Topic: The 2008 Baseball Thread

[shemps#1]

Ok, to keep up to date:

Almost in:
Philadelphia Phillies: Magic number 3 (combination Phillies wins and Brewers losses) to clinch a playoff spot.
Los Angeles Dodgers: Magic number 3 (combination Dodgers wins and Diamondbacks losses) to clinch a playoff spot.

If the Rays are going to win the division (and it looks like they will) I would like for it to be sooner than later so we can align everything right for the ALDS against the Angels, making the Yankees series meaningless as we toss scrubs in there and rest the important guys (thusly rubbing salt in the wound).

[metaldams]

making the Yankees series meaningless as we toss scrubs in there and rest the important guys (thusly rubbing salt in the wound).

I propose Zink on Friday, Hansack on Saturday, and Pauley on Sunday. 

[Justin T]

I went ahead and added the Cards and Fish to the post Doug. St. Louis was eliminated yesterday. The Astros have an elimination number of 3, if the Reds hang on it will be down to 2. If the Pirates can hang on to beat the Brewers the Phillies will have a magic number of 2 to clinch a playoff spot.

The addition of Tampa and subtraction of the Yankees should make for an interesting post-season this year. It's gotta suck for Yanks fans: not only are they officially eliminated and the Red Sox in the playoffs this year but the Mets have a good chance of making the playoffs as well.

It does suck a bit that Boston and possibly the Mets will be in the playoffs and we won't. I don't like it, but we didn't play well this year between
injuries and just sucking on the field period. Cashman better do a good housecleaning this offseason. We have alot of dead weight veterans that
we need to get rid off, and the ones that still produce need to be willing to play for less money so we can go out and get Sabathia and anyone
else we can get our hands on.

It's going to be a interesting offseaon for the Yanks thats for sure.

Now that my Yankess are out, I'll be rooting for Tampa Bay and the Cubs to do well. Tampa earned my respect this year for playing hard
and they have earned their first playoff spot.

Either way, this postseason should be interesting.

[shemps#1]

To be honest Justin (and not that I want the Yankees to become contenders again) I don't think going out and getting more pricey free agents is the answer to their problems. They've been throwing money at their problems since they lost to the Diamondbacks in 2001 and it has got them nowhere. Looking at teams like Tampa and Boston I think the best route would be to build from within. It's cheaper and that's the way teamwork is truly built.

If I were playing Yankee GM the first thing I would do is let guys like I-Rod, Giambi, Pavano and Pettitte go to Free Agency outright. Those spots can go to up and comers who are hungry and have their minds set on becoming Yankees and getting their shot, not trying to milk the cash cow. I would also not sign Marte or Abreau. Marte has an ERA of 4.91 in New York, which is way too high for a set-up man. Some players just can't take the spotlight of the big market teams like the Yankees and Red Sox and he is one of them. Abreau's numbers certainly do not justify his contract...or even half of his contract. He is vastly overpaid and that spot would be better suited for a youngster coming up.

Mussina is a touchy subject. Yes, he's having a very good year and may win 20 games (especially if the Sox send in the scrubs on sunday) but he's going to be 40 years old and his skills are only going to decline. He would be nice in the rotation as a mentor (in a Tim Wakefield type role) but I would tell him he has to take a pay cut if he wants to remain in the Bronx. If he won't (which is probable considering he may finally hit the 20 win mark) then let him go.

I would also try to negotiate something with the teams not listed in Johnny Damon's partial no-trade clause to see if I could broker a deal to get rid of him. At $13 million a year he too is vastly overpaid...even if means eating some of that contract, just so I'd have another spot for a prospect to get his shot. You've got to remember those kids down in Scranton and other areas of the Yankees organization are probably getting frustrated because they are not getting their opportunity and you could very well have a future Hall of Famer down there. Meanwhile the MLB club keeps on picking up the big name free agents and making trade deals all because Steinbrenner is Yiddish for "Star Fucker".

Brian Cashman is a very good GM, but he has to be allowed to do his job.

[Justin T]

To be honest Justin (and not that I want the Yankees to become contenders again) I don't think going out and getting more pricey free agents is the answer to their problems. They've been throwing money at their problems since they lost to the Diamondbacks in 2001 and it has got them nowhere. Looking at teams like Tampa and Boston I think the best route would be to build from within. It's cheaper and that's the way teamwork is truly built.

