Studios made some sort of business acquisition with a company that I'm not aware of, they still exist.

At this point, I'll settle for a VHS of Reel 2 of Century. Just slap on Big Business or Two Tars or You're Darn' Tooting or whichever L&H silent makes people happy, and boom, you've got an instant DVD release. About your comment on Bann, he shouldn't deal with this crap. He worked way too hard to get the Essential Collection released here in the U.S., and that collection is freaking awesome. I don't care what anybody says.

Now, listen, at the end of the day, this is 5 minutes of footage. That may sound strange to non L&H fans that we are so upset over 5 minutes of footage. But, it's not just 5 minutes of footage. It's 5 minutes of cinematic gold. The guy that found the footage should just upload the reel on YouTube, for crying out loud. Of course, it'll get taken down after a few days, but, hey, that's better than nothing!


Offline metaldams

Tony, I hear ya!

All this talk makes me think how lucky Stooge fans are.  No major footage lost, all the films beautifully restored and easily available, always have been.  The Stooge fan in me is fortunately spoiled, and the few crumbs hard to come by are likely cameo footnotes.

Laurel and Hardy?  Prints have varying quality, a major early film like HATS OFF is lost (imagine not having MEN IN BLACK), this whole fiasco with the BATTLE OF THE CENTURY, and it took years for the films to be properly released.

Buster Keaton has missing footage in THE FROZEN NORTH and I've always wondered if I'll ever see a version of THE BOAT where some of the frames aren't literally deteriorating. 

If any Stooge fan is reading this who is not into many other older comedians we are talking about, realize you are truly blessed.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Tony Bensley

Tony, I hear ya!

All this talk makes me think how lucky Stooge fans are.  No major footage lost, all the films beautifully restored and easily available, always have been.  The Stooge fan in me is fortunately spoiled, and the few crumbs hard to come by are likely cameo footnotes.

Laurel and Hardy?  Prints have varying quality, a major early film like HATS OFF is lost (imagine not having MEN IN BLACK), this whole fiasco with the BATTLE OF THE CENTURY, and it took years for the films to be properly released.

Buster Keaton has missing footage in THE FROZEN NORTH and I've always wondered if I'll ever see a version of THE BOAT where some of the frames aren't literally deteriorating. 

If any Stooge fan is reading this who is not into many other older comedians we are talking about, realize you are truly blessed.
I for one, am glad all of the Stooges Starring / Co-starring vehicles are extant!

if only every newly found Film, such as HELLO POP! (1933), was released in a reasonably timely fashion (IE. Under 12 months!), instead of the real life lunacy surrounding Laurel & Hardy / Hal Roach found footage!  No matter how justified, the seemingly continuous tug of war between "X company (Who has the Home Video rights!) try to claim actual Film ownership" vs "But I OWN the Film (Who can only release on non Home Video viable 16mm Film Stock!) and you can't have it!" type nonsense just leaves me cold!  Can't these people EVER get their $#!? together and release this new found footage in a reasonably timely fashion?

It's been 15 months and counting, and apparently STILL not even a 16mm print struck of THE BATTLE OF THE CENTURY (1927) Complete Reel 2, let alone ANY kind of Home Video release on the Horizon ANYWHERE!

Oh, and regarding the status of certain "lost" Hal Roach Films, don't take that to the bank, either!  There's at least ONE out there, and that's from a source I consider most reliable!  Unfortunately, to get this title, he's had to agree to keeping the utmost secrecy!  No screenshots, no reviews, NOTHING!

Let me make myself clear in stating that if a Film is rightly considered lost, it's lost.  However, what I can't stand are people who knowingly hold prints of Films that otherwise don't "exist" and either refuse to release them, or hold them at such a high ransom, NOBODY can afford to buy them!  What really bothers me though, is when these people pass on, their "Rare Treasures" are liable to disappear forever, for real!  :(





Offline CurlyFan1934

I for one, am glad all of the Stooges Starring / Co-starring vehicles are extant!

if only every newly found Film, such as HELLO POP! (1933), was released in a reasonably timely fashion (IE. Under 12 months!), instead of the real life lunacy surrounding Laurel & Hardy / Hal Roach found footage!  No matter how justified, the seemingly continuous tug of war between "X company (Who has the Home Video rights!) try to claim actual Film ownership" vs "But I OWN the Film (Who can only release on non Home Video viable 16mm Film Stock!) and you can't have it!" type nonsense just leaves me cold!  Can't these people EVER get their $#!? together and release this new found footage in a reasonably timely fashion?

It's been 15 months and counting, and apparently STILL not even a 16mm print struck of THE BATTLE OF THE CENTURY (1927) Complete Reel 2, let alone ANY kind of Home Video release on the Horizon ANYWHERE!

