Topic: When did Curly begin to slip?

[metaldams]

For me it's right about the time of Busy Buddies (1944) , where I start to see a difference in Curly. I first notice his speech to be a little slurred. then, as time goes by I notice his actions and appearance change. The 5 shorts that I find almost unbearable to watch because of Curly's ill health are. If A Body Meets A Body, Beer Barrel PoleCats, Monkey Businessmen, Three Loan Wolves and Half-Wits Holiday.

I think the first signs, appearnce wise, and only slightly, is PHONY EXPRESS, though Curly's still funny in that short.  One of the bad things about watching the shorts in order on the new set is watching Curly decline.  Vol. 4 starts out great but it gets a little depressing towards the end.  Vol. 5 won't get much better 'til Shemp joins.

[Justin T]

One of several Wikipedia entries that are not true, written by someone who was banned from this site for making a series of fictional posts (including that one), even after repeated warnings.

And for the record, there is no such book.

Thanks for pointing that out Brent, I went and deleted it from Shemp's Wiki entry.

[ArPharazon]

So, Shemp did not have a stroke at all then?  Or is only the wiki stuff about the book wrong?

[Justin T]

So, Shemp did not have a stroke at all then?  Or is only the wiki stuff about the book wrong?

Just the book, Shemp died of a heart attack

[Woe-ee-Woe-Woe80]

To me the first short where Curly seems to be starting to slip is "The Yoke's On Me", Curly doesn't seem 100% energetic in that short.

[archiezappa]

It seems that his last great performance was Micro-Phonies. If that had been his final film, he would have went out on top. At least, we wouldn't have had to see him obviously in a lot of pain.

[Woe-ee-Woe-Woe80]

It seems that his last great performance was Micro-Phonies. If that had been his final film, he would have went out on top. At least, we wouldn't have had to see him obviously in a lot of pain.

I've thought it was interesting seeing Curly in an up period for "Micro-Phonies" considering he was in a down period for two previously filmed shorts "If A Body Meets A Body" and "A Bird In The Head".

[archiezappa]

I've thought it was interesting seeing Curly in an up period for "Micro-Phonies" considering he was in a down period for two previously filmed shorts "If A Body Meets A Body" and "A Bird In The Head".

Yes. He was still having some good days at that point, but not many soon after.

[Woe-ee-Woe-Woe80]

Yes. He was still having some good days at that point, but not many soon after.

Another shorts I've thought Curly gave a good performance on was "Uncivil War Birds" and "Three Little Pirates".

[Tony Bensley]

To me the first short where Curly seems to be starting to slip is "The Yoke's On Me", Curly doesn't seem 100% energetic in that short.

Perhaps, I simply haven't viewed these shorts enough times, but not much if anything in the 1944 shorts really jumps out at me, regarding Curly noticeably slipping.  A BODY MEETS A BODY (1945) does seem an accurate starting point at which any Curly slippage first becomes obvious to casual viewers.

I was very surprised regarding one Forum member actually citing PHONY EXPRESS (1943) as a possible beginning of Curly's slippage, as it was his performance in this short that really hooked me on his unique brand of comedy!

CHEERS! 

[Tony Bensley]

Another shorts I've thought Curly gave a good performance on was "Uncivil War Birds" and "Three Little Pirates".

I agree regarding Curly's performance in both of these shorts, although his illness does seem more visually apparent in THREE LITTLE PIRATES (1946).

CHEERS! 

[archiezappa]

I also noticed in "Crash Goes The Hash" that Curly was not using the "Curly" voice. He was speaking in a lower register. He didn't appear sick at all, just not using that higher voice. Actually, in that short, Bud Jamison looks sickly.

[Tony Bensley]

I also noticed in "Crash Goes The Hash" that Curly was not using the "Curly" voice. He was speaking in a lower register. He didn't appear sick at all, just not using that higher voice. Actually, in that short, Bud Jamison looks sickly.

Well, Bud Jamison did die from Diabetic complications in September, 1944. 

[Mark The Shark]

quote from wikpedia:  " In Paul "Mousie" Garner's 1985 biography of the Three Stooges, co-written by Joan Howard Maurer, Shemp's wife Gertrude is quoted as saying that after his mild stroke in 1952, Shemp was prescribed an unknown heart medication despite never being otherwise treated for a heart problem. "

So Shemp did have a stroke, and I think they were hinting that the medication for that might have caused the heart attack.  But like you said, we'll never really know.

I remember something to that effect being mentioned by Jeffrey Forrester, evidently told to him by Babe Howard. I believe it's in "The Stooge Chronicles" book.

[Paul Pain]

Reading this makes me want to think of a different question along the same lines.  We know how Curly was: he pissed his money away as soon as it was in his hands (despite Moe's warnings) and he was a sucker for a lady, being ready for marriage after the first date.

Suppose Jerry had taken Moe's warnings and calmed down his personal life (pick a year... say 1940!).  He takes it easier with the ladies and stops being so wild.  Yeah, he still loves his dogs, but as long they don't eat up the money they're OK.  He takes better care of himself overall, even if he's basically average for the day.  Jerry Howard gets his life back to normal.

Now, given the character Curly is in the shorts, how long does a more-controlled Curly last?  Remember that Curly was already in his forties when he had all the strokes that eventually claimed his life.  The role requires a spastic manchild, and I can't see that lasting him beyond say 1952 just because of age.  What do you all think?

[Peter]

quote from wikpedia:  " In Paul "Mousie" Garner's 1985 biography of the Three Stooges, co-written by Joan Howard Maurer, Shemp's wife Gertrude is quoted as saying that after his mild stroke in 1952, Shemp was prescribed an unknown heart medication despite never being otherwise treated for a heart problem. "

So Shemp did have a stroke, and I think they were hinting that the medication for that might have caused the heart attack.  But like you said, we'll never really know.

Paul "Mousie" Garner is about as much a member of The Three Stooges as my backside. I should take anything said by him with a huge pinch of salt.

[Larrys#1]

I know many of us always dwell on Curly's stroke and like to always think to ourselves, "What if Curly's health never was an issue and stayed as a stooge?" But when you think about it, he was a stooge for 12 good years (or 13 if you count the Ted Healy shorts). After 1946, how long did the stooges stay at their peak before things declined with reused footages and reduced slapstick? I would say around 1953 is when reused footages were starting to creep up. So if Curly would have stayed, he would only have had about 6-7 years until things started to decline.

Curly started out when the stooges were at their peak... they were young, energetic and really were at their prime. Things already were headed for the decline at the late Shemp years. So while I'm just as sad as everyone that Curly had to end his career as a stooges, I'm thankful for the 12-13 years he's put in as a stooge.

[Tony Bensley]

Reading this makes me want to think of a different question along the same lines.  We know how Curly was: he pissed his money away as soon as it was in his hands (despite Moe's warnings) and he was a sucker for a lady, being ready for marriage after the first date.

Suppose Jerry had taken Moe's warnings and calmed down his personal life (pick a year... say 1940!).  He takes it easier with the ladies and stops being so wild.  Yeah, he still loves his dogs, but as long they don't eat up the money they're OK.  He takes better care of himself overall, even if he's basically average for the day.  Jerry Howard gets his life back to normal.

Now, given the character Curly is in the shorts, how long does a more-controlled Curly last?  Remember that Curly was already in his forties when he had all the strokes that eventually claimed his life.  The role requires a spastic manchild, and I can't see that lasting him beyond say 1952 just because of age.  What do you all think?

Sounds about right.

CHEERS!