If I were playing Yankee GM the first thing I would do is let guys like I-Rod, Giambi, Pavano and Pettitte go to Free Agency outright. Those spots can go to up and comers who are hungry and have their minds set on becoming Yankees and getting their shot, not trying to milk the cash cow. I would also not sign Marte or Abreau. Marte has an ERA of 4.91 in New York, which is way too high for a set-up man. Some players just can't take the spotlight of the big market teams like the Yankees and Red Sox and he is one of them. Abreau's numbers certainly do not justify his contract...or even half of his contract. He is vastly overpaid and that spot would be better suited for a youngster coming up.

Mussina is a touchy subject. Yes, he's having a very good year and may win 20 games (especially if the Sox send in the scrubs on sunday) but he's going to be 40 years old and his skills are only going to decline. He would be nice in the rotation as a mentor (in a Tim Wakefield type role) but I would tell him he has to take a pay cut if he wants to remain in the Bronx. If he won't (which is probable considering he may finally hit the 20 win mark) then let him go.

I would also try to negotiate something with the teams not listed in Johnny Damon's partial no-trade clause to see if I could broker a deal to get rid of him. At $13 million a year he too is vastly overpaid...even if means eating some of that contract, just so I'd have another spot for a prospect to get his shot. You've got to remember those kids down in Scranton and other areas of the Yankees organization are probably getting frustrated because they are not getting their opportunity and you could very well have a future Hall of Famer down there. Meanwhile the MLB club keeps on picking up the big name free agents and making trade deals all because Steinbrenner is Yiddish for "Star Fucker".

Brian Cashman is a very good GM, but he has to be allowed to do his job.

No, you are absolutly right. What I should have said was they need to spend the money the right way, as in get good young talent that's available
or a reliable veteran esp in pitching.

But yes, the best thing they can do is continue to build from within and work the farm system alot more. Thankfully the Steinbrenner's have listened to
Cashman a little in that regard. Young and talented guys like Joba, Cano and Melky came from the system and they need to continue to work it.
Not everyone is going to make an impact right away, hell some should head back down to work on their fundamentals esp Kennedy, I think Hughes may
be ok but they still have problems that need to be worked out.

They definatly need to do what you said about some of the veterans, some can still produce but they should not be eating up payroll as a result. Paycuts
have to happen here and if their not willing to take the cut, then you dump em or trade em away.

I dont want I-Rod, Giambi, Pavano or Pettite to stay because they cant produce as well as they used to and keeping them around for alot of money
is just a bad idea. I would keep Abreu if he is willing to take a paycut, same with Damon. Johnny may not be great but he was very good from the leadoff
position this season when he wasn't injured.

Mussina is going to be tricky, yeah he was awesome this year but how much longer can it last? I also hope he would be willing to stay for less pay.

I'm glad you agree Brian Cashman is a good GM, I really like him. He's done alot of good things for the club but the Steinbrenner's have tied his hands
in certain places and that needs to stop, they have to let him do what he has to do in order to rebuild this team. They did that with the farm system
and now they have to let him deal with the veterans the right way.

I'll be following the offseason very closely to see what happens. Your very honest assesment of their situation was most welcome.

[metaldams]

The Yankees organization needs to exercise patience and have the brains to take a step backwards to move forward.  You need a balance of strong veterans and young kids, and with the latter, you have to give them time. 

Look at Jon Lester.  Until May of this year, he was a five inning pitcher who walked too many guys, and has since turned into a no-hitting ace capable of shutting out the Yankees.  The point is Boston was smart enough to exercise patience and not trade him for Johan Santana.  Perhaps the same patience will pay off for Phil Hughes, he's young yet and certainly does not deserve to be booed off the mound.

As for Joba, he already has the stuff to get major league hitters out, but the Yankees, in their win now mentality, are shuffling him back from the rotation to the pen to meet their current needs, long-term health be damned.  The Yanks definitely need to make a decision this off-season what Joba's role will be so he can develop a proper training routine and not have to retire at 24.  The Red Sox had a similar situation with Papelbon, made up their minds one way, and have a strict regiment in monitoring his health.  Paps has worked out pretty well for Boston. A similar approach to Joba would be wise.

[shemps#1]

In my humble opinion the most important position in baseball is that of catcher. Not only does your catcher have to catch the pitches he has to know the strengths and weaknesses of the pitchers he's catching and of the opposing batters so he can call the game properly. A catcher's hitting stats are almost not relevant, such as the case with Jason Varitek, who despite having a down offensive year was selected by the players to the All-Star Game. Jason Kendall is a catcher who has never really been much with a bat but due to his intangibles is considered one of the top 5 catchers in baseball.