Oh, and regarding the status of certain "lost" Hal Roach Films, don't take that to the bank, either!  There's at least ONE out there, and that's from a source I consider most reliable!  Unfortunately, to get this title, he's had to agree to keeping the utmost secrecy!  No screenshots, no reviews, NOTHING!

Let me make myself clear in stating that if a Film is rightly considered lost, it's lost.  However, what I can't stand are people who knowingly hold prints of Films that otherwise don't "exist" and either refuse to release them, or hold them at such a high ransom, NOBODY can afford to buy them!  What really bothers me though, is when these people pass on, their "Rare Treasures" are liable to disappear forever, for real!  :(

I think I know you're talking about Lord Heath when you say that.  He says that it is a film for 1927 made by Hal Roach but not an Our Gang short. It can't be Hats Off, can it be?


Offline Tony Bensley

I think I know you're talking about Lord Heath when you say that.  He says that it is a film for 1927 made by Hal Roach but not an Our Gang short. It can't be Hats Off, can it be?
Dave Lord Heath literally can't say it (Which I completely understand and respect!), but I sure as heck can suspect it!

What it boils down to is what other Hal Roach Non 'Our Gang' Films from 1927 are still officially considered lost?  Understand, it IS considered ENTIRELY lost, which eliminates any Films in which one or more fragments are known to survive!

The last time I checked, HATS OFF (1927) qualifies on ALL counts!

Just for fun, I'm thinking it may be time to consult Lord Heath's newly assembled Hal Roach Film Catalogue listing for the 1927 titles, eliminating the 'Our Gang' comedies first, of course!

CHEERS!  [pie]


Offline metaldams

Assuming HATS OFF is really out there, I imagine said person must be holding out for a king's ransom.  I wonder if this alleged person would respond to a crowd funding effort from fans to get this film off his/her hands.  I know of a certain guy who reviews Stooge films and even Laurel and Hardy and Marx Brothers films and is known as someone who likes loud music who'd contribute a nice sum, if not the entire ransom, of money to said effort if he truly believed this film existed and was salvageable.  I can't say who this alleged person is, but you can guess, of course.  [pie]
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline CurlyFan1934

Dave Lord Heath literally can't say it (Which I completely understand and respect!), but I sure as heck can suspect it!

What it boils down to is what other Hal Roach Non 'Our Gang' Films from 1927 are still officially considered lost?  Understand, it IS considered ENTIRELY lost, which eliminates any Films in which one or more fragments are known to survive!

The last time I checked, HATS OFF (1927) qualifies on ALL counts!

Just for fun, I'm thinking it may be time to consult Lord Heath's newly assembled Hal Roach Film Catalogue listing for the 1927 titles, eliminating the 'Our Gang' comedies first, of course!

CHEERS!  [pie]
I may try that, but not sure looking through 1,200 Hal Roach comedies is very efficient.  [pie]


Offline CurlyFan1934

Assuming HATS OFF is really out there, I imagine said person must be holding out for a king's ransom.  I wonder if this alleged person would respond to a crowd funding effort from fans to get this film off his/her hands.  I know of a certain guy who reviews Stooge films and even Laurel and Hardy and Marx Brothers films and is known as someone who likes loud music who'd contribute a nice sum, if not the entire ransom, of money to said effort if he truly believed this film existed and was salvageable.  I can't say who this alleged person is, but you can guess, of course.  [pie]
Of course, assuming that Dave Lord Heath has HATS OFF is certainly a far-fetched theory but hey it could be possible. I can't seem to find many Hal Roach films from 1927, let alone ones that are lost, so Hats Off may be a possibility.


Offline metaldams

I'm 100% serious with my post, by the way, concerning a crowd funding effort, and yes, I'd contribute, nicely, if I truly believed this film could be saved.  I'd need proof, of course.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Big Chief Apumtagribonitz

There was a huge show at MOMA in NYC a couple of months ago whose centerpiece was the completely restored Battle Of The Century.  I have some friends who played in the orchestra.  This was a very big deal.  Now, what print, prints, stills, whatever, did they use for that?


Offline Umbrella Sam

  • Toastmaster General
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Well, seeing as how the full short is still not available, I'm going to have to review the incomplete print. Regarding the boxing match, it is really well done. What I love about it is just how angry the referee gets with Laurel. Laurel's inability to stand in a neutral corner results in them basically fighting it out themselves, and when Laurel gets knocked out, the referee begins counting by 2's. A similar gag would appear in Abbott and Costello's BUCK PRIVATES, although I'll admit I prefer the referee's response in that ("I don't like those numbers; they're odd").

From what I can see of the pie fight, it looks like it was also great as well. This is harder to judge, considering that it's more fragmented, but it seems to build up very well and I enjoy what is available to watch. If the rest of the short is as good as what I have seen so far, then I cannot wait for the day that they (hopefully) make the entire short available.

