Topic: Question about production numbers: VERY interesting observations, perhaps.

[metaldams]

OK, I was looking at the pages for the shorts on this site, and I was noticing the production numbers.  Common sense tells me this states the order in which the films were shot.  Now, I realize not every short was shot in the order it was released, however, if the production numbers state what I think they're saying, here are the first ten Shemp shorts, in order they were shot:

1. FIDDLER'S THREE 4070
2. FRIGHT NIGHT 4071
3. OUT WEST 4077
4. SQUAREHEADS OF THE ROUND TABLE 4082
5. HOLD THAT LION 4087
6. SING A SONG OF SIX PANTS 4088
7. HEAVENLY DAZE 4090
8. I'M A MONKEY'S UNCLE 4091
9. PARDON MY CLUTCH 4093
10. THE HOT SCOTS 4094

Perhaps somebody has the answer, but do production numbers state the order in which films were shot, or simply when, say, the script was presented?  If the former, and if the information on this site is correct (which I'm sure it is), FIDDLER'S THREE may be the first Shemp short ever shot.

[BeAStooge]

... do production numbers state the order in which films were shot, or simply when, say, the script was presented? 

Script... and even then, it can mean nothing. FIDDLERS THREE script is dated May 12, 1947.

[metaldams]

Script

I knew you'd have the answer!  Thanks Brent. 

[Rich Finegan]

It looks like the shooting dates for none of those shorts are given in the book "The Three Stooges Scrapbook". So here they are:

Fiddlers Three - filmed from May 26, 1947 to May 29, 1947.
Fright Night - filmed from June 5, 1946 to June 7, 1946.
Out West - filmed from July 8, 1946 to July 11, 1946.
Squareheads of the Round Table - filmed from December 9, 1946 to December 12, 1946.
Hold That Lion! - filmed from January 28, 1947 to January 31, 1947.
Sing a Song of Six Pants - filmed from April 1, 1947 to April 4, 1947.
Heavenly Daze - filmed from June 23, 1947 to June 26, 1947.
I'm a Monkey's Uncle - filmed from July 28, 1947 to July 31, 1947.
Pardon My Clutch - filmed from May 19, 1947 to May 21, 1947.
The Hot Scots - filmed from December 16, 1946 to December 19, 1946.

These dates can show us some interesting insights. For example we see that the two "castle set" shorts (Squareheads ... and The Hot Scots) were shot in two consecutive weeks, Monday through Thursday in December 1946. One might expect that Fiddlers Three would also have been filmed on those sets around the same time, but that one was shot five months later. By the way, the Columbia feature on whose castle sets these shorts were filmed, The Bandit of Sherwood Forest, was filmed from March 20, 1945 to May 21, 1945. So it was a year and a half later that the Stooges shorts were filmed on those sets. So any stories we may have heard that the castle sets were about to be torn down right after the feature was finished and The Stooges had to rush to get their castle footage shot quickly before the sets were torn down, just doesn't make sense.

Also interesting to note is that in Squareheads... when Larry makes his reference to the popular Columbia feature The Jolson Story, that movie was currently in release, having a release date of October 10, 1946 and still playing at least through January 1947, according to one Trade Paper release chart. But by the time the Squareheads... short was released on March 4, 1948 The Jolson Story was no longer current, and even though it had been a big hit, may not still have been playing anywhere, in case Larry's mention of the movie might have inspired anyone to go and see it.

More fun with shooting dates:
In piecing together the chronology of events at the period of the transition from Curly to Shemp, the Columbia short Pardon My Terror has a place. It has been reported that that short was intended originally for The Three Stooges, but was rewritten and given to the two-man team of Gus Schilling and Richard Lane when it became clear due to Curly's health situation that he would not be able to do it. So for the record, here is the Production Number and shooting dates for Pardon My Terror:
  4068 - Pardon My Terror - filmed from May 10, 1946 to May 14, 1946. Sure enough that is just a few days after Curly's final short Half-Wits Holiday was finished on May 6. And just one month later, on June 5 The Stooges are filming their first short with Shemp as the new member.

[metaldams]

Thanks again Rich.  I too find shooting dates tell us a lot about the Stooges working methods.

Like I mentioned in another thread, I'm convinced THREE DARK HORSES, which was released about two months after filming, was rushed into release (10/52) in time for the 1952 presidential election.

Also find it interesting how lots of the remakes were shot on back-to-back days.  Example:  LOOSE LOOT and BOOTY AND THE BEAST.

[Hammond Eggar]

Thanks for the wonderful info, Rich.  You're always a fountain of Stooges knowledge.  Thanks for letting all of us enjoy the benefits of your insight.

[Rich Finegan]

Thanks for the nice comments!

It has been interesting to look at the shooting dates and learn more about how the transition from Curly to Shemp happened. I thought that it might also be worth a look at the shooting dates of the nine solo Shemp Columbia shorts to see where they fit into this period, as the final entry in the series was actually released after Shemp re-joined The Stooges.

So here are the Production Numbers and shooting dates for the nine solo Shemp Howard Columbia shorts:

  4015 - Off Again, On Again - filmed early 1944. Exact dates not listed.
  4016 - Open Season For Saps -filmed early 1944. Exact dates not listed.
  4018 - Pick a Peck of Plumbers - filmed April 3, 1944 to April 6, 1944.
  4034 - Where the Pest Begins - filmed October 24, 1944 to October 27, 1944.
  4038 - A Hit With a Miss - filmed January 3, 1945 to January 9, 1945.
  4048 - Jiggers, My Wife! - filmed September 11, 1945 to September 14, 1945.
  4052 - Society Mugs - filmed August 30, 1945 to September 4, 1945.
  4054 - Mr. Noisy - filmed August 17, 1945 to August 21, 1945.
  4064 - Bride and Gloom - filmed February 20, 1946 to February 23, 1946.

This shows that Shemp finished his last solo short a little over three months before filming his first Three Stooges short, Fright Night, which was filmed from June 5, 1946 to June 7, 1946.