Right up there with Varitek and Kendall is Jorge Posada. I read somewhere where he said that Joba Chamberlain should be kept in the bullpen and out of the rotation. If I'm Cashman and the Steinbrenner "brain trust" (oxymoron) I would listen to the man because knowing pitchers is main job. If Varitek said a certain pitcher was better suited to be a set-up guy, closer, or middle bullpen guy rather than a starter I'll bet dollars to donuts Theo Epstein and the Henry Group would damn well listen to him.

[shemps#1]

I propose Zink on Friday, Hansack on Saturday, and Pauley on Sunday. 

I've dreamed up a couple of scenarios for the Yankees series that I would absolutely get a kick out of and would do if I were in a position to do so (keeping in mind that Tampa has the division wrapped up by then and we know we are starting the ALDS in Anaheim).

1.  For those three games we send the entire Red Sox roster down to Pawtucket and bring Paw Sox up to play the Yankees.

2. We have the starters start each of those games and play 1-3 innings. Terry Francona is sitting in an Emperor's chair with those guys who play those long trumpet instruments on either side of him. When the time comes (before the start of the 2nd or whatever) the trumpet guys play and Tito bellows "BRING IN THE SCRUBS!" into a megaphone as Papi, Beckett, Tek, Wakefield, Youk et. al. go back to the dugout where scantily clad maidens hand-feed them grapes for the rest of the game.

In both scenarios the 2008 ALDS logo is already painted on the field to further rub it in. Perhaps it's a good thing that I am not running a baseball team.

[metaldams]

I've dreamed up a couple of scenarios for the Yankees series that I would absolutely get a kick out of and would do if I were in a position to do so (keeping in mind that Tampa has the division wrapped up by then and we know we are starting the ALDS in Anaheim).

1.  For those three games we send the entire Red Sox roster down to Pawtucket and bring Paw Sox up to play the Yankees.

2. We have the starters start each of those games and play 1-3 innings. Terry Francona is sitting in an Emperor's chair with those guys who play those long trumpet instruments on either side of him. When the time comes (before the start of the 2nd or whatever) the trumpet guys play and Tito bellows "BRING IN THE SCRUBS!" into a megaphone as Papi, Beckett, Tek, Wakefield, Youk et. al. go back to the dugout where scantily clad maidens hand-feed them grapes for the rest of the game.

In both scenarios the 2008 ALDS logo is already painted on the field to further rub it in. Perhaps it's a good thing that I am not running a baseball team.

I say let Johnny Pesky play short stop on Friday night.  The Yanks score their only run on a fifth inning blunder as Brett Gardner scores while Pesky holds onto the ball too long.  Pesky redeems himself with a walk off two run Pesky pole shot off Mariano.  He then proceeds to celebrate by doing the riverdance wearing boxers, a Hugh Hefner robe, and WWII aviator goggles.

[shemps#1]

Officially in the Playoffs:
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim (AL West Champions)
Chicago Cubs (NL Central Champions)
Tampa Bay Rays (Clinched Playoff Berth)
Boston Red Sox (Clinched Playoff Berth)

Almost in:
Los Angeles Dodgers: Magic number 1 (a win or Diamondbacks loss) to clinch NL West

Philadelphia Phillies: Magic number 3 (combination Phillies wins and Mets losses) to clinch NL East: OR (combination Phillies wins and Brewers losses) to clinch a playoff berth

Currently:
* Milwaukee Brewers and New York Mets are tied for the NL Wild Card
* Chicago White Sox lead the AL Central by 1/2 game over Minnesota Twins

Eliminated Teams Update:

Seattle Mariners
Washington Nationals
Pittsburgh Pirates
Baltimore Orioles
Oakland Athletics
Cincinnati Reds
San Diego Padres
Kansas City Royals
Atlanta Braves
Texas Rangers
Detroit Tigers
San Francisco Giants
Colorado Rockies
Toronto Blue Jays
Cleveland Indians
St. Louis Cardinals
New York Yankees
Florida Marlins

New teams in bold

Almost Eliminated:
Arizona Diamondbacks: Elimination number 1 (a Dodgers win or a loss)
Houston Astros: Elimination number 2 (either a Mets or Brewers win and a loss)

[Darkhoarse820]

Now, that we've reached that point in the year where most teams are gone (and I'm in shock the Dodgers aren't one of them) I have to say that, out of all the available teams, the Mets and the Phillies are my picks for the East and/or the Wild Card.  But, as a Dodger fan, who do we play first?  The Mets or Phillies?  Looking at another scenario, do we play the Cubs or the Brewers?