Judging from what exists, I'd give it a 10 out of 10
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline CurlyFan1934

So, it has been quite a while since The Battle of the Century's second reel was announced...2 1/2 years, to be exact. Has anybody else on the forum seen this movie yet or heard anything about a release or any updates at all? Myself, I have been wanting to get my hands on the second reel for quite some time and nothing yet. Also, any word on this mystery man who seems to have Hats Off (or any other lost Hal Roach 1927 movie) in their possession?


Offline Umbrella Sam

  • Toastmaster General
  • Knothead
  • *****
    • Talk About Cinema
So, it has been quite a while since The Battle of the Century's second reel was announced...2 1/2 years, to be exact. Has anybody else on the forum seen this movie yet or heard anything about a release or any updates at all? Myself, I have been wanting to get my hands on the second reel for quite some time and nothing yet. Also, any word on this mystery man who seems to have Hats Off (or any other lost Hal Roach 1927 movie) in their possession?

Regarding BATTLE OF THE CENTURY, I heard that they showed it at some film festivals, but beyond that I haven't heard anything.
“I’ll take a milkshake...with sour milk!” -Shemp (Punchy Cowpunchers, 1950)

My blog: https://talk-about-cinema.blogspot.com


Offline Tony Bensley

This German upload, which includes all of Reel 2, is still up on YouTube.  This is from a January 2019, European TV Broadcast (Titled Dick & Doof, Die Schlacht Des Jahrhunderts, 1927):

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iCl3r-7c25A

STILL no legitimate home video release in the offing, as yet, far as I'm aware.  Just periodic "Stay tuned" Facebook posts by Richard Bann that haven't yet lead to anything concrete, and a recently scheduled release that had to be cancelled due to lack of proper release rights issues. Sigh!


Offline metaldams

This German upload, which includes all of Reel 2, is still up on YouTube.  This is from a January 2019, European TV Broadcast (Titled Dick & Doof, Die Schlacht Des Jahrhunderts, 1927):

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iCl3r-7c25A

STILL no legitimate home video release in the offing, as yet, far as I'm aware.  Just periodic "Stay tuned" Facebook posts by Richard Bann that haven't yet lead to anything concrete, and a recently scheduled release that had to be cancelled due to lack of proper release rights issues. Sigh!

Thanks so much for sharing this, it completely made my day.  The new footage is fantastic, though I gotta wonder how much knowing the talking voices contributes.  I know darn well what Charlie Hall sounds like berating Ollie and Stan crying after that bump on the head as well - which I got a great laugh out of.

That footage is priceless and I'm glad it was found.
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline Tony Bensley

Thanks so much for sharing this, it completely made my day.  The new footage is fantastic, though I gotta wonder how much knowing the talking voices contributes.  I know darn well what Charlie Hall sounds like berating Ollie and Stan crying after that bump on the head as well - which I got a great laugh out of.

That footage is priceless and I'm glad it was found.
It really does flesh out the pie fight.  Now, if the remaining Reel One footage could be found!  That bump on Stan's head is an interesting unearthed gag that was never repeated on him, as Ollie eventually became the almost exclusive recipient of such physical (comic) brutality.

CHEERS!  [pie]


Offline Tony Bensley

Covering the still missing BOTC filmic gags, at least we have an end visual of the sprayed ink in Oliver Hardy's face, a gag which they repeated in later films.  I believe his subsequent tripping over the Victrola was probably similar to a gag that involved Jimmy Finlayson in a later Laurel and Hardy silent, although just which one it is oddly eludes my memory at the moment!

CHEERS!  [pie]

EDIT:  The missing Victrola gag is repeated in LIBERTY (1929) a bit past the 6:30 mark: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KmlBqIp_Kxo


Offline Dr. Mabuse

Laurel and Hardy's "The Battle of the Century" (1927) remains a classic short for its spectacular pie fight — finally available on DVD/Blu-ray in its entirety. Thanks to the efforts of silent-film preservationist Robert Youngson and archivist Jon Mirsalis, this legendary two-reeler has survived mostly intact. A must-see for anyone who appreciates movie comedy.

10/10

« Last Edit: February 26, 2024, 08:50:50 PM by Dr. Mabuse »


Offline Marshall

The restored Battle of the Century is part of the new L & H Blu-ray (and DVD) set, Laurel & Hardy: The Definitive Restorations. I had never seen the film before seeing it in this set. The pie fight scene is something to see, even after viewing the pie fights in Stooges films. The L & H Blu-ray consists of two feature films (Sons of the Desert and Way Out West) along with  17 shorts including The Music Box, Brats, Helpmates, The Midnight Patrol, and much more.  It also has eight hours of special features, including publicity and scene still photographs, posters from around the world advertising the movies in the set, contracts, scripts, and a lot more. If we ever get a Blu-ray collection of Three Stooges films, hopefully it would be similar to this release.