This is, of course, if we win the division.  Never count the other team out until they are truly out.  It is possible that the Dodgers could be driving to the stadium having already clinched the division with a D'Bags loss later this afternoon but, let's not get silly.  I really want to see an onfield celebration to close out the home season.  Now, I'm not trying to be the smug winner by these comments...not by a long shot.  I said to my Wife last night that "this is what Christmas is SUPPOSED to feel like" and that it's a feeling I haven't experienced (as baseball goes) in 20 years.  I didn't find anything overly special in our victories in 1995, 1996, 2004 and 2006.  Well, the way we finished 2004 was a moment that almost equals the feeling I had in 1988 but, not quite.  My point is that I have higher expectations for this group of people who play in Los Angeles (Manny or no Manny).  Since we first held the no. 1 spot alone back on April 4th, I knew there was something there that would get us to where we are now.  Did Manny wake us up?  Yes, but not alone.  We acquired Angel Berroa and Casey Blake before him and they are the ones who really ignited the offense. 

I know all you Boston fans are probably steaming right now but, he's a Dodger (at least for now) and his mission now is to help US win.  I would have liked to have seen the Yankees in one more postseason appearance before the death of the legend that was Yankee Stadium.  I will always regret not having the chance to see a game played there.  No new stadium will make up for such a loss and I'm sorry for Yankee fans around the world who are losing such a tresure.  As Shea Stadium goes, there will hopefully be more baseball played there after its official last game of the season but, it will not be as remembered for most as the park in which the Mets played for forty five seasons.  It will be best remembered as the site of the first MAJOR rock concert.  If Yankee Stadium was "the house that Ruth built", Shea is/was "rock's golden shrine". 

Good luck to all who are still in the race and, for all who have an early spring (I'm not calling victory yet...), we'll see you next year.  Learn from your mistakes this year and repair the holes.  Some have many and some have few but, they all need to be worked on.

So far...

TAMPA BAY/BOSTON
ANAHEIM
CHICAGO WS/MINNESOTA/THE ABOVE TWO

PHILADELPHIA/NEW YORK METS
THE ABOVE TWO/MILWAUKEE
CHICAGO CUBS
DODGERS/D'BACKS (Ugh!  That name leaves a sour taste in my mouth, to spell it properly...)

Good luck to all of those undecided.

Officially in the Playoffs:
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim (AL West Champions)
Chicago Cubs (NL Central Champions)
Tampa Bay Rays (Clinched Playoff Berth)
Boston Red Sox (Clinched Playoff Berth)

Almost in:
Los Angeles Dodgers: Magic number 1 (a win or Diamondbacks loss) to clinch NL West

Philadelphia Phillies: Magic number 3 (combination Phillies wins and Mets losses) to clinch NL East: OR (combination Phillies wins and Brewers losses) to clinch a playoff berth

Currently:
* Milwaukee Brewers and New York Mets are tied for the NL Wild Card
* Chicago White Sox lead the AL Central by 1/2 game over Minnesota Twins

Eliminated Teams Update:

Seattle Mariners
Washington Nationals
Pittsburgh Pirates
Baltimore Orioles
Oakland Athletics
Cincinnati Reds
San Diego Padres
Kansas City Royals
Atlanta Braves
Texas Rangers
Detroit Tigers
San Francisco Giants
Colorado Rockies
Toronto Blue Jays
Cleveland Indians
St. Louis Cardinals
New York Yankees
Florida Marlins

New teams in bold

Almost Eliminated:
Arizona Diamondbacks: Elimination number 1 (a Dodgers win or a loss)
Houston Astros: Elimination number 2 (either a Mets or Brewers win and a loss)

[metaldams]

I know all you Boston fans are probably steaming right now

Not really.  We've played much better without him, and Jason Bay's a damn good player without the distractions.  I am glad Boston had Manny all those years, but it was time both sides moved on.

[shemps#1]

But, as a Dodger fan, who do we play first?  The Mets or Phillies?  Looking at another scenario, do we play the Cubs or the Brewers?

Here are the possible LDS scenarios: (First team has home field advantage)

AL
LAA vs the Wild Card (most likely BOS)
AL East Champ (most likely TB) vs either CWS or MIN

NL
If MIL wins the Wild Card:
CHC vs LAD
NL East Champ vs MIL

If PHI wins the NL East and NYM wins the wild card
CHC vs Wild Card
NL East Champ vs LAD

*CHC has clinched the top seed in the NL.
*The NL East Champ will be the #2 seed.
*The #1 seed cannot play the Wild Card in the LDS if they are both in the same division.

[shemps#1]

Officially in the Playoffs:
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim (AL West Champions)
Chicago Cubs (NL Central Champions)
Tampa Bay Rays (Clinched Playoff Berth)
Boston Red Sox (Clinched Playoff Berth)
LOS ANGELES DODGERS (NL WEST CHAMPIONS)

Almost in:
Philadelphia Phillies: Magic number 3 (combination Phillies wins and Mets losses) to clinch NL East: OR (combination Phillies wins and Brewers losses) to clinch a playoff berth

Currently:
* Milwaukee Brewers and New York Mets are tied for the NL Wild Card
* Minnesota Twins lead the AL Central by 1/2 game over Chicago White Sox

Eliminated Teams Update:

Seattle Mariners
Washington Nationals
Pittsburgh Pirates
Baltimore Orioles
Oakland Athletics
Cincinnati Reds
San Diego Padres
Kansas City Royals
Atlanta Braves
Texas Rangers
Detroit Tigers
San Francisco Giants
Colorado Rockies
Toronto Blue Jays
Cleveland Indians
St. Louis Cardinals
New York Yankees
Florida Marlins
ARIZONA DIAMONDBACKS

New teams in all caps

Almost Eliminated:
Houston Astros: Elimination number 1 (either a Mets or Brewers win or a loss)

[metaldams]

This MLB package is awesome.  Watched The Brewers and Mets walk-off and am now watching a tie between Chicago and Minnesota in the 9th.  Some great baseball tonight, and I'm kind of hoping for the 3 way tie in the NL.

[metaldams]

As Shea Stadium goes, there will hopefully be more baseball played there after its official last game of the season but, it will not be as remembered for most as the park in which the Mets played for forty five seasons.  It will be best remembered as the site of the first MAJOR rock concert.  If Yankee Stadium was "the house that Ruth built", Shea is/was "rock's golden shrine". 

My mother was there.

[metaldams]

Joe Nathan's a man, Bobby Jenks is a mouse.  Incredible night of baseball.

[shemps#1]

Yeah, I was flip-flopping during and after the Sox game and watched the Mets, Brewers and Twins all win walk-offs. Awesome.

[shemps#1]

Officially in the Playoffs:
Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim (AL West Champions)
Chicago Cubs (NL Central Champions)
Tampa Bay Rays (AL East Champions)
Boston Red Sox (AL Wild Card)
Los Angeles Dodgers (NL West Champions)

Almost in:
Philadelphia Phillies: Magic number 1 (Phillies win or Mets loss) to clinch NL East
Milwaukee Brewers: Magic number 2 (Brewers win and a Mets loss) to clinch NL Wild Card

Currently:
* Milwaukee Brewers lead New York Mets by 1 game for the NL Wild Card
* Minnesota Twins lead the AL Central by 1/2 game over Chicago White Sox

Eliminated Teams Update:

Seattle Mariners
Washington Nationals
Pittsburgh Pirates
Baltimore Orioles
Oakland Athletics
Cincinnati Reds
San Diego Padres
Kansas City Royals
Atlanta Braves
Texas Rangers
Detroit Tigers
San Francisco Giants
Colorado Rockies
Toronto Blue Jays
Cleveland Indians
St. Louis Cardinals
New York Yankees
Florida Marlins
Arizona Diamondbacks
HOUSTON ASTROS

New teams in all caps

Almost Eliminated:
New York Mets: Elimination number 2 (Brewers win and a Mets loss)

[metaldams]

Last night = bring out the scrubs indeed!  19 - 8........memories!

If the Mets miss the playoffs again, I predict Omar Minaya loses his job.

[Lefty]

Rumor has it that Omar Minaya just got (at least verbally) a 4-year extension.  If that holds up, all of the announcements at the new ballpark will be bilingual.  And I guarantee he'll have carte blanche to run up a huge payroll to try to buy another playoff appearance.

[metaldams]

And I guarantee he'll have carte blanche to run up a huge payroll to try to buy another playoff appearance.

In the mean time, Scott Kazmir's in the playoffs.

[shemps#1]

Last night = bring out the scrubs indeed!  19 - 8........memories!

If the Mets miss the playoffs again, I predict Omar Minaya loses his job.

Where else can a 19-8 loss conjure up GOOD memories?

[metaldams]

Where else can a 19-8 loss conjure up GOOD memories?

If Ortiz hits 12th inning walk-off tonight, I'll be really creeped out.

[JazzBill]

With most of their regulars sitting on the bench, the Cubs just finished bitch-slapping the Brewers around. Making a lot of Mets fans happy, I would presume.