I have written a review/article on the new Laurel & Hardy: The Definitive Restorations Blu-ray set, which was published online a few days ago. Here's a link to the review/article:
https://hubpages.com/entertainment/Laurel-Hardy-The-Definite-Restorations-Blu-ray-Review

Marshall


Offline HomokHarcos

This is a film that I view as having three parts: the boxing match, the bit where Ollie tries to injure Stan for insurance, and the epic pie battle.

The boxing match is excellent and it is funny seeing Stan almost winning accidently, knocking down his victim only to break the rules by not standing in his corner. Boxing is great for comedy, and I think watching scripted boxing for entertainment is much more exciting than actual boxing. (Of course, that is why I'm a big fan of professional wrestling). Stan still ends up losing the fight, leaving Stan and Ollie needing money. Which leads to...

The insurance part. I think this scene is entertaining and funny on its own, with Ollie trying to injure Stan only for the efforts to fail. but it does seem cruel for Ollie. I know this is still early on their career where their characters aren't as well defined, but it seems more like something Moe would do to Curly, or Bud to Lou. Speaking of Lou Costello, he makes an appearance in the audience during the boxing match.

Then we get to the climatic pie fight. The Three Stooges had several pie fights in their career, but nothing reaching this peak. There are pies everywhere, with everybody from innocent bystanders like Anita Garvin to the cops getting in on the action. A lot of Laurel and Hardy's early films have a chaotic free-for-all ending that is often unrelated to the beginning. My theory is that they came up with an epic finish first, and then thought of the rest of the plot as a way to end up there. I wonder how long it took for them to make those pies and clean them up?


Offline Marshall

This is a film that I view as having three parts: the boxing match, the bit where Ollie tries to injure Stan for insurance, and the epic pie battle.

The boxing match is excellent and it is funny seeing Stan almost winning accidently, knocking down his victim only to break the rules by not standing in his corner. Boxing is great for comedy, and I think watching scripted boxing for entertainment is much more exciting than actual boxing. (Of course, that is why I'm a big fan of professional wrestling). Stan still ends up losing the fight, leaving Stan and Ollie needing money. Which leads to...

The insurance part. I think this scene is entertaining and funny on its own, with Ollie trying to injure Stan only for the efforts to fail. but it does seem cruel for Ollie. I know this is still early on their career where their characters aren't as well defined, but it seems more like something Moe would do to Curly, or Bud to Lou. Speaking of Lou Costello, he makes an appearance in the audience during the boxing match.

Then we get to the climatic pie fight. The Three Stooges had several pie fights in their career, but nothing reaching this peak. There are pies everywhere, with everybody from innocent bystanders like Anita Garvin to the cops getting in on the action. A lot of Laurel and Hardy's early films have a chaotic free-for-all ending that is often unrelated to the beginning. My theory is that they came up with an epic finish first, and then thought of the rest of the plot as a way to end up there. I wonder how long it took for them to make those pies and clean them up?

Your analysis about the film is spot on, HomokHarcos. Also, being a wrestling fan, you must like the Stooges short, Grips, Grunts, and Groans. I've always enjoyed that movie.  :)

Marshall


Offline HomokHarcos

Your analysis about the film is spot on, HomokHarcos. Also, being a wrestling fan, you must like the Stooges short, Grips, Grunts, and Groans. I've always enjoyed that movie.  :)

Marshall

Yes, I definitely liked Grips, Grunts and Groans. I like seeing pro wrestling references in mainstream media, especially from that time period where this not as much footage for pro wrestling. Contrary to popular belief, wrestling was already known to not be actual competition at this point. Here's a clip from Nothing Sacred featuring Frederic March and Carole Lombard (also from 1937) where it is discussed (and that wrestling match they are seeing happens to be pretty entertaining).



Offline metaldams

Yes, I definitely liked Grips, Grunts and Groans. I like seeing pro wrestling references in mainstream media, especially from that time period where this not as much footage for pro wrestling. Contrary to popular belief, wrestling was already known to not be actual competition at this point. Here's a clip from Nothing Sacred featuring Frederic March and Carole Lombard (also from 1937) where it is discussed (and that wrestling match they are seeing happens to be pretty entertaining).



I’m long overdue to watch NOTHING SACRED again, it’s been years.  Another example of wrestling admitted to being fixed, this time in 1950, second paragraph.

https://moronika.com/forums/index.php/topic,6633.0.html
- Doug Sarnecky


Offline HomokHarcos

I’m long overdue to watch NOTHING SACRED again, it’s been years.  Another example of wrestling admitted to being fixed, this time in 1950, second paragraph.

https://moronika.com/forums/index.php/topic,6633.0.html
Thanks! I think once I finish the Laurel and Hardy posts I'll move on to the Marx Brothers and Abbott and Costello.


Offline Samurai